147 replies to this topic

[Skipmagnet]

I am already usually one of only two lights on my teams, and first in contact with the enemy more than 75% of the time. When we go to 8v8 and I will more likely than not be the *only* light on my team, and probably still in first contact, the relative number of guns aiming at me actually does not change, only the number of targets those guns have to shoot, which drops. All in all, I expect to have more fire directed at me than I do now, not less.

I've given a ton of thought and tape (reviewing old matches) to this. I will definitely try it out, but as I stated before, given my tier, the pool of players I usually find myself in and my obvious dedication to the little mechs, MWO is going to get a lot less fun real quick for me, and it's already riding that rail real freakin' hard.

[Wolfways]

Pgi said they're doing 8v8? We're going...backwards now?

[MischiefSC]

eyeballs, on 01 November 2017 - 09:15 PM, said:

I am already usually one of only two lights on my teams, and first in contact with the enemy more than 75% of the time. When we go to 8v8 and I will more likely than not be the *only* light on my team, and probably still in first contact, the relative number of guns aiming at me actually does not change, only the number of targets those guns have to shoot, which drops. All in all, I expect to have more fire directed at me than I do now, not less.

I've given a ton of thought and tape (reviewing old matches) to this. I will definitely try it out, but as I stated before, given my tier, the pool of players I usually find myself in and my obvious dedication to the little mechs, MWO is going to get a lot less fun real quick for me, and it's already riding that rail real freakin' hard.

8 v 8 will actually help lights in that regard. Often the biggest threat to a light is other lights and wolfpacks - which will be far, far less common. Ideally matches will break up 2/2/2/2 but more realistically based on mech weight population distribution it'll be 1/1/4/2 or even 1/1/3/3. This is *good* for a nice backstabbing light. Fewer mechs who can keep up with you and few of the mechs that tend to be good vs lights (like faster mediums).

[Skipmagnet]

I think you misinterpreted me: I'm not a backstabber, I'm an ECM Purifier HLL 3xERML. I'm a fast line mech, more or less. Cavalry, not recon, I guess? My point is that when I get shot at its usually by one to four dudes, and I don't see that changing other than tge other guy who might be with me up there in a 12v12 is not there in an 8v8.

I want you to be right, believe me I do, but my gut tells me that this change is going to put the kibosh on me. I haz a sad nao.

[The Mysterious Fox]

8v8 = 12.5% chance of super potato for each slot on each team. 12v12 = 8.3% chance. 128v128 = 0.78% chance of potato lol

[MischiefSC]

The Mysterious Fox, on 02 November 2017 - 12:17 AM, said:

8v8 = 12.5% chance of super potato for each slot on each team. 12v12 = 8.3% chance. 128v128 = 0.78% chance of potato lol

You're misinterpreting how those stats work -

8 v 8 = 33% less wide the matchmaker has to cast to fill a match for skill/tonnage matching. You're exactly as likely to drop 4 potatoes as you are 4 skilled players. Way more likely if you're T1/T2. If you're T3-5 you're way LESS likely to have way more skilled players dropping in the match with you.

8 v 8 tightens matchmaking band requirements by 33%. That's a big chunk.

[The Mysterious Fox]

MischiefSC, on 02 November 2017 - 12:29 AM, said:

You're misinterpreting how those stats work -

8 v 8 = 33% less wide the matchmaker has to cast to fill a match for skill/tonnage matching. You're exactly as likely to drop 4 potatoes as you are 4 skilled players. Way more likely if you're T1/T2. If you're T3-5 you're way LESS likely to have way more skilled players dropping in the match with you.

8 v 8 tightens matchmaking band requirements by 33%. That's a big chunk.

its about the ability to influence a match, you never know what kind of french fry lurks in the queue at any time so each roll is independent of each other. If you really get a whole tray of baked potato in a team then its just your fate, cant avoid it. also, tiers lol how many hundreds of threads here show that it means nothing.

[MischiefSC]

The Mysterious Fox, on 02 November 2017 - 12:33 AM, said:

its about the ability to influence a match, you never know what kind of french fry lurks in the queue at any time so each roll is independent of each other. If you really get a whole tray of baked potato in a team then its just your fate, cant avoid it. also, tiers lol how many hundreds of threads here show that it means nothing.

