36 replies to this topic

[MischiefSC]

Every single drop you need to hit the ground running. Defending on Invasion or any other game mode your first and primary objective needs to be to fight the enemy as far from your spawn as possible.

This gives you time to group up and recover if you lose the wave.

People get spawn camped specifically because they play too close to their spawn or take 0 steps to engage the enemy away from it.

[Khobai]

Quote

Any ideas on how to combat this?

yeah PGI could fix their gamemodes so spawn camping isnt possible

they need to add invincible calliope turrets to the walls around the spawn. those really powerful turrets from MW4 that have x2 large lasers, x2 medium pulse lasers, and x4 LRM5 launchers.

then it wont be profitable to spawn camp anymore

Quote

People get spawn camped specifically because they play too close to their spawn or take 0 steps to engage the enemy away from it.

no. you can get spawn camped very easily by lame rush tactics like linebacker rushing. just because most teams arnt physically equipped or mentally prepared to kill 12 heavies rushing them in the first 2 minutes.

and once you get spawn camped by all those heavies in the first wave, youve already lost, you cant recover from that. because they just keep reinforcing with more linebackers lol.

the game needs defenses against that sh*t to make it unprofitable and allow the defending team at least a chance of recovering.

like I said above, the spawns need invincible calliope turrets on the walls.

Edited by Khobai, 29 December 2017 - 01:20 AM.

[Saint Scarlett Johan]

People think this game has bad spawn camping. Go play sim mode in WT as Axis when the Allies have M18s.

But all seriousness, add a 20s invincibility timer that doesn't start til the mech hits the ground and Calliopes to guard spawns and spawn rushing wouldn't be a valid tactic.

[PFC Carsten]

MischiefSC, on 29 December 2017 - 12:35 AM, said:

Every single drop you need to hit the ground running. Defending on Invasion or any other game mode your first and primary objective needs to be to fight the enemy as far from your spawn as possible.

Fun fact: When spawn camped, you often hit the ground dead already, since the campers can shoot you inside the dropship already. #freesealclubs

[MischiefSC]

PFC Carsten, on 29 December 2017 - 04:45 AM, said:

Fun fact: When spawn camped, you often hit the ground dead already, since the campers can shoot you inside the dropship already. #freesealclubs

80 KPH is 22 meters per second. If you're over 1k from your spawn (which you should be on every map in Invasion, 1500+ on any map mode but defending on Invasion) you've got a bare minimum of 45 seconds after your last teammate dies before the other team gets to your spawn.

However if you're clustered a few hundred meters from your DZ then when you die the other team is only a few seconds away, often within shooting range of your dropships.

Almost every map except invasion you start out 3,500-4,000 meters from the other teams spawn. On Invasion the gates are, depending on map, 900m to 1400m from the spawn for the closest gate.

The problem is that often bad teams and pug teams want to use the dropship turrets to protect them so they hide in the spawn or even behind it. Also at the start of the match there's this shuffle to see who can be in the back and this fear of moving up.

I play against pug teams whos spawns I never see all the time. All it takes is one guy dropcalling and a few of them having a tiny bit of a spine. It's pretty minimal.

After enough times of watching teams hide in their own DZ (or even behind it on Polar) so I've got to walk 3km just to find them and countless times of seeing enemy teams, even on Skirmish or the like move like 400m up from their DZ and wait for us so I've traveled 2,600m just to get to them I just don't have any empathy for those guys anymore.

You get spawncamped because you were too close to your own spawn. If KCom played like those guys play we'd be getting shot out of our dropships too - by pug teams.

Move the **** up. Move up. Move. Up. Forward. W key. Pressing the W key isn't some leet pro strat. It's not complicated. If you're forward of your DZ then you'll be dropped with your team before the other team gets there.

If you get rolled 2 waves in a row then getting spawncamped is just going to get you to your next match faster because there's no helping you in the current one.

[PFC Carsten]

MischiefSC, on 29 December 2017 - 07:39 AM, said:

If you get rolled 2 waves in a row then getting spawncamped is just going to get you to your next match faster because there's no helping you in the current one.

