154 replies to this topic

[CFC Conky]

Cathy, on 04 December 2017 - 04:50 AM, said:

What is the point in this thread ?

Fish on!

@Davegt27,

I think you're going to have to type more slowly for the OP to understand you .
(Just kidding Unofficial Operator )

Good hunting,
CFC Conky
(Terrible stats, T5 forever!)

Edited by CFC Conky, 04 December 2017 - 09:00 AM.

[Mister Blastman]

Nope, sorry OP, I disagree.

Countersuck and other 1 shot, 1 kill games reward lightning fast twitch reflexes and luck, whereas protracted TTK rewards intelligent thinking and repetitive reflexes and muscle control(because you have to score hits in the same location repeatedly instead of one lucky time).

You can be dumb and fast and win at Countersuck. You can't be dumb and fast and win a protracted fight in MWO consistently. 'Mecha combat rewards smarter players.


Alternate example: Supreme Commander. The games can last a long, long time, and twitch reflexes have little bearing on the outcome, unlike StarCraft. Both reward intelligent players, but even the fastest and smartest player can lose in SupCom to another player if they aren't paying attention in the long game and overlook an important detail on what their opponent is planning too do. In SupCom planning and forethought are paramount, and if you play by simply reacting, well, you might react too late. The game punishes players for lack of thought.


Twitch doesn't equal superior skill. Even the greatest Quake players weren't simply twitch superstars, they had superior memory and board control through their superior minds.

[UnofficialOperator]

As argued by the majority of the community, increasing TTK will increase the gap between good players and new players because aiming and consistency is too much of an advantage for good players.

We need to immediately and drastically decrease TTK so that the gap is lesser and hence improving the new player experience and retention.

1. Decrease TTK
2. New player wins more
3. Higher retention numbers
4. Increase PGI income
5.

I'm sure the good players will agree to decrease TTK since the good players already have an advantage.

Edited by UnofficialOperator, 11 December 2017 - 07:23 PM.

[FupDup]

Noe

[Khobai]

the problem isnt that good players are beating new players.

the problem is that good players are playing new players in the first place. why is that still a thing?

good players should play other good players

new players should play other new players until theyre good players

fix your matchmaker PGI, if there even is one...

Edited by Khobai, 11 December 2017 - 07:36 PM.

[UnofficialOperator]

FupDup, on 11 December 2017 - 07:32 PM, said:

Noe

What?

You don't like PGI to succeed?

You no like quads?

[Nameless King]

Nope

[N0ni]

UnofficialOperator, on 11 December 2017 - 07:23 PM, said:

1. Decrease TTK
2. New player wins more
3. Higher retention numbers
4. Increase PGI income
5.

If step 5 means quads according to those AT-ATs, can we completely skip steps 1-4?

Shhh nobody has to know.

[UnofficialOperator]

N0ni, on 11 December 2017 - 07:59 PM, said:

If step 5 means quads according to those AT-ATs, can we completely skip steps 1-4?

Shhh nobody has to know.

Wut? You don't like capitalism?

[stealthraccoon]

Remember that golden gun from 007 Goldeneye? Yeah, let’s just do that mode, all the time, for everybody.

[Lightfoot]

TTK is too short from a Sim standpoint. I just figure this was done to help players in Light mechs which usually struggle a lot more vs heavier mechs, especially Assaults in MechWarrior games. Even with the short TTK, the Light mech cue is generally 11% compared to 30-40 percent for Heavy and Assault. However, they could just give Lights extra toughness and have longer TTKs.

Also, OP, increase and decrease TTK is ambiguous. Use Longer or Shorter.

Edited by Lightfoot, 12 December 2017 - 12:30 PM.

[FupDup]

Lightfoot, on 11 December 2017 - 08:28 PM, said:

TTK is too high from a Sim standpoint. I just figure this was done to help players in Light mechs which usually struggle a lot more vs heavier mechs, especially Assaults in MechWarrior games. Even with the high TTK, the Light mech cue is generally 11% compared to 30-40 percent for Heavy and Assault. However, they could just give Lights extra toughness and have longer TTKs.

Uh...you're contradicting yourself. First you say TTK is too high, then you want the TTK to go higher (last sentence).

