20 replies to this topic

[Quinn Allard]

Got some cash and upgrading, currently running Phenom ii X4 9600, 8gb ddr2 ram, older dell mb, and Sapphire 6670. Got some options here...have a friend that will sell me this: http://www.newegg.co...N82E16883229271 for $650. Then I have another friend that wants to build one with me, he has connections and can get good deals. He wants to go the way of the Bulldozer FX8150, a 2GB Radeon, AsRock 990FX MB, 2 500gb Caviar Blacks, OCZ 650watt psu, of course others (Win7, cpu cooler, optical drive, etc) and 16GB 1600mhz DDR3 Sniper ram for $700. Given I will be spending $50 more for double the ram and gpu, im leaning more towards the AMD build. However, Im open to the Intel build, or something else in that $750-900 range. Mostly gaming (everything from Diablo 3, MWO, BF3, Metro etc etc), dvd converting, and web browsing. Need to spend the money soon before my wife changes her mind about letting me spend it lol.

[Bluey]

Let that friend of your built that case and never buy second hand computers.

[Greyrook]

I would advise against bulldozer, AMD hasn't really impressed with their latest architecture and I've seen reviews where their flagship 8 core is only marginally better or even worse than the intel 2500K (a quad core and not the best model in the series). I'm been running a 2600K for about a year and I absolutely love it. As far as cards go, you should be fine with anything current generation; it seems like nvidia and amd are pretty evenly matched in most price points. I'm an Nvidia user myself, but I don't have anything against the red cards. Only thing I'd say is I wouldn't bother with 16 GB of ram if you're just going to be gaming. No game uses that much ram and if it shaves a few bucks off, you might as well.

[Oderint dum Metuant]

Quinn Allard, on 19 July 2012 - 05:35 PM, said:

Got some cash and upgrading, currently running Phenom ii X4 9600, 8gb ddr2 ram, older dell mb, and Sapphire 6670. Got some options here...have a friend that will sell me this: http://www.newegg.co...N82E16883229271 for $650. Then I have another friend that wants to build one with me, he has connections and can get good deals. He wants to go the way of the Bulldozer FX8150, a 2GB Radeon, AsRock 990FX MB, 2 500gb Caviar Blacks, OCZ 650watt psu, of course others (Win7, cpu cooler, optical drive, etc) and 16GB 1600mhz DDR3 Sniper ram for $700. Given I will be spending $50 more for double the ram and gpu, im leaning more towards the AMD build. However, Im open to the Intel build, or something else in that $750-900 range. Mostly gaming (everything from Diablo 3, MWO, BF3, Metro etc etc), dvd converting, and web browsing. Need to spend the money soon before my wife changes her mind about letting me spend it lol.

You make no mention of what GPU (other than 2GB radeon which could be any single radeon for sale) you will be using in the AMD build, thats not really helpful and something we need to know to give you proper feedback.

On what you have posted, an 8150 is a waste of money for gaming the most you need is an FX4170 that is AMD's best gaming CPU.
Your also wasting money on 16GB DDR 1600MHZ, the absolute MOST you will need is 8GB and there is not a massive difference between 1333Mhz and 1600mhz RAM.

Those 2 points combined will save you some cash to spend more on the GPU, and you need to remember the GPU is your most important aspect when building a gaming machine.

[Vulpesveritas]

$600


Case: http://www.newegg.co...N82E16811148060
PSU: http://www.newegg.co...N82E16817151094
Motherboard: http://www.newegg.co...N82E16813157280
CPU: http://www.newegg.co...N82E16819103727
GPU: http://www.newegg.co...N82E16814125390
RAM: http://www.newegg.co...N82E16820148485
HDD: http://www.newegg.co...N82E16822136769
ODD: http://www.newegg.co...N82E16827135204
OS: Windows 8 beta
Heatsink: stock
TIM: stock