So, back to square one.

[MischiefSC]

PFC Carsten, on 29 December 2017 - 08:02 AM, said:

So, back to square one.

If you get rolled on 2 waves back to back you've got a LOT more to work on than respawns. It means your deck is probably terrible and your team made repeated very poor choices.

Changes to the spawn are not going to help or fix anything.

[PFC Carsten]

Do you maybe confuse me with someone who suggested changes to the spawn?

I did suggest things to remedy spawn camping many months ago when I still cared about CW, but they where a bit more intricate than just a wall around the spawn or whatever you're thinking of right now.

Edited by PFC Carsten, 29 December 2017 - 01:43 PM.

[Mahikan]

Khobai, on 29 December 2017 - 01:12 AM, said:

yeah PGI could fix their gamemodes so spawn camping isnt possible

they need to add invincible calliope turrets to the walls around the spawn. those really powerful turrets from MW4 that have x2 large lasers, x2 medium pulse lasers, and x4 LRM5 launchers.

then it wont be profitable to spawn camp anymore



no. you can get spawn camped very easily by lame rush tactics like linebacker rushing. just because most teams arnt physically equipped or mentally prepared to kill 12 heavies rushing them in the first 2 minutes.

and once you get spawn camped by all those heavies in the first wave, youve already lost, you cant recover from that. because they just keep reinforcing with more linebackers lol.

the game needs defenses against that sh*t to make it unprofitable and allow the defending team at least a chance of recovering.

like I said above, the spawns need invincible calliope turrets on the walls.

Man you are so out of touch with reality, Every single thread you post in you ask for some God ship, or God turret not even realizing the amount of ways they could be abused. which is hilarious because it's pointed out in so many ways.

Faction play has alot of issues, but you never once consider the limits that pgi and this game have. You wanna separate ques not even considering the population that can't support that kind of divide. You think you know so much but in reality your probably one of those tier 5 players who have played for 5 years constantly frustrated by the "hacks" and that your really one of the best players in the world but pgi, team, game modes, your dog, the mail man, and obama are holding you back. If only they did everything you said pgi would have a good game.

Amirite?

Please take five seconds and think before you type your unless drivel and actually give a proper response to the post. As hard as that might be for someone so challenged.

Edited by Mahikan, 29 December 2017 - 03:35 PM.

[ApexSun]

I only have a few hundred FP battles under my belt, but my unit has only experienced being spawn camped a few times in those games. In every one, it was because we screwed up or were out played. We didn't get back to teamspeak and whine about calliopes...we talked about how to get better. Getting better is OP, please nerf.

[ANOM O MECH]

Khobai, on 29 December 2017 - 01:12 AM, said:

yeah PGI could fix their gamemodes so spawn camping isnt possible

they need to add invincible calliope turrets to the walls around the spawn. those really powerful turrets from MW4 that have x2 large lasers, x2 medium pulse lasers, and x4 LRM5 launchers.

then it wont be profitable to spawn camp anymore

like I said above, the spawns need invincible calliope turrets on the walls.

I think that is taking it a bit extreme.

You would get people that would not venture far from their drop zone.

Your idea needs some way to balance and prevent people from using it as an offence rather than defence.

I have tried to think of some balanced solution myself, but none of them that I think would work are simple or practical. (series of sorted defences along the way and multiple choke points could make getting into a dropzone painful, but you still have to worry about how to get a team out)

This is not a simple problem. There is not a clear answer I can see that doesn't have huge drawbacks and abuse potential.

[Zangief79]

Maybe make all the drop zones similiar to the drop zones on vitric forge. sheer sides so people cant just walk/run up them, they have to jump up into the spawns. Yeah jumping mechs could still get in, but there's usually not that many jumpers in a drop to make spawn camping terrible for a team.

[Jaybles-The-PegLeg-PotatoCaptain]

Zangief79, on 29 December 2017 - 06:34 PM, said:

Maybe make all the drop zones similiar to the drop zones on vitric forge. sheer sides so people cant just walk/run up them, they have to jump up into the spawns. Yeah jumping mechs could still get in, but there's usually not that many jumpers in a drop to make spawn camping terrible for a team.

