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Not Bad.. Could Be Better


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#1 Hellbringer

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Posted 17 January 2018 - 09:53 PM

I started this game in seriousness last month. Was kind of bored and finally upgraded the old gfx card to a gtx1050. I registered for mwo when it was still beta, but since my comp was ******, I didn't play much.

After about a month I got a nice stable of mechs. Spent about roughly 30 bucks and I'm enjoying my time in tier 3. I've noticed a few things that I think might attract more people to this relatively small community.

- need wayy more maps. After about a month it's already stale. Go take the maps in mech4 and just update those with mwo engine.

- unbalanced mechs. Some are just far superior to others. I get that, it kind of makes sense as an f16 isn't going to beat an f22 but will kill a mig19 easily. However this just creates a situation where everyone is playing the same few mechs. Why even bother with so many mechs in the game when they aren't viable to play.

- mechs need more HP/armor. When you get focused you die in like 2-3 seconds. This shouldn't be counterstrike, it's mechwarrior. Reduce all weapon damage by 25 percent and you'll have more meaningful matches. Plus these robots will actually feel like metal instead of paper.

- faction play is fun but lopsided. Organised groups stomping randoms is hardly interesting for either side. Separate the matchmaking.

Nevertheless I'm glad pgi was able to put together this fun little waste of time. I enjoy tweaking with builds and coming up with some weird **** then testing them out on the general populace.

Edited by hellbringer, 17 January 2018 - 09:56 PM.


#2 El Bandito

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Posted 18 January 2018 - 12:29 AM

Glad you picked it up; we need more players as is. As for your points, there are many who would agree with you, and they already made huge amounts of threads regarding that. PGI does what they pleases, though.

#3 Asym

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Posted 18 January 2018 - 06:21 AM

View Posthellbringer, on 17 January 2018 - 09:53 PM, said:


- unbalanced mechs. . Why even bother with so many mechs in the game when they aren't viable to play.

- mechs need more HP/armor. When you get focused you die in like 2-3 seconds. This shouldn't be counterstrike, it's mechwarrior. Reduce all weapon damage by 25 percent and you'll have more meaningful matches. Plus these robots will actually feel like metal instead of paper.

- faction play is fun but lopsided. Organised groups stomping randoms is hardly interesting for either side. Separate the matchmaking.



I've said this a lot lately and PGI has heard it and it's where they are going to with Solaris coming up... Lethality is being neutered to the point Solaris will work. Right now, if Solaris dropped, a vast majority of players would quit....

Parts of my team talked about this last night in another game (since we aren't playing MWO very much) and the concensus is that we'll not be back for Solaris nor MWO anytime soon. The game is being reduced to the OP three topic points and they are killing or marginalizing the game.. PGI needs to listen or there will be no one to listen to !

#4 Kotzi

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Posted 18 January 2018 - 06:31 AM

Unfortunately you cant seperate FP queues. There are not enough players. Been there done that.

#5 Khobai

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Posted 18 January 2018 - 07:26 AM

Quote

Unfortunately you cant seperate FP queues. There are not enough players. Been there done that.


Actually they can. And they need to. If wait times are longer so be it.

From a pug perspective, its better to wait longer for a match you can potentially win than to wait shorter for match you can never win.

Also did it ever occur to you if they fixed why people dont play FP, more people might play it?

The three big reasons being:
-Pug vs Premade sealclubbing
-Rewards suck for losing because contract bonuses only pay out on wins
-IS vs Clan balance sucks

Edited by Khobai, 18 January 2018 - 07:32 AM.


#6 ForceUser

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Posted 18 January 2018 - 08:18 AM

View Posthellbringer, on 17 January 2018 - 09:53 PM, said:

I started this game in seriousness last month. Was kind of bored and finally upgraded the old gfx card to a gtx1050. I registered for mwo when it was still beta, but since my comp was ******, I didn't play much.

After about a month I got a nice stable of mechs. Spent about roughly 30 bucks and I'm enjoying my time in tier 3. I've noticed a few things that I think might attract more people to this relatively small community.

Grats on finally getting a decent machine and welcome.

Quote

- need wayy more maps. After about a month it's already stale. Go take the maps in mech4 and just update those with mwo engine.

We got a new map (rubelite), end of last year and we're gtting Solaris City (not to be confused with Solaris7) in a month or two (March I think). Unfortunately there is zero way to just 'take the maps in mech4 and just update those with mwo engine.' That's not how any of this has or ever will work. They could maybe try and copy them although it's still 3months+ per map. The bigger problem though is that the added support required per map eats a certain amount of monthly 'bandwitdh'(work hours) to maintain be it improving geometry, adding optimization passes, game modes, fixing bugs or glitches found by the community, etc. The MWO maps are 10 times more detailed than MW4 maps ever were.