Sale Combos: none
Promo Codes: none




$900


Case: http://www.newegg.co...N82E16811148060
PSU: http://www.newegg.co...N82E16817182263
Motherboard: http://www.newegg.co...N82E16813157266
CPU: http://www.newegg.co...N82E16819106010
GPU: http://www.newegg.co...N82E16814102986
RAM: http://www.newegg.co...N82E16820231461
HDD: http://www.newegg.co...N82E16822136769
ODD: http://www.newegg.co...N82E16827135204
OS: http://www.newegg.co...N82E16832116986
Heatsink: stock
TIM: stock

Sale Combos: http://www.newegg.co...st=Combo.986424
Promo Codes: HARDOCPX718A

-http://mwomercs.com/...ds-of-the-week/
For a $700 build, take the $600 build and add windows 7 home premium OEM 64bit.

Just my recommendations.


Also, I recommend staying away from OCZ PSUs, you can get far better ones at the prices they sell theirs at, and OCZ is not exactly known for reliability or customer service.

[Shivus]

Assuming your mobo is AM3+

Either keep the 960, grab an aftermarket cooler and overclock it. Or go for the FX 6100/6200 and overclock it (both will reach the same overclock assuming your mobo is capable) Grab a GTX 670 and upgrade your ram to DDR3.

Assuming your mobo is AM3
Grab the aftermarket HSF, overclock that phenom II, grab a GTX 670, or HD 7970.

This is assuming your current PSU is up to snuff of course.

8150 is an overpriced piece of crap because the 8120 can be overclocked just as high, the 8120 is only good if you can use those 8 cores in applications outside of gaming. 6 cores will be a decent upgrade since you'll have 4 for running games, and 2 for background programs. Just be aware bulldozer single thread performance is abysmal and is a reason to not go for the 4 core bulldozers given that you already have a quad core.

Phenom II is still good enough that you can feasibly focus all your funds on a GPU (and maybe PSU depending on your current one.)

And because the phenom II is still capable, you can wait to see how piledriver stacks up when it gets released. There may be a more worthwhile upgrade there in the not so distant future.

You could go for the 2500k as well. The total cost for it with a decent mobo, ddr3 ram, and a CM hyper212 evo is about $400-$450. That still leaves room for your GPU upgrade, but less if you also find you need to upgrade your PSU as well. But after all that even if you had to settle on a 7950 or 7870 depending on your remaining funds, it would drastically out perform your current GPU.

Edited by Shivus, 20 July 2012 - 01:11 AM.

[Vulpesveritas]

Shivus, on 20 July 2012 - 12:54 AM, said:

Assuming your mobo is AM3+

Either keep the 960, grab an aftermarket cooler and overclock it. Or go for the FX 6100/6200 and overclock it (both will reach the same overclock assuming your mobo is capable) Grab a GTX 670 and upgrade your ram to DDR3.

Assuming your mobo is AM3
Grab the aftermarket HSF, overclock that phenom II, grab a GTX 670, or HD 7970.

This is assuming your current PSU is up to snuff of course.

8150 is an overpriced piece of crap because the 8120 can be overclocked just as high, the 8120 is only good if you can use those 8 cores in applications outside of gaming. 6 cores will be a decent upgrade since you'll have 4 for running games, and 2 for background programs. Just be aware bulldozer single thread performance is abysmal and is a reason to not go for the 4 core bulldozers given that you already have a quad core.

Phenom II is still good enough that you can feasibly focus all your funds on a GPU (and maybe PSU depending on your current one.)

And because the phenom II is still capable, you can wait to see how piledriver stacks up when it gets released. There may be a more worthwhile upgrade there in the not so distant future.

This is the case, should the OP have a Phenom II 960t, although I am somewhat confused by what the OP typed, as he may mean the 2.3ghz Phenom I 9600 X4, which would mean an AM2+ or AM3 socket. Given the mention of DDR2, I am thinking he means the Phenom One.

Edited by Vulpesveritas, 20 July 2012 - 01:16 AM.

[Shivus]

Yeah if it's the phenom I then the total new build is the only real way to go.

Also I just realized he said "dell motherboard" so that's probably going to be a major block on upgrading and likely indicates it's a dell, so the PSU is probably terrible. And If it is a dell prebuilt then new build is again the only way to go.

