16 replies to this topic

[Mad Dog Morgan]

I'm planning on coming back to the game at some point in the near future. Maybe post-Thanatos release. What mechs are well-suited currently to dishing out pain and taking a beating?

Is the Spirit Bear still reasonably strong? The Atlas?

What heavies are well-suited?

Are Hunchbacks (the originals) pretty suitable, (4SP and 4G)?

[InspectorG]

Spirit Bear is garbage afer the engine-decouple.

Atlas S is good for Brawling. 1UAC20+4ASRM6 go full Structure and Mobility in the skill tree

Marauder llC Hero is great for brawling. 2LB20+4ARMS6

Heavies?

Orions(IS and Clan)
Marauders - tankiest due to hit boxes.
Warhammers?
Summoner (5ASRM6)

IS Hunchbacks are fire support, they cant take a beating.
Clan HBK has some great variants due to high mounts and JJ.

[Mad Dog Morgan]

I wanted to see if I could take the 'phracts out of the mothball garage.

It's a good thing I've got all the mechs you mentioned, too. The Orion has needed love for forever.

Edited by Mad Dog Morgan, 01 September 2017 - 01:07 AM.

[Koniving]

InspectorG, on 31 August 2017 - 02:24 PM, said:

IS Hunchbacks are fire support, they cant take a beating.
Clan HBK has some great variants due to high mounts and JJ.

What...the same hell do you base "Can't take a beating" on?

o.O;
Closed beta beating takes... STD engine.
2013 beat 'em ups. Pure stock; STD engine.
2013 face-huggin' beaterings. XL engine.
2014 pre-quirk beatings took. STD engine.
2014 pre-quirk beat downs taken. XL engine.
2017 beat-to-snottery. XL engine.

....How... does this thing NOT take a beating?
Even without quirks, due to hitboxes, you can funnel 46 out of 48 armor to the front of the right torso and tank almost literally everything. It has the Marauder hitbox advantage on the right side so that even if you DID lose the right torso by some miracle, it still eats 60% of all damage that hits that giant box. And if that isn't enough, if you lose the LEFT torso, it eats 60% of any damage hitting it (which if you use your back left to soak up the fire... it soaks up almost everything with that drum... so yeah this thing has the Marauder/Stalker/Thunderbolt hitbox advantage)... That's without the quirks that give it the armor of a 60 ton mech for only 50 tons...

Its total armor surpasses that of the Shadow Hawk....which I don't know why people call that thing tanky.

As someone with what was it.. lets see... 4P, 4H, 4J, 4SP, Grid Iron, 4G, 4G Founders, 4P(S)... 8 IS Hunchbacks... I find it completely unfathomable that you would consider the tankiest medium in the entire game...to not be able to take a beating.

Now a Clan Hunchback would be a different story.... that thing's made of like...burnt paper.

[Koniving]

There's even this, the 13 minute base defense...

in which a teammate shoots me in the back and finds a hole in the Hunchback's hitbox that we repeatedly create out of curiousity, which to this day STILL has not been fixed... so it even has THAT going for it... and yet you say it can't take a beating?!

What...How... This is the most recommended new player mech for almost five years running... in what way, shape, or form... can you manage to misuse it to the point that it couldn't take a beating? What did you do to it?

[Koniving]

Mad Dog Morgan, on 31 August 2017 - 02:25 PM, said:

I wanted to see if I could take the 'phracts out of the mothball garage.

It's a good thing I've got all the mechs you mentioned, too. The Orion has needed love for forever.

Orion had been pretty good so long as you built it as if you were building an Atlas... it's now just tanky as heck.

----------

You can take the Phract out. It still has the same hitbox issue (which I mention on the latest pre-order page along with some feedback on the new mech advertised), but that basically means you can pack any engine you want in there knowing you'll die by CT since it is quite literally as wide as an Awesome's CT hitbox from beta.

.....I'm deadly serious. Of course it was just as big back then, and it became the biggest meta mech for almost two years... of course back then hit registration wasn't so good and a number of other things went for it including poptarting...

[InspectorG]

Koniving, on 02 September 2017 - 05:01 PM, said:

What...the same hell do you base "Can't take a beating" on?

o.O;
Closed beta beating takes... STD engine.
2013 beat 'em ups. Pure stock; STD engine.
2013 face-huggin' beaterings. XL engine.
2014 pre-quirk beatings took. STD engine.
2014 pre-quirk beat downs taken. XL engine.
2017 beat-to-snottery. XL engine.

