39 replies to this topic

[Variant1]

bring them back right NOW

and im not talking about those weak rear torso incursion turrets. Im talking about og assault turrets the ones that can take a beating and help a team pull through. AND bring back those lrm turrets too that can go through ecm. This is extra content taken out, this is a pve element that makes the game more fun.

i should have started chekin forums the day they were anouncing their removal i would be smakin down fools with facts.

make assault great again, bring back those turrets (and lrm turrets)

[Gamuray]

Were you there to experience what that game mode was like with the turrets in? It was REALLY REALLY stagnant... because the team that pushed would always be down on firepower... cuz their turrets weren't helping anymore. And in addition, it completely eliminated the 'I'm touching your base, get back here' strategy that can win matches by splitting the enemy force.. because strong turrets scare flanking mechs away.

Trust me, they were not beneficial to the mode.

[Trenchbird]

I'd say Streak 24 versions would be pretty good for defending DZ's in Community Warfare. Not enough to stop an offensive force that rolled the Defenders, but more than enough to keep lights honest.

LRM ones, though? Just get a few of the pro-LRM potatoes to go into Group Play with you. Trust me, you won't be able to tell the difference.

Edited by Catten Hart, 14 February 2018 - 05:24 PM.

[Variant1]

Gamuray, on 14 February 2018 - 05:17 PM, said:

Were you there to experience what that game mode was like with the turrets in? It was REALLY REALLY stagnant... because the team that pushed would always be down on firepower... cuz their turrets weren't helping anymore. And in addition, it completely eliminated the 'I'm touching your base, get back here' strategy that can win matches by splitting the enemy force.. because strong turrets scare flanking mechs away.

Trust me, they were not beneficial to the mode.

I was playing the original assault game mode and it was alot better with turrets. They were helpful but not an instant win tool, snipers could take them out from distance if the enemy team was camping at their base. It was however very handy for a team down by alot of mech since the enemy team would get confident and push in.
I think the exact opposite is true the enemy would split much faster due to the warning system, making the tactic even more effective since if the enemy team would not react they would lose their backup strat and lose by cap.

Catten Hart, on 14 February 2018 - 05:23 PM, said:

LRM ones, though? Just get a few of the pro-LRM potatoes to go into Group Play with you. Trust me, you won't be able to tell the difference.

Well the turrets went through ecm and didnt take player slots

Edited by Variant1, 14 February 2018 - 05:31 PM.

[Mystere]

Did a bunch of people again lose to a cap in Assault?

[Scout Derek]

Gamuray, on 14 February 2018 - 05:17 PM, said:

Were you there to experience what that game mode was like with the turrets in? It was REALLY REALLY stagnant... because the team that pushed would always be down on firepower... cuz their turrets weren't helping anymore. And in addition, it completely eliminated the 'I'm touching your base, get back here' strategy that can win matches by splitting the enemy force.. because strong turrets scare flanking mechs away.

Trust me, they were not beneficial to the mode.

LRM Turrets lul

Mystere, on 14 February 2018 - 06:57 PM, said:

Did a bunch of people again lose to a cap in Assault?

That's... how it usually goes. *shrugs*

[Khobai]

assault is too much like skirmish anyway

assault should be changed into an asymmetrical attacker/defender gamemode

one team gets a base with turrets

other team has to attack the base and maybe gets some npc vehicles to help balance out the defenders advantage

[Alexandra Hekmatyar]

Lrm turrets?
Plenty of those around if ya get what I'm saying!?

[Escef]

Variant1, on 14 February 2018 - 05:29 PM, said:

I was playing the original assault game mode and it was alot better with turrets.

So was I, and I HEARTILY disagree.

Turrets were added because people whined about fast movers capping the base early and making the match disappointingly short when no one went back to deal with it. (This was also back before HSR, IIRC; when a lone Jenner could solo 4 heavy mechs.)