Although that prebuilt your friend is willing to sell you looks like a good deal too. You could upgrade that 6850 to a 7850, and it will perform better in most areas than the proposed bulldozer build.

Edited by Shivus, 20 July 2012 - 01:31 AM.

[Quinn Allard]

Sorry it is a Phenom 9600 quad core 2.3ghz, this rig was built long time ago. I am doing all this research and it seems to me that its 80% fan boy, 10% fact, and 10% fiction. Both ways. Is this AMD vs Intel thing going to be PS3 vs 360? That it boils down to personal experience? Am I losing 30% performance, or 10% for 30-40% savings? Also the ram he already has, and I believe he said it was 2 x 8gb. Also, why not have 8 cores, even if Im only using 4 for gaming, more is better? Im sorry but Im still newish to PC world. I'm going to have $300 to spend on GPU so really its whichever is better in that price range.

[BigJim]

The Phen II 965 Vulp recommends is more than enough and cheap as chips.
Slap in a beefy GPU like a 7850 or 7870 and you're golden. 2GB video ram is niice.

Spec of the GPU is more important than the spec of the CPU/motherboard as long as it's at least a moderately-decent quad core chip.

Edited by BigJim, 20 July 2012 - 05:14 AM.

[Vulpesveritas]

Quinn Allard, on 20 July 2012 - 04:29 AM, said:

Sorry it is a Phenom 9600 quad core 2.3ghz, this rig was built long time ago. I am doing all this research and it seems to me that its 80% fan boy, 10% fact, and 10% fiction. Both ways. Is this AMD vs Intel thing going to be PS3 vs 360? That it boils down to personal experience? Am I losing 30% performance, or 10% for 30-40% savings? Also the ram he already has, and I believe he said it was 2 x 8gb. Also, why not have 8 cores, even if Im only using 4 for gaming, more is better? Im sorry but Im still newish to PC world. I'm going to have $300 to spend on GPU so really its whichever is better in that price range.

The reason why not 8, is they are lower clocked 8 cores and more expensive as it is, whereas an FX-6200 has two extra cores sitting there to do background tasks, which is more than enough, while you have four faster cores than in the 8150, so you are a bit faster in gaming too. (unless you overclock).
Plus, the 6200 is $40 cheaper, which can go to other things.
GPU I recommend at $300;
http://www.newegg.co...N82E16814131476

Heatsink I recommend at $50-75;
air- http://www.newegg.co...N82E16835103176
water- http://www.newegg.co...N82E16835106188

Motherboard wise, I recommend a 990FX chipset board from Asus, AsRock, or Gigabyte, with 8+2 phase power or better (which is all 990FX chipset motherboards from those three brands except the AsRock Extreme 3.)

Power supply wise, this is the current best deal on Newegg;
http://www.newegg.co...N82E16817182263
and otherwise I recommend an XFX, Corsair, or Seasonic, with at least an 80+ Bronze certification.

[Quinn Allard]

Ok, did all my own research. Heres what $800ish got me.
AMD FX8150BE (overclocking around 4.6-4.8),
Asus Sabertooth 990FX,
WD Caviar Black 500gb x 2,
Radeon Sapphire Dirt 3 Ed. 6950 2gb gddr5,
Mushkin 8gb 1600mhz ddr3 x 2,
Seasonic Platinum 1000w,
LG BluRay/rw, LG DVD/rw,
Noctua NH D14 heatsink/fan,
Trendnet wireless N 300+mbps,
and all other wires etc etc. Already have DeathAdder mouse, Mercenary keyboard, and Acer 1080p monitor. The case I havnt seen yet, all I know is its an Antec full tower he has at his store thats $50. So I added it all up and its about $1300-1400 in parts. With various deals and his discount (no MIR's I hate those) thats $500-600 savings and I got a pretty serious machine. I will post pics when parts start coming in. Dont think playing MWO will be a problem.