High TTK means long time to kill, high survivability, however you wanna word it. Low TTK means fast kills.

[Kaeb Odellas]

This guy created a thread with the exact opposite premise last week.

Stop responding to the troll.

[UnofficialOperator]

Kaeb Odellas, on 11 December 2017 - 08:30 PM, said:

This guy created a thread with the exact opposite premise last week.

Stop responding to the troll.

What you don't like freedom of speech?

No one is allowed to change their minds?

Please stop derailing and stay on topic thanks.

[N0ni]

UnofficialOperator, on 11 December 2017 - 08:17 PM, said:

Wut? You don't like capitalism?

Except selling quads in order to make a profit is capitalism.

Boom. Mind blown.

Let me use a Scorpion in Solaris.

[Ruslan Savelyev]

UnofficialOperator, on 11 December 2017 - 07:23 PM, said:

As argued by the majority of the community, increasing TTK will increase the gap between good players and new players because aiming and consistency is too much of an advantage for good players.

We need to immediately and drastically decrease TTK so that the gap is lesser and hence improving the new player experience and retention.

1. Decrease TTK
2. New player wins more
3. Higher retention numbers
4. Increase PGI income

PGI has already done this by making mindless laser vomit the best option in the game. Did we see any dakka at all in MWOWC aside from prtn? 1 SRM build? Hottest map in the game, do we see a gauss build? Lol, no, lasers. Remember when comp games involved pushes and brawling instead of 800m trades and vaporizing anything that gets out of position?

You could argue that LRMs require less skill than lasers, but they suck on some maps and are generally easily countered, whereas anyone who can point a reticle and hit LMB 5x with a HLL/ERML build can get above average results. All of the stuff that requires aim/leading, judgement, or positioning to be effective now dramatically underperforms against builds that require no more than mashing a single button.

TTK really isn't bad, it is more than we spend all game thinking "im ok, im ok, im ok, oh, someone got an angle on me for 1.5 sec and i just lost a torso or am orange ct."

[UnofficialOperator]

N0ni, on 11 December 2017 - 08:42 PM, said:

Except selling quads in order to make a profit is capitalism.

Boom. Mind blown.

Let me use a Scorpion in Solaris.

Oops my bad, fellow capitalist.

[Khobai]

adding quads would at least fix the legging problem

[Andi Nagasia]

UnofficialOperator, on 11 December 2017 - 07:23 PM, said:

As argued by the majority of the community, increasing TTK will increase the gap between good players and new players because aiming and consistency is too much of an advantage for good players.

We need to immediately and drastically decrease TTK so that the gap is lesser and hence improving the new player experience and retention.

i disagree,

yes increasing TTK will give slightly more advantage to better players, but not too much more,
what it will do though as well, is allow those lesser players to last alittle longer and perhaps do more them selves,

decreasing TTK wont suddenly close the skill gap, if anything it may make it worse,
as a meta player is more likely to use Meta weapons and one shot some one,
just think of said new Player getting Gauss/PPC'ed 50seconds into a match,

UnofficialOperator, on 11 December 2017 - 07:23 PM, said:

1. Decrease TTK
2. New player wins more
3. Higher retention numbers
4. Increase PGI income
5.

nope,

1) Decrease TTK
2) new & causal players get 1 shot more often,
3) new & causal players get frustrated more often,
4) new & causal players decide to play another game,
5) lack of new & causal players increases wait times,
6) more players get frustrated but now with wait times,
this is my worry about Decreasing TTK,

Edited by Andi Nagasia, 11 December 2017 - 10:02 PM.

[Xmith]

UnofficialOperator, on 11 December 2017 - 07:23 PM, said:

As argued by the majority of the community, increasing TTK will increase the gap between good players and new players because aiming and consistency is too much of an advantage for good players.

We need to immediately and drastically decrease TTK so that the gap is lesser and hence improving the new player experience and retention.

1. Decrease TTK
2. New player wins more
3. Higher retention numbers
4. Increase PGI income
5.

I'm sure the good players will agree to decrease TTK since the good players already have an advantage.

I'll tell you why this won't work. This would be open to everyone, including T1-T2 players creating new alt accounts. Instead of new players being blasted in 25 seconds, you want new players to be blasted in 10 seconds. How would this help new players?