19 replies to this topic

[Mole]

Now I'm basically locked out of FP for 7 days unless I just like losing.

Seriously, why does IS suck so bad in FP? And don't come in here and try to tell me "clan tech OP", I don't buy that.

[ccrider]

Jump into teamspeak and join a group. Pugging IS sucks but we have a winning record and are IS most of the time. rodcbr1.teamspeak3.com. You are welcome to drop with us.

[Mole]

ccrider, on 08 September 2017 - 02:32 PM, said:

Jump into teamspeak and join a group. Pugging IS sucks but we have a winning record and are IS most of the time. rodcbr1.teamspeak3.com. You are welcome to drop with us.

Normally my life is too busy these days for me to spend much time group dropping but I just happen to be sheltered in place for four or more days due to Hurricane Irma so I think I'll come get some drops in with you guys.

[Commander A9]

Did you read the contract before signing it?

[Spheroid]

FRR TeamSpeak is also good for grouping. Nobody would care if you are Marik.

[ccrider]

Mole, on 08 September 2017 - 02:39 PM, said:

Normally my life is too busy these days for me to spend much time group dropping but I just happen to be sheltered in place for four or more days due to Hurricane Irma so I think I'll come get some drops in with you guys.

you are more than welcome to drop with us. We add anyone willing to jump into TS to our groups, so no worries about time constraints. Stay safe during the hurricane and if you get the chance, we are always around.

[Mole]

Well you know, grouping is all well and good but it still doesn't answer the question of why it is that I can PUG and win on clan side but can;t PUG and win on IS side.

[MischiefSC]

Because while in skilled groups the tech difference between IS and Clan is very narrow, for pugs it's a lot bigger. Clan XL, higher alpha and better cooling is just a lot more forgiving. The IS advantages of shorter burn on lasers/fewer projectiles on ballistics and armor/structure quirks are only useful if you're accurate to begin with and can twist to actually maximize the quirks. +5 CT armor/structure is meaningless against a guy with a 20pt higher alpha than you, even if his weapon burn time is 0.3s longer if you're not twisting to spread damage over 3 locations, so you're seeing the benefit of the +5 to CT/LT/RT.

IS XLs are a deathtrap for bad pugs.

Mobility is another big one. Speed decides who gets to position first. Being out of position and staying out of position gets people killed quickly and Clan mechs are pretty much all faster, so you're in position faster and out of position for a shorter time.

Good teams can maximize the IS tonnage advantage to make up for a lot of that, capitalize on shorter needed exposure times to put their shots down range and know what positions are good that you can get into when you're moving slower than your enemy.

IS pugs are no worse than Clan pugs. Just that when both sides are full of bad players the difference in tech is a bigger slice of the overall 'value pie' that each player represents.

Drop with a group in the IS. It's a much better experience. CBR1 are good people.

[Marquis De Lafayette]

Mole, on 08 September 2017 - 04:08 PM, said:

Well you know, grouping is all well and good but it still doesn't answer the question of why it is that I can PUG and win on clan side but can;t PUG and win on IS side.

r

Mischief gave a lot of good reasons. I will just add there are some systemic reasons with the game to why it's harder to Pug on the IS side when the active population is stacked Clanside. The main one is you are likely to drop with "randoms" (maybe you get a 3 man if you are lucky) and are more likely to be matched up against a 10-12 man unit (or mixed tag group on TS). Part of the reason for this is 12 mans move the the front of the line (queue) and will jump smaller groups that have been trying to add up to 12, but haven't yet. This is known by the community. Therefore, (especially when wait times are an issue) units often do try to get a full 12 man.

Again, if 12 mans get more drops (on average...due to faster queue times....as they jump solo Clanners ) you would be more likely to face more of them...and would thus see less equivalent "skittles" groups against your "skittles" team. Facing a 12 man with random skittles is most often going to be rough...just is reality.

I have been pugging with only a couple of unit members this week and yes it's tougher IS side to PUG right now...the w/l suffers, but hey we got quick matches against some guys we normally fight with or just never get to fight...so it's all good if you can just accept the reality of pugging IS side. Otherwise just group up and get a bigger team together.

[Djinnhammer]

MischiefSC, on 08 September 2017 - 04:29 PM, said:

Because while in skilled groups the tech difference between IS and Clan is very narrow, for pugs it's a lot bigger. Clan XL, higher alpha and better cooling is just a lot more forgiving. The IS advantages of shorter burn on lasers/fewer projectiles on ballistics and armor/structure quirks are only useful if you're accurate to begin with and can twist to actually maximize the quirks. +5 CT armor/structure is meaningless against a guy with a 20pt higher alpha than you, even if his weapon burn time is 0.3s longer if you're not twisting to spread damage over 3 locations, so you're seeing the benefit of the +5 to CT/LT/RT.