You mean maps actually designed for respawn play instead of adapted to it!? If memory serves, vitric was the last FP specific map released and Grim portico before that. Both Maps attempt to solve the 'spawn camping' issue in different ways with Grim having spawn points for the defenders spread across several grids. Vitric has the elevated plateau and probably does the best job of balancing drop area accessibility with the death to the last man defender win condition. I think it is a great compromise solution, but is PGI really going to rework every map in the FP rotation at this point?

[Tarogato]

How did your team let the enemy rush eleven mechs through your base and into the dropzone? At the start of the video, it appears you had only killed one mech out of twelve. If they had been going for their primary objective killing the orbital cannon, the match would have been over by the time you started recording.

Your team failed.

[Mystere]

Khobai, on 29 December 2017 - 01:12 AM, said:

they need to add invincible calliope turrets to the walls around the spawn. those really powerful turrets from MW4 that have x2 large lasers, x2 medium pulse lasers, and x4 LRM5 launchers.

then it wont be profitable to spawn camp anymore

But it would be massively helpful -- depending on game mode -- for one side to get a kill lead and then run to and turtle at the safety of their drop zone.

Saint Scarlett Johan, on 29 December 2017 - 03:17 AM, said:

People think this game has bad spawn camping. Go play sim mode in WT as Axis when the Allies have M18s.

But all seriousness, add a 20s invincibility timer that doesn't start til the mech hits the ground and Calliopes to guard spawns and spawn rushing wouldn't be a valid tactic.

We already have anti-missile invincibility shields protecting cockpits. Let us not have any more invincible anything.

Dynamic drop zones would be better, and better maps and game modes would not hurt either.

Edited by Mystere, 30 December 2017 - 08:15 PM.

[Saint Scarlett Johan]

Mystere, on 30 December 2017 - 08:08 PM, said:

But it would be massively helpful -- depending on game mode -- for one side to get a kill lead and then run to and turtle at the safety of their drop zone.



We already have anti-missile invincibility shields protecting cockpits. Let us not have any more invincible anything.

Dynamic drop zones would be better, and better maps and game modes would not hurt either.

While I'd love selectable drop zones. That's beyond PGI's vision.

I gave up all hope for good design after FP 3.0

[Kwea]

Jaybles-The-PegLeg-PotatoCaptain, on 27 December 2017 - 10:57 PM, said:

The attackers did force a brawl, and on the ground of their choosing, they found the most defensible position and held it against incoming dropships and opposing mechs alike. This is a valid strategy.

I 100% agree.... pushing the spawn if they want to try and make you fight in the shadow of it is not only good tactics, but at times the ONLY tactic left to you at that point if you want to win.

I will try and simplify this for people who still, after YEARS of play, can't grasp the basic tactics or respawn...

Think of the battlefield as a football field, and the spawns as the endzone. Most of the time, on most maps, you want to engage the first wave or two between YOUR 40 yard line and THEIR forty yard line. If you engage too close to your base/spawn, they push in and farm a spawn or nuke gens. If you advance too far forward you can get rolled by THEIR respawns, and in most game modes they can then hold back with a kill lead and make you pay, winning on kill count at the end.

There are exceptions to this, usually the extremes....if you are killing them and they start hiding, you can push into them and kill out a spawn, because even if you get wiped their whole next wave will be either shorthanded due to permadeads or so damaged that they will lose the next push. If it is close, and you are fresh and they aren't, pulling back into spawn/base with 2 min left can win you the game, because turrets and dropships auto target the weakest panels and never/rarely miss.

But generally, if you are fighting within 300-400 meters of your spawn, getting camped IS YOUR FAULT. WTF do you expect the other team to do, pull back and let you regroup? Keep marching 2000-3000 meters from their spawn, letting you reinforce at will?

Edited by Kwea, 31 December 2017 - 11:31 AM.