53 replies to this topic

[Mcgral18]

The earlier numbers I released were missing 8 games, as it turned out...but the percentages barely budged, so no harm done.

Instead of 71 Spheroid mechs, there were actually 113
And, instead of over 15% Sphere pick rate...it was only 14.7%

Here's a list of all mechs used in the Semi Finals


I was almost surprised to see the Summoner SO dominant as a Heavy.
H2C, less surprised, but he's since been nerfed on the Live servers already.



Specific to Light mechs...I'm surprised there's so few chassis


FOUR
Only four. Lynx and Cheetah have both since been buffed, so that representation would change, but there's so few viable Light mechs, and it shows. Wolfhound held aloft by Quirks, and the Cheetah being all around useful.


Medium wise...a single Sphere chassis was found (also held by quirks)


Coming in second after the H2C-A, and more as a Light mech than a Medium
This absolute domination by the H2C would not be the same, under the current state of the game, IMO. The agility took a solid hit on it, but it would still be a solid pick. Just...not 2/3s of All mediums




Heavy wise, a single Sphere chassis as well. Taken 4 times.
...yeah


Assault class was dominated by Laser Vomit, with the SuperNova and Mad 2C being over half of all Assaults



The most diversity overall, if it's any consolation.


Typical team composition was 6 Clan and 2 Sphere mechs, but it went as high as 4C 4 S, and as low as all 8 Clam



I'm honestly astonished at the low Sphere pick rate. I hadn't realized balance got that bad.
Under 15%...and half that being a Light mech

Under 8% of the mechs were non-Light Sphere
That's just terrible. I'm not sure things would change much in the live game either

Lynx and Cheetah are still strong (and not reliant on Medium Lasers come Tuesday...RIP Sphere Lights)

Bushy has some brawl potential with quirks, but few things mid ranged

Heavies...Clam all day er day

Assault wise, the magical Mad Cat Mk2 makes the Clams reign supreme...but maybe a token Anni, if the armor adjustments are too much; or the Atlas if his agility is restored in entirety (for a brawl deck)



I just think those numbers are telling, anyhow. The "Highest Skill Tournament in Esports" almost entirely avoiding a faction...

[El Bandito]

Mcgral18, on 14 October 2017 - 04:51 AM, said:

I just think those numbers are telling, anyhow. The "Highest Skill Tournament in Esports" almost entirely avoiding a faction...

Exactly. I am surprised that there are still ignoramuses in the forums and in game, saying IS is fine compared to Clan. SMH...

Cheetahs were picked far more than Wolfhounds (despite Wolhounds' quirks) than I imagined, surprisingly.

Edited by El Bandito, 14 October 2017 - 05:01 AM.

[Papaspud]

Mcgral18, on 14 October 2017 - 04:51 AM, said:

I just think those numbers are telling, anyhow. The "Highest Skill Tournament in Esports" almost entirely avoiding a faction...

Seems like everybody is playing clans now, and with the new nerfs to IS lights and grasshoppers they will disappear too.... all right PGI- has it the way they want it all clans all the time... well done PGI, well done!!!! When are you setting up the clan vs clan FP, because no one will be playing IS after this patch........ other than us stupid loyalist who are chumped at every turn.

[Mcgral18]

I guess I might as well make this too

[Bud Crue]

Great breakdown. Graphs really help make the point.

So we should expect the Assassin and Wolfhound nerfs next month? Wait...the Assassins weren't running artemis were they?

[Pika]

I totally 100% disagree with some of your ideas of balance, McGral, and I also think there is _way_ more to this than just "This 'Mech is better than that 'Mech" but thank you for putting some hard statistics in an easily readable format.

I have to say I'm pretty surprised to see the Summoner used so much, considering I never actually see it in game - what is so different about the tournament setting that makes this 'Mech so good and not in the 'regular' game? Also all the top end 'Mechs used here are the ones who can boat silly numbers of laser weapons. Might have something to do with today's patch perhaps?

[Papaspud]

Mcgral18, on 14 October 2017 - 05:00 AM, said:

I guess I might as well make this too

And when you realize that most of those Is MECHS WERE WOLFHOUNDS THAT JUST TOOK A SERIOUS HIT, WELL IF THERE IS A NEXT YEAR... YOU WON'T SEE THOSE AGAIN.

