19 replies to this topic

[Armored Yokai]

All stock mechs should receive CDR/Heat/Duration/Pojectile speed bonuses, unless they are already efficient as stock.

Like give the CN9-A 75% CD or Urbanmech bonus ammo and 80% cd
but if they are like a stock supernova with 6 erll then no

Edited by Armored Yokai, 23 January 2018 - 07:44 PM.

[The6thMessenger]

Armored Yokai, on 23 January 2018 - 07:40 PM, said:

but if they are like a stock supernova with 6 erll then no

Lol. You want stock, yet not stock supernova, way to be impartial.

[Armored Yokai]

The6thMessenger, on 23 January 2018 - 07:50 PM, said:

Lol. You want stock, yet not stock supernova, way to be impartial.

It's really powerful and they can just sit back and poke, you want them to deal tons more?

[Captain Polux]

Why?

[Kin3ticX]

Armored Yokai, on 23 January 2018 - 07:40 PM, said:

All stock mechs should receive CDR/Heat/Duration/Pojectile speed bonuses, unless they are already efficient as stock.

Like give the CN9-A 75% CD or Urbanmech bonus ammo and 80% cd
but if they are like a stock supernova with 6 erll then no

I think quirk amplitudes above 20-25% start to get silly. Its possible to come up with a reverse boating system that would soft buff bracket builds but it would be messy on the level of infotech and power draw, both of which axe'd.

[El Bandito]

In a game that prides itself on customization, promoting stock build is not something I agree with. That said, PGI already gives quirks to mechs corresponding to their stock weapons.

Edited by El Bandito, 23 January 2018 - 08:15 PM.

[The6thMessenger]

Armored Yokai, on 23 January 2018 - 07:52 PM, said:

It's really powerful and they can just sit back and poke, you want them to deal tons more?

That was the point of the stock build of the Supernova. Why the hell are you bellyaching about that?

You want to be like TT, but you want it still be FPS MWO -- that defeats the point.

[WrathOfDeadguy]

Stock 'Mechs should only get bonuses if all the 'Mechs are stock, and only then to the degree that they suck eggs compared to better stock builds.

There is no amount of buffing that will make stock 'Mechs compete with custom builds. Ever.

[Wil McCullough]

Armored Yokai, on 23 January 2018 - 07:40 PM, said:

All stock mechs should receive CDR/Heat/Duration/Pojectile speed bonuses, unless they are already efficient as stock.

Like give the CN9-A 75% CD or Urbanmech bonus ammo and 80% cd
but if they are like a stock supernova with 6 erll then no

Reminds me of that joke about how i'm against racism because racism is a crime and crime is for blacks.

[Khobai]

signature hardpoints have been proposed before as a way to encourage players to play mechs more like the lore intends.

essentially mechs would get bonus weapon quirks if they equip their stock weapons in their proper stock hardpoint locations.

its similar to the idea of sized hardpoints but more specific.

Quote

In a game that prides itself on customization, promoting stock build is not something I agree with. That said, PGI already gives quirks to mechs corresponding to their stock weapons.

too much customization is also bad though

we have too many mechs that are either inferior or way too similar to other mechs

the mechs need to be differentiated more and signature hardpoints are one possible way of doing that

signature hardpoints can also help encourage mixed loadouts. because boating has gotten pretty out of hand.

Edited by Khobai, 23 January 2018 - 10:08 PM.

[Gas Guzzler]

Lolno

[ANOM O MECH]

Khobai, on 23 January 2018 - 09:56 PM, said:

signature hardpoints have been proposed before as a way to encourage players to play mechs more like the lore intends.

essentially mechs would get bonus weapon quirks if they equip their stock weapons in their proper stock hardpoint locations.

its similar to the idea of sized hardpoints but more specific.



too much customization is also bad though

we have too many mechs that are either inferior or way too similar to other mechs

the mechs need to be differentiated more and signature hardpoints are one possible way of doing that

signature hardpoints can also help encourage mixed loadouts. because boating has gotten pretty out of hand.

I don't agree that something lore means that is what people should be doing.

Forgive me for my ignorance on the subject but wasn't there min/maxing meta in TT? I have heard people talking about it in TS. There was customization too right?

Really don't think that the creators of Battletech we thinking very much about anything such as mounts. They really should have though looking at the art from Sarna. Lots of mechs look ridiculous and of coarse would have a hard time navigating the world which is more or less what the video game is showing. Think of a tank and where it's mounts are.

So it is quite possible in many ways that lore is wrong. Wrong because in a game or sim, there original designs don't work. Well not at least if you can't actually lift up and aim your arms properly at least.

