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Clans Are Now Dominating Scouting


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#41 Brain Cancer

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Posted 03 November 2017 - 11:09 AM

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Man, I guess I'm really missing out on an opportunity to use my Bushwackers. I had no idea they were so OP.


It's already one of the best IS mediums, and Scouting runs straight towards it's virtues, being more than enough SRMs to kneecap anything in 1-2 salvos while moving at high enough speeds to do so. The Awoolf is about the only thing new to the scouting equation, but it's still plenty fragile enough to get mashed unless it just outruns the enemy entirely.

#42 Snowbluff

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Posted 03 November 2017 - 11:10 AM

View PostShifty McSwift, on 03 November 2017 - 09:36 AM, said:


Careful, you just listed all the reasons that stormcrows got weighted out of scouting Posted Image
Oh woops sorry. :x

View PostYeonne Greene, on 03 November 2017 - 09:37 AM, said:

But...there are no more Long Toms...

It's true I have no idea what I'm talking about. Still, scout wins might weight the data.

#43 Tiewolf

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Posted 03 November 2017 - 12:25 PM

View PostStf Sgt Marblez, on 03 November 2017 - 08:05 AM, said:

Seen a few folks say the nova isn't a good scouting mech, or at least a sub par one.

Why is that? Does it just lack the tankiness? Is it bc everything is arm mounted? Did I just answer my own question?

Actually if you have decent aiming skills, Novas are a good answer to bushwackers because they can pinpoint legs with ease. The legs are your only choice when it comes to bushies or crabs. The most scouting matches I lost in my bushwacker where to pinpoint leg biter like Novas. As long as you go with a huntsnovahunch in scouting you are fine against anything IS can bring.

#44 Rusharn

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Posted 03 November 2017 - 12:40 PM

The Issue with the Novas is that any damage massively reduces their effectiveness. Their legs are easy to hit, taking out an arm greatly reduces their fire power, losing a side torso not only reduces speed but also takes out so much of your heat dissipation you are practically crippled, and you are slow. Hunches, huntsman, and the non-hero Arctic Wolf battlemechs can lose their arms and often a side torso and still stay in the fight, and their legs are harder to target than the novas. An Arctic Cheetah is fast, and relatively tough, and a small target. The the clSPL and clERSML nerf the Nova's viability in scouting has been greatly reduced.

#45 HenryFA

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Posted 03 November 2017 - 01:13 PM

IS mechs are so freaking tanky IMO...

Especially the BSWs...

55ton + armour quirks + survival tree + awesome hitbox...



#46 LordNothing

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Posted 03 November 2017 - 01:15 PM

View PostDakota1000, on 03 November 2017 - 09:52 AM, said:


>If you bring 4 of your objectively weaker brawlers you will win against 4 of the enemy's objectively stronger brawlers

K



We're in the general discussion forum, no one has any up to date knowledge on FW here. Heck, most are half a year behind or more on quickplay meta.


you forget that clanxl means that clan srm brawlers generally have more tubes, more sinks, and tonnage left over for backup weapons. and if is wants clanlike engine durability they need to piss away a lot of tonnage on lfe. sure they get an extra 5t, but a lot of people are going under tonnage running cents and hunchies. even then i keep finding xl engines.

and the general clan == camp, is == brawl is a gross oversimplification. especially when considering the light-medium end of the spectrum and the fact that camping is not a very good strat in scouting. clanners can get higher short-med range laser alphas on smlaller mechs if they want to go that route (if i really wanted to clean house id bring my 50 alpha ferret). clanners also have better machine gun mechs, i like my scat with 2 hlls and 6 machine guns, ran that several times and it was more successfull than not. the only thing is can do that clan cant are bring the heavy ballistics (and thats not entirely true because hunchback iic), and again thats not a great strat in scouting unless your packing the bigger lbs.

#47 Y E O N N E

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Posted 03 November 2017 - 02:07 PM

View PostHenryFA, on 03 November 2017 - 01:13 PM, said:

IS mechs are so freaking tanky IMO...

Especially the BSWs...

55ton + armour quirks + survival tree + awesome hitbox...


IS 'Mechs tank through hitpoints, Clan 'Mechs tank through XL. IS 'Mechs have longer up-time for their full set of weapons, while Clan 'Mechs have more weapons with a shorter expected up-time, but losing half puts them roughly on par with what the IS 'Mech started with.