Turrets made matches into horrible campfests, even worse than the sniper-meta of today does. The range on turrets made it such that the first mech to advance over the ridge on Caustic Valley or past the near edge of the citadel in River City got chewed up by turrets. And if the turrets didn't get you, the fact that they acted as sensor outposts meant that they called in LRM fire and and let the long range PPFLD guys know where to point their guns with minimal worry for instant return fire.

[Escef]

Khobai, on 14 February 2018 - 07:02 PM, said:

assault is too much like skirmish anyway

assault should be changed into an asymmetrical attacker/defender gamemode

one team gets a base with turrets

other team has to attack the base and maybe gets some npc vehicles to help balance out the defenders advantage

I wouldn't mind seeing this tried. Though I'd ditch the NPC vehicle idea. The defending team being tied to protecting a static point is an advantage for the attackers, they have the freedom to choose angle and range of engagement. That's immensely powerful.

[Khobai]

Quote

I wouldn't mind seeing this tried. Though I'd ditch the NPC vehicle idea. The defending team being tied to protecting a static point is an advantage for the attackers, they have the freedom to choose angle and range of engagement. That's immensely powerful.

but the defenders would also have turrets. attackers would need something to balance that out.

bringing npc siege vehicles with you to attack a base makes sense to me.

[Koniving]

Look, I miss the turrets a bit, too, but...

In the old setup PGI had too many individual turrets, with some really stagnant roles and abilities.

LRM turret.
Laser turret.
Different laser turret.

If you ever get a good look at a turret model, it has space for what looks like an LRM rack, an SRM rack, some energy...

So here's my proposal. Less turrets.
Reasonable but low to moderate turret health.
Higher firepower and weapon count. Turrets that sport LRMs, lasers, and SRMs or Streak SRMs.

Limited Ammunition. 1 ton of LRM and 1 ton of SRM ammunition and no more.
Heat generation and cooling. Laser turrets can overheat. When they overheat, they SHOULD collapse back into their protected state until cooled.
High speed collapse/deployment. If a Locust can stop on a dime from full speed and hit full speed on a quarter, then a turret should be able to pop up and drop just like them.

Fewer turrets with low to moderate health, limited ammo and heat generation concerns.
Said turrets packing significantly more firepower, viable at many ranges.
Multiple preset turret arrangements selected by a random number generator (so say if there's 4 different arrangements, this match might use arrangement 3, that match might use arrangement 1, etc.) Reduces the min/maxing of skilled turret elimination.

[Variant1]

Mystere, on 14 February 2018 - 06:57 PM, said:

Did a bunch of people again lose to a cap in Assault?

believe it or not people lost to cap when there were turrets too

Scout Derek, on 14 February 2018 - 06:58 PM, said:

LRM Turrets lul

i take it you did not play that assault mode?

Lady Alexandra Cousland, on 14 February 2018 - 07:05 PM, said:

Lrm turrets?
Plenty of those around if ya get what I'm saying!?

haha nice one, but they cant shoot through ecm

Escef, on 14 February 2018 - 07:08 PM, said:

So was I, and I HEARTILY disagree.

Turrets were added because people whined about fast movers capping the base early and making the match disappointingly short when no one went back to deal with it. (This was also back before HSR, IIRC; when a lone Jenner could solo 4 heavy mechs.)

Turrets made matches into horrible campfests, even worse than the sniper-meta of today does. The range on turrets made it such that the first mech to advance over the ridge on Caustic Valley or past the near edge of the citadel in River City got chewed up by turrets. And if the turrets didn't get you, the fact that they acted as sensor outposts meant that they called in LRM fire and and let the long range PPFLD guys know where to point their guns with minimal worry for instant return fire.

Even without turrets people defended the base when it was being capped but that was still a valid point since capping doesnt give as much earning as destroying mechs.

The campfests happened rarely and only sometimes when the winning team didnt want to risk attacking the enemy base during close matches. Old caustic and river were much more intersting with them back then, today should be a problem due to map size increase. Im pretty sure the turrets couldnt light up targets on the map.