....How... does this thing NOT take a beating?
Even without quirks, due to hitboxes, you can funnel 46 out of 48 armor to the front of the right torso and tank almost literally everything. It has the Marauder hitbox advantage on the right side so that even if you DID lose the right torso by some miracle, it still eats 60% of all damage that hits that giant box. And if that isn't enough, if you lose the LEFT torso, it eats 60% of any damage hitting it (which if you use your back left to soak up the fire... it soaks up almost everything with that drum... so yeah this thing has the Marauder/Stalker/Thunderbolt hitbox advantage)... That's without the quirks that give it the armor of a 60 ton mech for only 50 tons...

Its total armor surpasses that of the Shadow Hawk....which I don't know why people call that thing tanky.

As someone with what was it.. lets see... 4P, 4H, 4J, 4SP, Grid Iron, 4G, 4G Founders, 4P(S)... 8 IS Hunchbacks... I find it completely unfathomable that you would consider the tankiest medium in the entire game...to not be able to take a beating.

Now a Clan Hunchback would be a different story.... that thing's made of like...burnt paper.

How does it not?

Well, new tech may have breathed some new life into the HBK but you didnt see many pre-new tech.

IS-HBK is simple - remove the hunch, then target something else that can hurt you.

it got those quirks because it cant twist damage away from the hunch vs anyone with a steady aim.

HBK-llC are less tanky BUT can last longer by exposing themselves less due to more/higher hardpoints and JJ. ERPPC jump snipe, 3UAC5.

Verdict is still out on new tech but i dont see/hear too many high level players raving about the IS HBK.

Old HBK-SP could brawl like mad but its quirks were reduced. people still using them in Scouting?

[Steel Raven]

There are a couple of nasty CQC Warhammer builds including the 2X AC/20 and the 2X SNPPC, AC/20

SRM Splatapults are still fun as hell.

As for the Hunchback, try it with a Ultra 10. Frees up some weight without loosing much firepower, gains a nice rate of fire with some range.

[Koniving]

InspectorG, on 02 September 2017 - 05:38 PM, said:

How does it not?

Well, new tech may have breathed some new life into the HBK but you didnt see many pre-new tech.

IS-HBK is simple - remove the hunch, then target something else that can hurt you.

it got those quirks because it cant twist damage away from the hunch vs anyone with a steady aim.

Verdict is still out on new tech but i dont see/hear too many high level players raving about the IS HBK.

Old HBK-SP could brawl like mad but its quirks were reduced. people still using them in Scouting?

Notice every single video is dated before the new tech. And almost all of them are BEFORE quirks.

In the one video, I show that it can twist almost 190 degrees. You can easily twist it away, but why would you?
It has more armor than a 70 ton mech's center torso. If you want to kill a Hunchback, the RT is NOT the way to go. There's the giant head, there's the confused hitbox on the left torso (wanna kill an XL Hunch quick, shoot the left torso drum, its front side is REAR torso, and it is not quirked).

To think you even have success in destroying them as the right torso is somewhat baffling. The difficulty -- in terms of damage -- is the same as trying to kill a Timber Wolf by CT.

My Hunchbacks (short of the 4SP) have 100 hitpoints on the right torso allocated to the front (of 102 total).
The left torso has only 40 hitpoints dedicated to the front, due to the discovery of the weakness in the drum (with the remaining armor going to left torso rear, as demonstrated in the beating I took from point blank Jager where I throw my back at him and let the drum soak up damage).
The CT has 88 hitpoints to the front and 8 armor to the rear.

No matter what layout that may be given, it's easier to kill a Hunch by CT than wasting your time on the RT.

But that's the mistake so many people make... And why it lives so damn long.

You might be spamming some hefty firepower to think it won't live long, or fighting it at some range. But try that against a well built Hunchback.

(May also notice in the non-XL pre-quirk videos, after losing the Hunch I go on to keep killing and brawling and survive.)

Edited by Koniving, 03 September 2017 - 06:28 AM.

[Athom83]

The Cyclops A-DC is a really strong Brawler using SRM22a (3 SRM6a with 1 SRM4a), paired with either 2 LB-10s, a UAC/20, or 2 UAC/5s. This is the first mech I could reliably pull games over 1k damage.

Lately, I'm really liking the Highlander again and upgrading the tried and true brawling 733C build with some newtech is quite glorious. Others would probably pull the JJs and add some more ammo and upgrade those lasers to MPLs, but to each their own. http://mwo.smurfy-ne...34b84dea4d4f4db

[The Basilisk]

Mad Dog Morgan, on 31 August 2017 - 01:43 PM, said:

I'm planning on coming back to the game at some point in the near future. Maybe post-Thanatos release. What mechs are well-suited currently to dishing out pain and taking a beating?

Is the Spirit Bear still reasonably strong? The Atlas?

What heavies are well-suited?

Are Hunchbacks (the originals) pretty suitable, (4SP and 4G)?