[Shivus]

May be too late and repeating myself/others at this point, but I'd advise you drop down to a 6 core and use the savings to up the GPU to a 7850 or 7870.

You could also drop the PSU down to something in the 650 range and use more savings to go to the 7950, GTX 670, or 7970.

Unless you're running virtual machines, editing and rendering out 1080P video, or doing 3D rendering you won't miss two cores, and those cores will do nothing for games.

At any rate, good luck on your build.

[Quinn Allard]

All the research I did showed that there wasnt a GREAT impact in performance core for core in this and i5, maybe SOME games/apps there was a total of 10% gain, but nothing that you are going to notice. When put with a 2gb card its going to be awesome, and future proof it. Yes, I will be doing other things than playing games. And since we got an AMD hookup I got a good deal, so why not. Also comparing 6950 vs 7850 I didnt see a huge improvement, again depeding on the game, there was 10% loss or gain. I think either this setup, or an Intel setup, will both play MWO and others at max settings. Since I saved a good deal of money I dont regret it.


Edit: Also I got that 1000watt psu for a KILLER deal, so Im glad about that. Honostly, haters gonna hate. However, with an 8core, 2gbs video ram, 8gb ram with 2 more slots, one of the best mobos, and a 1000watt psu.....there wont be much this rig wont be able to handle.

Edited by Quinn Allard, 24 July 2012 - 06:21 PM.

[Vulpesveritas]

Quinn Allard, on 24 July 2012 - 06:11 PM, said:

All the research I did showed that there wasnt a GREAT impact in performance core for core in this and i5, maybe SOME games/apps there was a total of 10% gain, but nothing that you are going to notice. When put with a 2gb card its going to be awesome, and future proof it. Yes, I will be doing other things than playing games. And since we got an AMD hookup I got a good deal, so why not. Also comparing 6950 vs 7850 I didnt see a huge improvement, again depeding on the game, there was 10% loss or gain. I think either this setup, or an Intel setup, will both play MWO and others at max settings. Since I saved a good deal of money I dont regret it.


Edit: Also I got that 1000watt psu for a KILLER deal, so Im glad about that. Honostly, haters gonna hate. However, with an 8core, 2gbs video ram, 8gb ram with 2 more slots, one of the best mobos, and a 1000watt psu.....there wont be much this rig wont be able to handle.

The main upside to the 7850 VS the 6950, is the 7850 is far superior in heavy tessellation titles, uses less power, runs cooler, overclocks higher, and is quieter... at about exactly the same price.

And... it might have been a "killer deal" but you're also killing your energy efficiency... It will probably only run at 80+ bronze levels at full load, if you're lucky. Keep in mind, power supplies are meant to be run at 40-60% of power usage optimally, and your system will only be pulling around 300-400 watts or so at maximum load, most of the time you won't be reaching 200-250 unless you're overclocking.

And given your budget, you could have done better on the GPU...

[Quinn Allard]

Vulpesveritas, on 24 July 2012 - 06:40 PM, said:

The main upside to the 7850 VS the 6950, is the 7850 is far superior in heavy tessellation titles, uses less power, runs cooler, overclocks higher, and is quieter... at about exactly the same price.

And... it might have been a "killer deal" but you're also killing your energy efficiency... It will probably only run at 80+ bronze levels at full load, if you're lucky. Keep in mind, power supplies are meant to be run at 40-60% of power usage optimally, and your system will only be pulling around 300-400 watts or so at maximum load, most of the time you won't be reaching 200-250 unless you're overclocking.

And given your budget, you could have done better on the GPU...

Everything will be overclocked. CPU, GPU, RAM everything......also the GPU we got for well under $200, and I plan on Crossfire with a XFX Double D 6950 2GB in my brothers machine once he upgrades to 7950. Also a SSD or 2 is in the plans. From what I've seen in benchmarks on AnandTech the difference is very small like .2-3 FPS in most games. Yeah some like Civ V and StarCraft 2 are 10 FPS, But for the amount I saved to put towards the Sabertooth or 8150 is worth .2-10FPS in games that are running on MAX settings. Your acting like the 6950 is a sloth, and the 7850 is a tiger. The 6950 is still a very good card. I would say the 6950 is a Lion, even if its alittle lazier then a Tiger, you still wouldnt want to be in a room with one.