[ocular tb]

I don't typically pay much attention to the comp side of things but do like to see these kind of break-downs as it makes a good point. It seems pretty noticeable to me when I get in a Clan mech how much more powerful they feel compared to an IS mech despite whatever drawbacks they might have to try and balance them. If they weren't better they wouldn't be so well represented at the highest levels.

And also I second the commendation on the use of graphs to easily show the disparity. Good stuff.

[Snazzy Dragon]

No one in their right mind would look at this and turn around and release a patch like the upcoming one.

[El Bandito]

Pika, on 14 October 2017 - 05:03 AM, said:

I have to say I'm pretty surprised to see the Summoner used so much, considering I never actually see it in game - what is so different about the tournament setting that makes this 'Mech so good and not in the 'regular' game?

Summoner is used for its high mounted CERPPCs + JJs. It is also used in FP by good Clan teams, as the mode and player skill make it shine. Basically, it is not that of average QP puggers' mech, but is very very effective for its role as poptart sniper.

Pika, on 14 October 2017 - 05:03 AM, said:

Also all the top end 'Mechs used here are the ones who can boat silly numbers of laser weapons. Might have something to do with today's patch perhaps?

Overwhelming amount of those energy mechs in MWOWC used CERLLs, which was not nerfed in the patch. As for nerfs to other lasers, IS got nerfed harder than Clans, according to my thread here. https://mwomercs.com...ore-than-clans/

Edited by El Bandito, 14 October 2017 - 05:16 AM.

[Asym]

And we wonder why e-Sports won't work in MWO? Because MWO itself, at its core isn't working.....
If it were, these statistics would be in some way balanced.... Ouch PGI, there's that bad word.....
So, if the championship is a testament to the game itself, the defacto MWO spokesman, what is this saying PGI? All of your balancing passes, nerfs, quirk reduction and skill tree hidden systemic changes are doing what exactly????
So, the data doesn't show any balance at all........if that is a statistical truth, what is the conclussion????


OP, great effort and thanks.

[Pika]

El Bandito, on 14 October 2017 - 05:14 AM, said:

Summoner is used for its high mounted CERPPCs + JJs. It is also used in FP by good Clan teams, as the mode and player skill make it shine. Basically, it is not that of average QP puggers' mech, but is very very effective for its role as poptart sniper.




Overwhelming amount of those energy mechs in MWOWC used CERLLs, which was not nerfed in the patch. As for nerfs to other lasers, IS got nerfed harder than Clans, according to my thread here. https://mwomercs.com...ore-than-clans/

Ahh right-oh~

Can't say I followed this tournament. I only really care about the final at MCon.

[Mcgral18]

Snazzy Dragon, on 14 October 2017 - 05:14 AM, said:

No one in their right mind would look at this and turn around and release a patch like the upcoming one.

It is strange how they've kept it going on for years.


Time will tell if MWOWC 2018 will have the same disproportionate faction representation
Presumably, the Finals will have a similar result (but with potential to shake things up slightly)

[A Shoddy Rental Mech]

Mcgral18, on 14 October 2017 - 05:00 AM, said:

I guess I might as well make this too

Then compare that to what the winning teams actually ran.

https://mwomercs.com...__fromsearch__1

"balance"

[TheArisen]

Yeah even without a graph anyone that watched the matches would notice the disparity.

[The Mysterious Fox]

im not surprised by the summoner picks since the insane quirk and agility configuration gives it a really high skill ceiling with its energy and uac bonuses.

the prevalence of supernovas is interesting though, ive never found them to stand out in any of my games.

[Y E O N N E]

The Mysterious Fox, on 14 October 2017 - 09:18 AM, said:

im not surprised by the summoner picks since the insane quirk and agility configuration gives it a really high skill ceiling with its energy and uac bonuses.

the prevalence of supernovas is interesting though, ive never found them to stand out in any of my games.

If it wasn't for the 5% cERLL duration reduction and the better damage-rolling, you would be seeing MAD-IIC instead.

[Snazzy Dragon]

Yeonne Greene, on 14 October 2017 - 09:21 AM, said:

If it wasn't for the 5% cERLL duration reduction and the better damage-rolling, you would be seeing MAD-IIC instead.

Don't forget the utilitarian jumpjet for getting up the side of canyon and off of broken map geometry where needed!

[Jackal Noble]

Out of curiosity, how balanced was MW4?

[Snazzy Dragon]

JackalBeast, on 14 October 2017 - 02:12 PM, said:

Out of curiosity, how balanced was MW4?

Doesn't compare because there were vastly different gameplay dynamics.