Since we can't move our arms, being able to put ppc's in my Whammy chest (sorry tbh I don't run that weapon on them at all) is being able to over come that shortcoming and possible design flaw.

[Khobai]

Quote

Since we can't move our arms, being able to put ppc's in my Whammy chest (sorry tbh I don't run that weapon on them at all) is being able to over come that shortcoming and possible design flaw.

yeah but if the warhammer gave you bonuses for putting them where theyre supposed to be, then youd at least have choices

do you put them in the arms where theyre supposed to go and get extra PPC bonuses?

or do you forego the bonuses and put them in the chest to overcome the disadvantage of them being in the arms?

right now theres no choice. theres no incentive to put them in the arms

the advantage of signature hardpoints is that theyre purely OPTIONAL. they dont punish you if you dont use them. they only reward you if you do.

Edited by Khobai, 24 January 2018 - 12:36 AM.

[adamts01]

OP: Totally agree. The game needs variety, and this would make lore guys happy. If mixed loadouts change meta, then great.

The6thMessenger, on 23 January 2018 - 08:12 PM, said:

That was the point of the stock build of the Supernova. Why the hell are you bellyaching about that?

You want to be like TT, but you want it still be FPS MWO -- that defeats the point.

Aside from jump jets and a little armor, that mech is one of the very few which is already meta, it doesn't need the help. Same as all other quirks, some mechs need more than others.

El Bandito, on 23 January 2018 - 08:11 PM, said:

In a game that prides itself on customization, promoting stock build is not something I agree with. That said, PGI already gives quirks to mechs corresponding to their stock weapons.

Sure, but what harm would it do to let lore builds be competitive? I wouldn't likely use any of them, but it's not that much work and would make plenty of people happy. In the end it would just add variety to the game, and I'm all for that, especially if that variety promotes mixed builds.

[El Bandito]

adamts01, on 23 January 2018 - 11:20 PM, said:

Sure, but what harm would it do to let lore builds be competitive? I wouldn't likely use any of them, but it's not that much work and would make plenty of people happy. In the end it would just add variety to the game, and I'm all for that, especially if that variety promotes mixed builds.

Except some lore builds have half armor and/or a ton of ammo for a gun. You wanna buff them while factoring that?

[WrathOfDeadguy]

El Bandito, on 23 January 2018 - 11:47 PM, said:

Except some lore builds have half armor and/or a ton of ammo for a gun. You wanna buff them while factoring that?

Or, in some cases, a ton of ammo for more than one gun. Stock RFL-3N has 1t split between two AC5s; stock PIR-1 has one ton split between twelve MGs. They're not even the worst examples.

[adamts01]

El Bandito, on 23 January 2018 - 11:47 PM, said:

Except some lore builds have half armor and/or a ton of ammo for a gun. You wanna buff them while factoring that?

Sure. Armor should be cranked up and ammo should be adequate. If that means negative quirks to keep a mech from being OP then so be it. It could work. I can't think of any mechs that would need negative quirks though, especially on the IS side of things. Take the Rifleman 3-N for example. It has decent guns, but the speed of an assault, armor of a light, and 1 ton of ammo split between two AC5s. It could get max armor, 400% ammo, and it would still probably need cooling quirks to be competitive.

[El Bandito]

adamts01, on 24 January 2018 - 12:11 AM, said:

Sure. Armor should be cranked up and ammo should be adequate. If that means negative quirks to keep a mech from being OP then so be it. It could work. I can't think of any mechs that would need negative quirks though, especially on the IS side of things. Take the Rifleman 3-N for example. It has decent guns, but the speed of an assault, armor of a light, and 1 ton of ammo split between two AC5s. It could get max armor, 400% ammo, and it would still probably need cooling quirks to be competitive.

Sounds like too much work for little return, with the risk of prolonging the imbalance.

[adamts01]

El Bandito, on 24 January 2018 - 12:14 AM, said:

Sounds like too much work for little return, with the risk of prolonging the imbalance.

Yeah, this is PGI after all. But look at the example I gave you, that was a quick glance and I bet it would be ballpark. I think these mechs would be infinitely easier to balance because there aren't any weird combinations that players could come up with, which is the gimmicky thing that makes current quirks such a pain. Plus, we know that armor, ammo and cooling modifiers are easy enough due to the skill tree. I think it would be worth it.

[BumbleBee]

I'd even be happy with a checkbox or button next to the LAUNCH button for Launch as Stock and it applies a set of quirks to the Mech for the match. Not as good as the example of the Warhammers PPCs, but a decent stopgap measure

It wouldn't even matter if people still had all the components to rebuild it's stock config