[Vulpesveritas]

Quinn Allard, on 24 July 2012 - 09:27 PM, said:

Everything will be overclocked. CPU, GPU, RAM everything......also the GPU we got for well under $200, and I plan on Crossfire with a XFX Double D 6950 2GB in my brothers machine once he upgrades to 7950. Also a SSD or 2 is in the plans. From what I've seen in benchmarks on AnandTech the difference is very small like .2-3 FPS in most games. Yeah some like Civ V and StarCraft 2 are 10 FPS, But for the amount I saved to put towards the Sabertooth or 8150 is worth .2-10FPS in games that are running on MAX settings. Your acting like the 6950 is a sloth, and the 7850 is a tiger. The 6950 is still a very good card. I would say the 6950 is a Lion, even if its alittle lazier then a Tiger, you still wouldnt want to be in a room with one.

Oh, I thought you were buying the GPU at retail prices lol.
It's more that when in retail, where the difference is only about $20, the 7850 is a far better choice.

If you got it for $175 or less, the 6950 is the clear choice vs a retail 7850 lol.

I apologize for my assumption

[Quinn Allard]

Vulpesveritas, on 24 July 2012 - 09:37 PM, said:

Oh, I thought you were buying the GPU at retail prices lol.
It's more that when in retail, where the difference is only about $20, the 7850 is a far better choice.

If you got it for $175 or less, the 6950 is the clear choice vs a retail 7850 lol.

I apologize for my assumption

Hey its ok, I think the total with taxes and shipping was $165ish. The PSU we got for $50 new in the box. The only items we paid retail for were the ddr3 ram, mobo, and the hard drives.

[Odins Fist]

Quinn Allard, on 22 July 2012 - 06:39 PM, said:

Ok, did all my own research. Heres what $800ish got me.
AMD FX8150BE (overclocking around 4.6-4.8),
Asus Sabertooth 990FX,
WD Caviar Black 500gb x 2,
Radeon Sapphire Dirt 3 Ed. 6950 2gb gddr5,
Mushkin 8gb 1600mhz ddr3 x 2,
Seasonic Platinum 1000w,
LG BluRay/rw, LG DVD/rw,
Noctua NH D14 heatsink/fan,
Trendnet wireless N 300+mbps,
and all other wires etc etc. Already have DeathAdder mouse, Mercenary keyboard, and Acer 1080p monitor. The case I havnt seen yet, all I know is its an Antec full tower he has at his store thats $50. So I added it all up and its about $1300-1400 in parts. With various deals and his discount (no MIR's I hate those) thats $500-600 savings and I got a pretty serious machine. I will post pics when parts start coming in. Dont think playing MWO will be a problem.

.
Good choice on the Motherboard, I have been running an ASUS Sabertooth for a little over year now, first with a Phenom II x4 960t overclocked to 4.15GHZ on air, and for a few months now a Phenom II x6 1100t, OC from 4.1975GHZ to currently 4.29GHZ on water.. With the power supply you picked, overclocking will be an absolute breeze, I believe you have 83AMPS on it... Nice
Remember your load line calibration, and you current capability in bios setting to high or extreme will make your life a whole lot easier when you go to overclock .. The UEFI Bios will take about 5 minutes to get used to, after that you can tweak your OC in a matter of seconds..
.
Initial setup was almost too easy... I have had ZERO issues with the ASUS Sabertooth 990FX...
Have fun, and good luck on your new build.

[Vulpesveritas]

Quinn Allard, on 25 July 2012 - 09:44 AM, said:

Hey its ok, I think the total with taxes and shipping was $165ish. The PSU we got for $50 new in the box. The only items we paid retail for were the ddr3 ram, mobo, and the hard drives.

umm... if i may ask... how did you get a $300 top of the line PSU for $50 new in box?.....