IS XLs are a deathtrap for bad pugs.

Mobility is another big one. Speed decides who gets to position first. Being out of position and staying out of position gets people killed quickly and Clan mechs are pretty much all faster, so you're in position faster and out of position for a shorter time.

Good teams can maximize the IS tonnage advantage to make up for a lot of that, capitalize on shorter needed exposure times to put their shots down range and know what positions are good that you can get into when you're moving slower than your enemy.

IS pugs are no worse than Clan pugs. Just that when both sides are full of bad players the difference in tech is a bigger slice of the overall 'value pie' that each player represents.

Drop with a group in the IS. It's a much better experience. CBR1 are good people.

Just to add to this concise post, I've played on both sides and IS pugs are FAR and away less inclined to speak or work together.
I've never been stomp as hard as when a tooled up, co-ordinated Is team roll into view. Coupled with comms and aggression, the sheer mass and quirks can overwhelm you. Pugs however especially Is side, tend to lack the comms, the tactics and the courage to push clanners like they need to.

[Xaat Xuun]

My guess, . . IS mechs are cheaper to start with, so many new players enter into Faction, without any experience

[Rick T Dangerous]

Mole, on 08 September 2017 - 02:27 PM, said:

Now I'm basically locked out of FP for 7 days unless I just like losing.

Seriously, why does IS suck so bad in FP? And don't come in here and try to tell me "clan tech OP", I don't buy that.

Had many drops with clan PUGs that worked together despite low to none communication. Seen a video recently from OldBob10025 about his FW pugging experience that matched some of the horrors that I've seen on IS side: They shoot the gates, not the gate control, they behave like it's QP, there is no recognizable ammount of team play. And when they see a majority of matching unit tags on the red team, they run like scared chicken. Claners most often fight together and at least try to win.

Dropping in 12 man groups on IS side certainly makes things easier. The combination of teamwork, quirks and tonnage advantage makes it extremely hard for clan teams to win a match against a full 12 man IS team. The tonnage advantage does however not help the unexperienced players, quite the opposite: they have more mechs that are sluggish and easy prey for fast clan mediums and lights. And the additional tons don't tell them what a generator looks like (and how to destroy it) or that in FW domination or conquest using QP tactics is fatal.

I've had an intersting experience: yesterday we fought some dudes that were just kicking our hip motivators. Today they fought on the clan side and I thought "oh, that's gonna be good" when I saw them in my team. Well, we got our hip motivators handed to us. They couldn't get the clan tech to work. They went for a brawl...

[TWIAFU]

Mole, on 08 September 2017 - 04:08 PM, said:

Well you know, grouping is all well and good but it still doesn't answer the question of why it is that I can PUG and win on clan side but can;t PUG and win on IS side.

Pilot skill and tech differences, both pilots being equal, Clan will win in majority of battles.

Easier to win with Clan, as you see and posted.

Add that in with IS pilot think they can play peek a boo with Clans and win, you have Clans winning.

So, wait seven days and go back to Clans and the easier button they provide.

[LordNothing]

is is playable, clan is playable, both give better rewards than qp does. play more fp.

[Fake News]

http://www.annarivas...ll-evil-amulet/

[Sunstruck]

House Marik does have a Teamspeak and has been doing some faction groups recently.
http://housemarik.enjin.com/

And contrary to popular belief, we can actually win FP matches (if theres enough space bacon involved).

Edited by Sunstruck, 15 September 2017 - 02:47 AM.

[Cabanaboy]

I'll try to join up on this tonight, and my contract even aligns with it nicely

[mouser42]

Commander A9, on 08 September 2017 - 03:42 PM, said:

Did you read the contract before signing it?

reading is op surprise it has not been nerf for balance

[Helsbane]

IS side loses because they have guys that drop LRM decks or trials, then proceed to do 87 points of damage with four tries. XL Stalkers, 'Support' Atlas, 4xERPPC 'sniper' K2s that melt after one shot, LRMs without target retention of any kind, UAC10 lights that can't break 100kph... And those were just over the last few days. This is why IS sucks. There is no bar set for participation. No 'you must be at least this tall to ride this ride' at the door. Just hop in your LRM Oxide and support that team (provided they get you locks of course).

[MischiefSC]

Bads gonna bad.