76 replies to this topic

[gooddragon1]

I just want to kill things. I don't want to think about tactics, flanking, nascar, chokepoints, and such (the comic was interesting to read, but I'm not that competitive). As per previous statement: I'm just not that competitive. I'd just like to stick in the back of the stack and fire lasers at enemies.

Is this ruining the match for others? (Quickplay anyways of course)

Also: Such laser, very skirmish, wow.

Edited by gooddragon1, 07 October 2017 - 10:21 AM.

[MischiefSC]

Pretty much. You're dropping the whole teams odds of winning. Having you on their team is a disadvantage to your teammates.

How you feel about that is up to you. There's no way to play the game without being on a team until Solaris comes out, when you can do 1 v 1 - at which point the people who've spent the time to understand strategies, positioning and tactics without using their teammates as armor will farm you every match.

People who play to the teams success will, on average, win more often.

[Nightbird]

Unless you do those things, you won't be effective at killing things. You'll either go in too early, and get rolled, or go in last, and get rolled.

[Lord0fHats]

Most teams are so incapable with positioning, flanking, and withstanding fire that most of the time teams are useless for any tactic more complex that "see enemy shoot enemy." That said, if you're dealing damage you are helping your team. Just don't confuse hiding in the back and shooting an alpha every fifteen seconds as "dealing damage." You should endeavor to shoot as much as you can, don't be afraid of taking return fire, and getting on the side or guarding a choke point with someone else can help you maximize your output.

And of course teams will often pursue brain dead strategies bound to fail because some random person said they should, or they foolishly chased their own lights around the map, or something. In those situations you're just gonna have to gamble if sticking with the team or deciding they're already dead is going to be more helpful.

As a general rule of thumb, ignore complaining from anyone. Teams lose matches in MWO for random reasons, and it'll almost never be because you lived dealt damage while they went off to die like lemmings. Sticking together just to die together is a rotten idea of team play, but it often feels like the only idea many players have.

[Bombast]

'Ruining the match' may be a bit much, but generally, people who's main concern is staying as far back as possible and pecking at the enemy are people who are throwing a match. They're also generally people who don't get many kills.

Which isn't to say people YOLOing across the map are game winning champions, of course. Neither group is particularly helpful.

If someone does this in FP, they are most definitely ruining a match for people. Those games are way too long to accommodate this kind of nonsense.

I see you're a new player though. I suggest looking into 'tactics' - I honestly doubt your going to be able to maintain any enthusiasm for this game if you just want to cower in the back and shoot things at max range. If that really is your jam, perhaps try out the Star Wars Battlefront II beta that's going on - probably more your speed.

[DAYLEET]

gooddragon1, on 07 October 2017 - 10:21 AM, said:

I just want to kill things. I don't want to think about tactics, flanking, nascar, chokepoints, and such (the comic was interesting to read, but I'm not that competitive). As per previous statement: I'm just not that competitive. I'd just like to stick in the back of the stack and fire lasers at enemies.

Is this ruining the match for others? (Quickplay anyways of course)

Also: Such laser, very skirmish, wow.

In QP there isnt any rules but this is a game where 12 guys are trying to kill 12 other guys and you have to work toward that goal with your team. The most "your own thing" you're allowed to do is to pilot a light or very fast med and learn to read the fight on the map. You move accordingly trying to be an asset on the sides rather than be anchored to the murderball. Lights(and some meds) will do "their own things" thats what they are for, either quick cap or troll cap or kill_secure_diving or being a general nuisance with the intent of backstabbing or splitting the enemy.

It just dont make sense to play as if this was a solo game. Armor sharing is as important as damage dealing so the bigger you are the more important it is that you are at the front. The team who can most effectively distribute damage taken will be the one that takes the first kills and this is when you start winning.

Edited by DAYLEET, 07 October 2017 - 11:23 AM.

[MechaBattler]

I play like the enemy are Clans, my teammates are all Davions, and I'm the only Liao. So I have to keep on eye on my team as much on my enemy. It IS every man for himself. But it's also about how you can use your team to your advantage. If I'm on the left flank and I see the push. I'm out, the guy next to me is probably screwed. But I'm not being selfish, I'm trying preserve our fighting strength. It's all about local superiority, if they have it, don't be there. And if your teammate wants to be 'heroic' and stand in their way. They're screwing the team even more.

Edit: With that said. i haven't been playing much last few months D:

Edited by MechaBattler, 07 October 2017 - 11:25 AM.

[Trissila]

Is it wrong? Yep.

But hey, everyone else is doing it, so why shouldn't you join them?

[Asym]

Play your game and the heck with the rest of them. They are the same people who will say "rush now" and then, you'll hear them laughing at you as you're being slaughtered....

Teamwork is a design concept MWO used in their literature, that in reality, only actually exists in upper level teams who have collective dreams of e-Sports greatness.... And since faction play is just about dead, there really isn't a strategic gameplay need for teams anyway. Even when a event or when we have a yearly playoff, there are "pick up" teams because there aren't enough full time participating teams.

For the other say 95% of MWO: have fun and ignore everybody who finds fault and when you find friends, play with them...

Edited by Asym, 07 October 2017 - 01:27 PM.

[Jay Leon Hart]

As a general rule, I have 2 kinds of matches.