Part of the problem you're seeing is that people do tend to vote for specific maps for most of the time and certain game modes as well. On the one hand this allows people to play the maps they want and on the other it does make it feel like there is reduced map variety.

Quote

- unbalanced mechs. Some are just far superior to others. I get that, it kind of makes sense as an f16 isn't going to beat an f22 but will kill a mig19 easily. However this just creates a situation where everyone is playing the same few mechs. Why even bother with so many mechs in the game when they aren't viable to play.

- mechs need more HP/armor. When you get focused you die in like 2-3 seconds. This shouldn't be counterstrike, it's mechwarrior. Reduce all weapon damage by 25 percent and you'll have more meaningful matches. Plus these robots will actually feel like metal instead of paper.

The mech variety is better than it has ever been in the history of MWO, as much as people would like to claim otherwise. At least it is in T1 whenever I make a concious effort to check. It's rare to see more than 2 of any one chassis on a team (and even that is pretty rare) unless there is some event running or a patch is out (new mech is out pre-order or CBills). I attribute this to players in T1 being able to play more mechs competently and less LRM boats in general running around so you tend to see a wider range of weaponry used.

Also the current 'king' of mechs, the Madcat MkII isn't particularly better performing across all tiers than most other clan assaults like the Marauder IIC or the Supernova. That comes directly from PGI. Now some of the mroe salty people will straight up say they're lying because.. reasons? But since none of those reasons have a shred of credibility or proof I'd probably er on the side of them being decently balanced. That said the Madcat MkII did just come out for cbills so they'll be monitoring it specifically for the next few months as more people master them so we might see changes in a month or two if they're actually a problem.

If you feel certain mechs you're fighting against is OP, try finding out what the meta builds for those mechs are and see for yourself if the mech is actually OP or if you're just facing people in those mechs with higher skill. Skill is something you'll build up over time as you get a better handle of every weapon and meta build in the game. The build variety is pretty good atm as well. I've been playing a LOT of IS mechs recently and my stats are not taking a hit in any way so I'm not really on board with the whole 'clams OP nerf plz' mantra.

Keep in mind that over the last year or so there has been a push to give mechs a bit more of a role flavour in that some mechs are more tanky while others are more agile, where you are expected to be able to take more hits in some mechs while in others you're expected to dodge more shots. Work on your situational awareness, use of terrain and give Radar Deprivation or even ECM(+skills) a try and you'll notice you'll live longer and take fewer hits. It does very much come own to building the mech to it's strengths and making use of the (underrated IMHO) range nodes in the skill tree as well as the Survival tree(very much worth it).

Quote

- faction play is fun but lopsided. Organised groups stomping randoms is hardly interesting for either side. Separate the matchmaking.

Nevertheless I'm glad pgi was able to put together this fun little waste of time. I enjoy tweaking with builds and coming up with some weird **** then testing them out on the general populace.

Faction Play is and always will be for organised groups. It's just the nature of the game mode with it being the only real 'end game'. Those super serious players need to have some kind of outlet and Quick Play is already segregated between groups and solo players. There just isn't enough players to do the same in FP, especially not with the kind of time commitment required. The match length eats heavily into the viability of increasing the number of modes in FP as even with the same amount of players you'd still have far fewer matches per hour so people would have to wait even longer. And there is one universal truth, most people will not wait for very long for a match and thinking they will shows a gross ignorance of human nature(not you, some other people in the thread).

Hope you continue to enjoy the game and the community and don't be afraid of giving meta(really just better) builds a try. It will not irrevocably corrupt your soul. That's just propaganda from people that blame meta builds for their own lack of skill and pathetic performance because heaven forbid they take responsibility for their own choices amirite Posted Image

#7 MechaBattler

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Posted 18 January 2018 - 11:15 AM

The map situation would be helped if voting didn't see the same three to four maps. People want to drop in places that are optimal to their builds. So I rarely see certain maps. There's supposed to be a new city map coming. But if people don't find it meets their build needs, we won't get much of it. : /

As for some mechs being better than others. A problem which is compounded by some builds being better than other builds. There's only so much they can do for certain mechs. And only so many balance changes they can make to weapons to make up for inferior builds.

As for mechs dying fast. You get focused by 3 people. That's gonna happen regardless. Even just two people well above your weight can chew through you depending on the weapons. I roll in the Archer with big armor quirks and survival tree nearly max. If three assaults are around the corner I'm still gonna have a bad day. But it does have a lot to do with weapon convergence. But that's a dead horse.

