50 replies to this topic

[justcallme A S H]

Yeonne Greene, on 23 January 2018 - 11:30 PM, said:

You have a perpetual hang-up with focusing on single, independent weapon systems instead of the complete builds they are going to be a part of.

Let me know when you get over that and then we can have a productive conversation.

Yep...

[FLG 01]

Hm, I am not above saying I was wrong when I was wrong... and I was wrong about the LGR. It plain needs a damage increase.

I had some time testing now, and the damage output is really the main problem. Some builds can work well enough, like the massively quirked Rifleman with dual LGR, but overall it is still a too weak weapon.

[The6thMessenger]

FLG 01, on 24 January 2018 - 05:56 PM, said:

Hm, I am not above saying I was wrong when I was wrong... and I was wrong about the LGR. It plain needs a damage increase.

I had some time testing now, and the damage output is really the main problem. Some builds can work well enough, like the massively quirked Rifleman with dual LGR, but overall it is still a too weak weapon.

Hopefully we don't get that 10 damage 4.0s + 0.5s of Khobai, cause that's just worse.

[Water Bear]

The LGR is not good. But if you want it to work, you have to play it like you play a GR. Backed up with ER lasers of some kind. I just got some crazy damage using 6 ERML + 2 LGR.

Edit: Current record with that build: 990 damage + 7 kills.

Edited by Water Bear, 24 January 2018 - 07:06 PM.

[Khobai]

Quote

Hopefully we don't get that 10 damage 4.0s + 0.5s of Khobai, cause that's just worse.

but thats what well get

youre either getting 10 damage or fast firing but not both

[Y E O N N E]

Water Bear, on 24 January 2018 - 06:50 PM, said:

The LGR is not good. But if you want it to work, you have to play it like you play a GR. Backed up with ER lasers of some kind. I just got some crazy damage using 6 ERML + 2 LGR.

Yup.

A Warhammer-6R built this way was actually solid before the patch, now it should be quite good. I imagine a whole bunch of these in FP would fill the air with such a hail-storm of cold-running projectiles that pushes could be stopped much more reliably than with the 2GR+4ERML build.

[The6thMessenger]

Khobai, on 24 January 2018 - 06:52 PM, said:

but thats what well get

youre either getting 10 damage or fast firing but not both

Nope, we'll get both 10 damage and fast firing. On the same basis as yours, cause we're both PGI and we both say so.

[Khobai]

Quote

Nope, we'll get both 10 damage and fast firing. On the same basis as yours, cause we're both PGI and we both say so.

Its not the same basis as mine. My basis comes from trends in recent patch notes.

Look at all the long range weapons that do 10+ damage that have been nerfed recently. Theyve all had their cooldowns increased. ERLL, CERPC, etc... PGI obviously wants to limit how much damage long range weapons can do before brawlers close the distance with them. Its obvious.

So youre not going to get a 10 damage light gauss with rapid fire. Because that goes against how PGI has been trying to balance the game to give brawlers more of a place.

[Water Bear]

Yeonne Greene, on 24 January 2018 - 06:52 PM, said:

Yup.

A Warhammer-6R built this way was actually solid before the patch, now it should be quite good. I imagine a whole bunch of these in FP would fill the air with such a hail-storm of cold-running projectiles that pushes could be stopped much more reliably than with the 2GR+4ERML build.

Oddly enough, that's precisely what I'm using WHM-6R.

And yes, the trick here is heat-adjusted DPS. Most people get fixated on DPS but that's not the actual average damage you do over time, once a fight gets...involved. Yes gauss rifles have long range and all that but their real utility in my mind is that they add a more or less fixed amount to your HDPS, equal to their DPS.

[The6thMessenger]

Khobai, on 24 January 2018 - 07:14 PM, said:

Its not the same basis as mine. My basis comes from trends in recent patch notes.

No it's not, it's just your own bias.

Khobai, on 24 January 2018 - 07:14 PM, said:

Look at all the long range weapons that do 10+ damage that have been nerfed recently. Theyve all had their cooldowns increased. ERLL, CERPC, etc... PGI obviously wants to limit how much damage long range weapons can do before brawlers close the distance with them. Its obvious.

So youre not going to get a 10 damage light gauss with rapid fire. Because that goes against how PGI has been trying to balance the game to give brawlers more of a place.

So what? PGI has buffed LGR in the recent notes -- in Sept 19 and Jan 23, and because of that we can infer that PGI will buff the LGR as well. Obviously, PGI wanted LGR to be not trash of weapon, therefore we'll get another buff next patch -- because my suggestion doesn't go against what PGI has been trying -- to buff LGR to relevance.

I mean really, so what if C-MPL and C-ERPPC are nerfed? Where the hell were the other nerfs for the other long range weapons that were supposedly to give brawlers better chance? You'd think that if they were really giving brawlers better chance, they'd nerf every other long range weapons right? As if the C-ERPPC is the only long range weapon in the game.

No, only the C-ERPPC was nerfed for close range because it wasn't a nerf for long range engagement it was just a nerf on the C-ERPPC plain and simple. The C-MPL is nerfed so that it's on better par with IS-MPL. Never mind the fact that the two weapons are also much more popular and much more useful than the LGR, never mind the fact that the two are clan energy weapons whereas the LGR is an IS ballistic weapon. Never mind the fact that LGR was already a bad weapon to begin with.

Maybe you meant the Dec 12 patch notes? Nope, just the Clan ERLL having slight cooldown tweak and that is not to give brawlers chance but to just normalize between inner sphere counterpart. Where were the other long range nerf?

You mean Nov 14 patch notes? There's actually no buff or nerf with weapons there.

What about Oct 18? Nope, just the mediocre Medium Laser nerf for mid-range vomiting abuse with low-tonnage weapons. There's also ballistic buffs, also the missile lock nerf.

What about Sept 19? Heavy PPC got cooldown nerf to be brought in line with other PPFLD weapons -- where were the other long-range nerf? Hell LGR was also buffed here.

That is you and your one-dimensional thinking. That's you so desperate for it to be true, you'd cling on something so nebulous. You know what that is? That's confirmation bias. PGI will be evaluating a new set of data that they will get prior to the next patch, and they will apply changes accordingly. Don't hold your breath.

Edited by The6thMessenger, 24 January 2018 - 11:40 PM.

[Riitters]

Yeonne Greene, on 23 January 2018 - 07:38 PM, said:

The long range DPS with a pair and some ERLL is real.

Tried it on my Warhammer for a bit today. Still weak. 5x ERLL puts out more efficient damage at that range.
Swapped the LLs for an Erppc and 2ML and it played a little better, especially when ranges closed up.
Gonna try with 3lppc tomorrow.

Edited by Riitters, 24 January 2018 - 09:25 PM.