That's no more or less likely in 8 v 8 than 12 v 12.

8 v 8 will help with matchmaking, would be great if it also came with a better player skill tier system (something Elo driven would be good).

8 v 8 will make brawling more likely and be less friendly to LRM boats and sniping.

8 v 8 is less total firepower on the field and as such increase TTK on an individual player level.

However it's going to hurt bad players more than good playersand increase the impact of each player on the match.

I'm good either way.

[The Mysterious Fox]

MischiefSC, on 02 November 2017 - 12:45 AM, said:

That's no more or less likely in 8 v 8 than 12 v 12.

8 v 8 will help with matchmaking, would be great if it also came with a better player skill tier system (something Elo driven would be good).

8 v 8 will make brawling more likely and be less friendly to LRM boats and sniping.

8 v 8 is less total firepower on the field and as such increase TTK on an individual player level.

However it's going to hurt bad players more than good playersand increase the impact of each player on the match.

I'm good either way.

better map design can do all that, we need more maps

[Skipmagnet]

MischiefSC, on 02 November 2017 - 12:45 AM, said:

However it's going to hurt bad players more than good playersand increase the impact of each player on the match.

I'm good either way.

The vast majority of the player base (including me) is bad players. Taro Gato has data and spreadsheets to prove it. This change will be awesome for good to awesome players, and shitsucky for everyone else.

[Papaspud]

At this point in the game......does anybody really care?

[Wolfways]

The Mysterious Fox, on 02 November 2017 - 01:04 AM, said:

better map design can do all that, we need more maps

Bigger maps.

[Nema Nabojiv]

The Mysterious Fox, on 02 November 2017 - 01:04 AM, said:

better map design can do all that, we need more maps

Wolfways, on 02 November 2017 - 01:53 AM, said:

Bigger maps.

As if it is any difference on which map to murderball.

[Skipmagnet]

Murder ball on nuMordor is very different from murder ball on LRM Peaks.

Just sayin'.

[The Mysterious Fox]

Wolfways, on 02 November 2017 - 01:53 AM, said:

Bigger maps.

id rather mid to small maps but hey, as long as its better

Nema Nabojiv, on 02 November 2017 - 01:59 AM, said:

As if it is any difference on which map to murderball.

sure, better lanes, rotating spawn points...etc. sometimes even turning the other way around makes all the difference.

Edited by The Mysterious Fox, 02 November 2017 - 02:18 AM.

[warner2]

There should be a poll. Was there ever a poll?

[Nema Nabojiv]

eyeballs, on 02 November 2017 - 02:12 AM, said:

Murder ball on nuMordor is very different from murder ball on LRM Peaks.

Just sayin'.

Yeah, the sky colors are different, sometimes you can leave the nascar route and sometimes you have to commit to it. But essentialy it all comes to whose murderball is more aggressive and more cohesive.

The problem is, we still have murderballs and they still meet at several traditional areas of any map.

It remains to be seen if 8v8 will change that now when players got so used to murderballs, but I say we need a month of PTS testing to see if it will be an improvement to gameplay or not.

[Wolfways]

Nema Nabojiv, on 02 November 2017 - 02:49 AM, said:

Yeah, the sky colors are different, sometimes you can leave the nascar route and sometimes you have to commit to it. But essentialy it all comes to whose murderball is more aggressive and more cohesive.

The problem is, we still have murderballs and they still meet at several traditional areas of any map.

It remains to be seen if 8v8 will change that now when players got so used to murderballs, but I say we need a month of PTS testing to see if it will be an improvement to gameplay or not.

Nothing will change. Murderball will still be the only tactic used because other tactics require moving away from the group, and noone will do that for the same reason they don't now. If you do there's a chance a light mech will find you and then you're dead.

[Skipmagnet]

You think they're going to a pts? You innocent soul. They're going to just do it, whether we like it or not, whether we want it or not. If we're very lucky and extra good, they might tell us they're going to do it before they do it, but we've all been really cheap-skatey lately, so probably not.

[Daggett]

With 8v8... Can we get old Forest Colony back please?