#8 Hellbringer

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Posted 18 January 2018 - 12:22 PM

i dont even know what meta means ( i think it means popular competitive builds) but im not sure where to get those builds from.

I recently bought a kintaro and its honestly garbage.. like seriously garbage. I do like the missile flap (weapon bay door) that i can open and close for ha ha's. Hitboxes on it are a joke, but running XL's seem to be great. Been doing some weird stuff like 3 medium lasers, MRM30.

Edited by hellbringer, 18 January 2018 - 12:22 PM.


#9 Grus

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Posted 18 January 2018 - 12:29 PM

It really depends on if you win the PUG lottery in FP if you'll win fighting a "team/unit" because it goes both ways. teams do win against pugs and should due to them playing with each other and understanding who does what when and why. But pugs do and can win against "premades".

#10 Humpday

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Posted 18 January 2018 - 12:38 PM

I wish they'd put more effort into compiling meaningful statistics.

Separating Group stats from Solo stats.
Have a working system to per weapon stats
Ability to have stats on multiple variations of the same chassis
Ability to reset per-chassis stats.
Range aggregation to see what range you are engaging from. ect ect ect...

#11 MechaBattler

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Posted 18 January 2018 - 12:46 PM

The Kintaro has armor quirks. I definitely recommend getting all of the armor skills in the Survival Skill web. Personally I would have gone with a light engine and SRMs. I don't think the hitboxes on the Kintaro are especially bad. So perhaps it's the XL that's making you think it's squishy.

#12 Cementi

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Posted 18 January 2018 - 12:52 PM

View PostKotzi, on 18 January 2018 - 06:31 AM, said:

Unfortunately you cant seperate FP queues. There are not enough players. Been there done that.


Actually if I recall correctly (and I may not please feel free to correct me) what they did was separeate the ques into people with unit tags and people without. So it was never a true test of solo que vs group que.

#13 Cementi

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Posted 18 January 2018 - 12:58 PM

View PostKhobai, on 18 January 2018 - 07:26 AM, said:


Also did it ever occur to you if they fixed why people dont play FP, more people might play it?

The three big reasons being:
-Pug vs Premade sealclubbing
-Rewards suck for losing because contract bonuses only pay out on wins
-IS vs Clan balance sucks


I could live with point 1 and even 3 (though I have accepted that PGI are clan fanboys) if 2 was not true. Fact is even ignoring the que time I could go on a loss streak and still earn more cbills in several QP matches than I could in a FP loss that both take up the same play time.

FP is a complete waste of time unless your the one clubbing seals and even then it is not alot of fun. I find it boring pinning a bunch of people up in the drop zones and picking them off as they trickle in. Maybe its the sportsmanship that was drilled into me when playing hockey as a kid but running up the score is douchy and I hated doing it on top of it being boring. I gave up after a few times my unit bashed me for trying to get them to back off and let the other group form up some kind of cohesive resistance. Thats pretty much when I stopped playing FP.

#14 Mcgral18

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Posted 18 January 2018 - 02:17 PM

View PostCementi, on 18 January 2018 - 12:52 PM, said:


Actually if I recall correctly (and I may not please feel free to correct me) what they did was separeate the ques into people with unit tags and people without. So it was never a true test of solo que vs group que.


And with ALL the buckets


The current implementation (of few Buckets) is what the Solo CW queue should have had in the first place

They did a bad test, said it didn't work, and gave up

#15 TLBFestus

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Posted 18 January 2018 - 02:42 PM

Don't get too worked up about new maps, they are rare and seldom seen these days.

Just look at the now LOCKED necro'd thread about new maps that is currently on the top of the forums at the moment.

At first PGI claimed that they were going to provide us with a new map every month or 2.

Then they claimed they were very expensive to make ($250k?), yet seeming just tossed all that money away in the players eyes.

Finally they when 12v12 and started producing a few new maps for the larger number of players, but for reasons only understood in the mind of Russel Bullock, they simply threw away the originals even if the community begged for them back to add some diversity to the game.

Then they responded to the community and produced the abortion that is Faction Play (nee Community Warfare) and wasted time creating bottle-necked maps for it when the bread and butter of this game has always been Quick Play.

Finally they just seem to have given up on new maps almost completely. Yes, they did come out with the latest map a month or two ago, and there is word of another on the horizon (read 3 months from now if you are lucky), but new maps are NOT on PGIs priority list...cus...you know MW5.

That's just addressing your initial comment. The rest is just more of the same. The only thing PGI and Russ care about is your wallet, and they've discovered a vein of blind, unwavering support that they can milk with relatively little effort, so why bother trying any harder?

Edited by TLBFestus, 18 January 2018 - 10:15 PM.






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