It's an interesting set of trade-offs. It used to be more prolific, but now it's essentially the following Chassis that get it to a significant degree, and not necessarily on all variants:

Commando
Urbanmech
Wolfhound
Assassin
Vindicator
Bushwhacker
Dragon
Roughneck
Orion
Victor
Highlander
Nightstar
King Crab
Atlas
Annihilator

IMHO, if they tied extra bonuses to XL engines, you could get away with the death-on-ST-loss.

#48 Mcgral18

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Posted 03 November 2017 - 03:46 PM

View PostGas Guzzler, on 03 November 2017 - 08:19 AM, said:


Man, I guess I'm really missing out on an opportunity to use my Bushwackers. I had no idea they were so OP.


It's on the higher end of things
Much like the Assassin compares to 55 ton mechs due to Quirks, the Bushy has Heavy levels of HP, along with decent missile racks


I'd still take a Nova over them...but I don't own them either. They get praise from the unit.
It's the same battle of Quirks VS natively superior equipment

#49 Champion of Khorne Lord of Blood

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Posted 03 November 2017 - 04:42 PM

View PostLordNothing, on 03 November 2017 - 01:15 PM, said:


you forget that clanxl means that clan srm brawlers generally have more tubes, more sinks, and tonnage left over for backup weapons. and if is wants clanlike engine durability they need to piss away a lot of tonnage on lfe. sure they get an extra 5t, but a lot of people are going under tonnage running cents and hunchies. even then i keep finding xl engines.

and the general clan == camp, is == brawl is a gross oversimplification. especially when considering the light-medium end of the spectrum and the fact that camping is not a very good strat in scouting. clanners can get higher short-med range laser alphas on smlaller mechs if they want to go that route (if i really wanted to clean house id bring my 50 alpha ferret). clanners also have better machine gun mechs, i like my scat with 2 hlls and 6 machine guns, ran that several times and it was more successfull than not. the only thing is can do that clan cant are bring the heavy ballistics (and thats not entirely true because hunchback iic), and again thats not a great strat in scouting unless your packing the bigger lbs.



I'm just talking the meta between the two sides, when comparing the top tier meta mechs in scouting the IS blows the Clans away, pugs are going to pug though.

Also Bushwacker with LFE280 and one stripped empty arm has 24 tons available, Huntsman has the same amount available if it strips some of the head armor, Hunchback IIC has 28 tons available if it strips both arms and a little off the head. This is with light FF armor on the Bushwacker while the Hunchback IIC and Huntsman gets ferro and endo. With the weight advantage of the Bushwacker the LFE isn't a hinderance.

Even with 4 ASRM6 and 4 tons of ammo with the LFE280 the Bushwacker still has room left over (I usually fill it up with some RL20s). This leads to the Bushwacker having higher effective DPS (damage output during the time of engagement, which is the only way to really calculate the DPS when the RLs are considered), higher alpha strike for one shot then equivalent alpha strikes afterwards, way higher durability, same speed, and superior maneuverability stats.

Even if the Bushwacker wanted to bring an XL engine its side torso is only 8 points less durable than a Huntsman's CT, which lowers to only a 4 point difference after skill tree. I don't really see how an IS XL engine makes the Bushwacker suddenly less tanky than the Huntsman when the Bushwacker's side torso is only 4 points weaker than the Huntsman's CT, what does it matter anyway if everyone goes for legs as they say? Bushwacker spreads damage to all the torsos well too.

#50 Khobai

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Posted 03 November 2017 - 05:19 PM

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Noep. Storm Crow got voted out because of SRM/SSRM quantity, not quality. Also the cSPL at the time. Also no armor quirks or skills, either.


it was more because of its speed it got voted out

huntsman arguably does SSRM better. but the huntsman is also slow compared to the stormcrow.

#51 Y E O N N E

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Posted 03 November 2017 - 05:24 PM

View PostKhobai, on 03 November 2017 - 05:19 PM, said:


it was more because of its speed it got voted out

huntsman arguably does SSRM better. but the huntsman is also slow compared to the stormcrow.


Wasn't appreciably faster than a Griffin.

Really though, the speed doesn't matter much if both teams are brawl since you both have to get within your weapons range to do work.

#52 panzer1b

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Posted 03 November 2017 - 05:45 PM

Its all about where the good units go. If they go IS, itll be all IS every time, if they go clan, there is a very good chance its all clan despite the very slight edge IS gets in scout mode on most maps. That said, im seeing scouting pretty consistently dominated by IS since IS has a slight edge with their stupidly hard to kill off bushwankers, assasins, griffins, ect. Clam just has nothing but the hunch and huntsman, both of which can put up a very good fight and even win, but have a slight disadvantage since they got 0 survival quirks nor meaningful weapon quirks.





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