Turrets are more content, mechwarrior benefits with pve content like turrets tanks infantry and aircraft it wouldnt be as great of an experience playing without them. MWO seriosuly needs more pve content to mix things up a bit, and the turrets in assault made the bases feel like bases

Edited by Variant1, 14 February 2018 - 07:17 PM.

[Koniving]

Khobai, on 14 February 2018 - 07:13 PM, said:

but the defenders would also have turrets. attackers would need something to balance that out.

bringing npc siege vehicles with you to attack a base makes sense to me.

This is a joke and not serious, but...

Awesome 8Q is dubbed a Siege Mech as it is best used to bring down enemy defenses, gates and walls in Battletech.
NPC Awesome 8Q... with the 5 minute Awesome build from the first Quirkening (where an Awesome could chain fire 3 PPCs non-stop for 5 minutes straight on Alpine before reaching 98%, stop firing for 3 to 5 seconds and it's dropped down to less than 40% heat, keep going until the match ends.)


(Said awesome had to boat standard heatsinks, had only 214 armor with MOST of it on the CT for obvious reasons at the time [nobody tried shooting anywhere else]...but damn.)

I'd love the idea of a siege vehicle (or a few) to escort, this actually requires the defending team to send out some sort of raiding party to try and eliminate these once they enter into the field. Once the current siege weapon is eliminated, the raiding party would likely need to quickly retreat back into the defensive perimeter through small gates likely guarded by the big dogs in the field. Have a new siege vehicle or two or three brought into the area every so many minutes [don't have it be an even amount of time or it'll get too...procedural. Allow siege vehicles to overlap if not destroyed. Siege vehicles wouldn't be required to get into the base to destroy it, but would make it a lot easier to do as opposed to any other method, provided siege vehicles aren't destroyed in transit].

Imagine if one of these could take down the gate in the Invasion game mode by outright destroying the gate. Or could blast a hole into any of the walls, even when the mechs themselves could not...

Edited by Koniving, 14 February 2018 - 07:23 PM.

[Escef]

Variant1, on 14 February 2018 - 07:17 PM, said:

The campfests happened rarely...

[Variant1]

Escef, on 14 February 2018 - 07:33 PM, said:

https://youtu.be/yvllQl5t4Ww

[sycocys]

In my opinion assault should have been more or less what FW counter-attack turned out to be, but with forced lance lanes.

Would have been totally fine with inactive turrets that the defenders ejected into after they fell as a final hopeful stand to prevent the base from being overrun.

[Kiiyor]

Gamuray, on 14 February 2018 - 05:17 PM, said:

Were you there to experience what that game mode was like with the turrets in? It was REALLY REALLY stagnant... because the team that pushed would always be down on firepower... cuz their turrets weren't helping anymore. And in addition, it completely eliminated the 'I'm touching your base, get back here' strategy that can win matches by splitting the enemy force.. because strong turrets scare flanking mechs away.

Trust me, they were not beneficial to the mode.

Yep, this.

The trouble with any mode that allows additional firepower when defending (aside from incursion, because the bases are ridiculous) is that it promotes camping in a game where defending is already a very strong tactic.

I'd be happy to see different sorts of turrets being fielded. LRM turrets were awesome. Imagine fighting a shorter range AC20 turret, or a PPC turret.

I'd be happier again if you were able to disable those turrets somehow by attacking a generator or something.

[Scout Derek]

Variant1, on 14 February 2018 - 07:17 PM, said:

i take it you did not play that assault mode?

No, No I have not. /s

LRM turrets are a meme.

[N0ni]

"My team lost because of base rushers" *thread*

"My team is scared to scratch paint so they hide behind turrets" *thread*

"My team won't play the objective and instead wins by skirmish" *thread*

"This mode sucks because they removed turrets partly due to multiple complaint threads" *thread*

"I lost to a base cap again, we need turrets back" *thread*

"I lost to a base cap WITH turrets, lights are OP" *thread*

"This mode isn't done the way i want it to work therefore we need to fix it" *thread*


Drinks are on me bois, put it on my tab.