The KDK-SB has only one advantage left.
Clan tech. Big XLReactor and Weapons that is.
Otherwise its just to big and too slow and it lacks the armor quirks of Annihilator or Atlas.
The Atlas is still quite sturdy but also suffers still from its hardpoints or better their locations and numbers.

The bestperforming Heavies are laservomit versions of Hellbringer and Ebonjag...but since you ask for brawling...well its your pain.
You could use the Phracts ...sure. They got hardcore quirks on frontarmor, the light engines also help a lot.
But honestly no ammount of quirking saves those barndoors from getting ripped to shreds before they reached a suitable position to fire their loooooooow guns.
The Roughnecks are decent brawlers, Warhammers are pretty solid choices, Orion is still crap...not as bad as before skilltree and new tech but again no ammount of quirking can elevate a completely dumb hardpoint and hitbox design to the same level as other mechs that start of decent and get better with the tree and the new tech.

The strength of the hunchback is that it has no big flaws and a great variability of hardpoints as well as decent placed hardpoints. Its still a quite okish mech for beginners to learn the ropes.

Otherwise...the top mechs atm are either long/midrange dakka or Clan Laser vomit mechs.
Long/midrange PPFLD is also still strong. (2Gauss 3 LPLs Anni, Gauss and ERLL MAD IIC-D, Gauss and Lasers MADCAT)
Brawling still functions but if anything it has gotten even more situational since most brawling weapons are also spreadfire weapons (SRM and LBX) and are therefore hurt by the higher averange hitpoints of all mechs. A PPFLD shooter does not feel this that much since 10% more or less hitpoints on a single zone does not make that big a difference.

Also be aware of the armor or structure skillpoints discussion.
3 Questions to be answered by yourself to make that decission:
-- Do you have armor or struckture quirks on that chassis (quirks are counted pre skillpoint calculation)
-- What gives you more hitpoints for the used skillpoints.
-- Do you need to protect lots of large equipment in your mech from crits (structure points are half as max armor on that zone and do not protect your weapons and ammo from crits)

[JC Daxion]

Mad Dog Morgan, on 31 August 2017 - 01:43 PM, said:

I'm planning on coming back to the game at some point in the near future. Maybe post-Thanatos release. What mechs are well-suited currently to dishing out pain and taking a beating?

Is the Spirit Bear still reasonably strong? The Atlas?

What heavies are well-suited?

Are Hunchbacks (the originals) pretty suitable, (4SP and 4G)?

Dude, the HBK 4G is rocking! Run the STD250 and ac20 as before with 3 tons. Then drop in 2 Light machine guns+1 ton, and 3 ERSL's. It wreaks havok. Runs about 85KPH, i have hillclimb, 360 targeting with some info gathering, 6 points in aux for artilitary strikes, laser duration nodes, and the ammo booster nodes, (obviously all the ones to get there, half the movement tree, and then half the armor


Another mech that is a ton of fun is the enforcer 4P, UAC20+4 ERSL, and an XL-285 and some heatsinks. almost 100KPH, most of armor, and a good amount in weapons as above. 6 points in AUX, with a bit more in sensors for some radar dep and sesmic.


Both mechs are tons of fun and great to brawl in these days.

[Asym]

Ha !

Ton for ton, the Urban Mech is the brawling leader and almost impossible to kill !

(Danger: humor alert..............)

[Wildstreak]

Before I had to stop playing, I was actually feeling useful in QP with the Mawesome-8T. Sure it does not kill well but the high damage while pushing and tanking on the arms was so much fun. 8V can do the same build, just both Missile Launchers are in one spot and the 8T can actually peek a few ridges with those MRMs.
Pretty Baby has its own oddball version.
I was gonna tinker around with 8R versions that can also ridge peek but now cannot.
Just feeling useful in an Awesome is worth it.

[Husker Dude]

Victors also benefited from the more recent quirk changes, the armor quirks are very generous and if you're brawling the low arms/weapon mounts aren't as much of a hindrance.

[Athom83]

Husker Dude, on 07 September 2017 - 11:10 AM, said:

Victors also benefited from the more recent quirk changes, the armor quirks are very generous and if you're brawling the low arms/weapon mounts aren't as much of a hindrance.

And they're slowly coming back. Just had a match earlier with 1 Victor and 2 Highlanders! Admittedly, one of those was me .

[dfshjdgf]

Mad Dog Morgan, on 31 August 2017 - 01:43 PM, said:

Are Hunchbacks (the originals) pretty suitable, (4SP and 4G)?

I have a hunchback with 2 SSRM6, 4 ER small lasers and a tag and it's working pretty well for me so far. I wish I could switch to medium lasers, but there's just no way to do it without really bad heat problems.