Type #1 where I'm aggressive and try to push the enemy, die early, but my team wins. +W/L, -AMS, -K/D

Type #2 where I hang back, let my team engage first, fight what remains, then lose. -W/L, +AMS, +K/D

I can help my team or I can help myself, rarely do the two go together.

[MischiefSC]

Don't push ahead. Try to stay in the middle of the pack. Try to help keep your team on the move - whenever possible you want to moving toward the other teams flank to help position 12 of you vs <12 enemies. You need to be drawing fire - even if you're not getting hit and just peeking. The enemy needs to spend heat/ammo/time/weapon recycle on you like it does your teammates or you're going to end up on the wrong side of a roll. Always be shooting, always. You should always be red line on heat unless you're about to push or receive a push. The game you should be playing with yourself is "can I bump just into overheat override without taking damage every time I shoot".

Aggression wins matches. That doesn't mean just hold down the W key and walk in to the enemy (unless you're KCom, then W key is WIN key) but it does mean keep moving toward them, flanking, shooting and pressuring them. The team that camps one spot surrenders control of the figjt to the other team. If you're not a comp 8man playing a specific map strat you dont hold one spot.

Play aggro but not stupid.

[DAYLEET]

MechaBattler, on 07 October 2017 - 11:24 AM, said:

If I'm on the left flank and I see the push. I'm out, the guy next to me is probably screwed. But I'm not being selfish, I'm trying preserve our fighting strength.

You have to call it in chat or voip, thats the difference between playing badly or part of a team. I did that yesterday, i was positioned to see 2 lance were about to get on me and two other guy. I call that we needed to get out of there now and then moved away. But i stopped near my exit route to shoot some as one other escaped while one stayed there. I went to another exit so i could shoot some more and then got out. One died but two lived. **** happens but you have to try.

[Escef]

I don't know if I'd say it's wrong, but it definitely isn't productive. Though, I will also say that if I'm in something fast I'll usually go for a wide flank and try to hit the enemy team's rear. I'm not a patient person, and I tend to be really aggressive; I don't mesh well with the timidity often seen in the solo queue, so this tactic keeps me out of trouble for a bit, and lets me contribute meaningfully to the fight, if only as a diversion.

[MischiefSC]

Jay Leon Hart, on 07 October 2017 - 01:23 PM, said:

As a general rule, I have 2 kinds of matches.

Type #1 where I'm aggressive and try to push the enemy, die early, but my team wins. +W/L, -AMS, -K/D

Type #2 where I hang back, let my team engage first, fight what remains, then lose. -W/L, +AMS, +K/D

I can help my team or I can help myself, rarely do the two go together.

You get aggro early and try to cripple 2 or 3 mechs, either legged or 1 shot from death. Then just tuck in and wait for your team to push in to steal the kills. Follow, stay safe and try to help finish up. Usually a good balance. It's worked well for me this month.

[Jay Leon Hart]

MischiefSC, on 07 October 2017 - 01:32 PM, said:

You get aggro early and try to cripple 2 or 3 mechs, either legged or 1 shot from death. Then just tuck in and wait for your team to push in to steal the kills. Follow, stay safe and try to help finish up. Usually a good balance. It's worked well for me this month.

My main issue is I suffer from Scrapperlock, so once I engage the enemy my situational awareness bleeds away.

[Champion of Khorne Lord of Blood]

PUG life demands an every man for himself type of play usually. As long as you do well enough to win the match then you are doing fine playing for yourself. If you're losing matches consistently by not pulling your weight by getting at least one kill then you just need to get a bit better at what you're doing.

If you're sitting too far back and not in your optimal range just grazing people in an assault mech or something then you're likely to be blamed for throwing the match. If you're poking at optimal range racking up over 500 damage and a couple kills then no one's going to pin the cause of defeat on you, you did twice the work you needed to.

[MischiefSC]

Winning isn't just about doing damage but drawing damage away from your teammates. Doing that while doing more damage than you receive is a skill but a critical one.

[Champion of Khorne Lord of Blood]

MischiefSC, on 07 October 2017 - 01:55 PM, said:

Winning isn't just about doing damage but drawing damage away from your teammates. Doing that while doing more damage than you receive is a skill but a critical one.

Way I see it, shooting an enemy up so badly that they hide more instead of peek more and killing enemies so they can't peek anymore sure does save teammates from a lot on incoming damage. Rocks can draw the damage, people need to learn to poke better instead of asking others to take damage for their mistakes.

[Eirik Eriksson]

This: "The enemy needs to spend heat/ammo/time/weapon recycle on you" - supplied by MischiefSC. Add to this contiously. Only time in games that I tend to get in stress is when I dont have anything to shoot at, cause it will in most cases mean that I made a wrong move and that I am out of position. And this is just happening too often to me nowadays.

[Cloves]

Aggression wins matches, passivity losses. There is a balance between berserker and coward however. Try to stay with your team and add to their fire unless they are just too passive, at which you are going to lose anyway, so you might as well try and go for a push. if you are alone against a deathball, you will die and that will happen if you Rambo out first or hide till last dead, so try and reduce the enemy at every opportunity. Check your personal W/L, if it's positive, you are on the right track, negative, you need to work on your team skills.