8 replies to this topic

[Brain Cancer]

So, silly me I was thinking: Why not strap a Mad Dog with 6 ATM 3's and a few big lasers, go to town, have fun. It's only 18 missile tubes, right?

Well, the second ATM #5 gets on there, the ghost heat warning kicks in. Mind you, ATM 3's actually already run hotter per launcher than larger ones.

That's 15 tubes. OK, howabout four ATM 6? Nope, ghost heating again once we past tube #18.

Meanwhile, I can strap on 3 ATM 9's for 27 tubes (or two for 18) and no ghost heat, or even 2 ATM 12's for 24 tubes...and no extra heat.

27 tubes in ATM 3's is 57 heat. It's 21 heat using ATM 9's.(if you're mimicking 2 ATM 12's, it's 43 heat vs 18 heat.) Is saving a small amount of weight (and losing a lot of space, as even 4 ATM 3 vs a single ATM 12 is 8 crits and 6 tons vs 5 crits and 7 tons) really supposed to punish using a lot of hardpoints and space by roasting the firer extra-crispy like this? It's not like smaller ATMs fire faster, unlike SRM/LRM.

Edited by Brain Cancer, 14 March 2018 - 02:31 PM.

[Bud Crue]

In answer to your last question: yes it is really supposed to punish you.
MRMs perform similarly (build various combos to make an MRM 50 and you will see what I mean). Given the consistency of this sort of “saving a small amount of weight...punish” mechanism in these two systems suggests to me that it is an intentional and perhaps even reasonable one.

That being said, I find it irritatating too. Trying to shove as many MRMs into my Zeuses brought it home for me in the same way you are encountering it with ATMs in your Maddog.

[El Bandito]

PGI doesn't like people boating weapons, not matter how small those weapons actually are. Just gotta deal with it.

[FupDup]

El Bandito, on 14 March 2018 - 05:25 PM, said:

PGI doesn't like people boating weapons, not matter how small those weapons actually are. Just gotta deal with it.

Back when the small weapons like the LRM5 were more efficient, having lower max Ghost Heat thresholds could be argued as a fair counter-balance to still give big launchers a time to shine (both had some pros/cons). The problem is that PGI then normalized the crap out of missiles but forgot to adjust the low GH caps on small launchers.

It's gotta be one or the other. Either small launchers get to be very efficient per piece at the cost of a low GH cap, or they need to have a similar GH damage cap as the big launchers if they don't have any tradeoffs to justify a low cap.

[Khobai]

ATM3 really shouldnt be in the same ghost heat group as the other ATMs. its just not necessary.

[Brain Cancer]

It's even worse with ATMs. They all have the same ROF, with the only real difference is ATM3's are less heat efficient and ATM 12's have a marginally higher spread than the other 3.

The difference in GH per launcher seems to be a vestige of what normally happens with SRMs or LRMs, where cooldown and such differs by launcher so in theory, you could get some faster fire out of 3x SRM 2 vs. 1x6.

[Seranov]

It's to prevent people from using the smaller ATM launchers, which is for their own good.

[El Bandito]

FupDup, on 14 March 2018 - 05:33 PM, said:

Back when the small weapons like the LRM5 were more efficient, having lower max Ghost Heat thresholds could be argued as a fair counter-balance to still give big launchers a time to shine (both had some pros/cons). The problem is that PGI then normalized the crap out of missiles but forgot to adjust the low GH caps on small launchers.

It's gotta be one or the other. Either small launchers get to be very efficient per piece at the cost of a low GH cap, or they need to have a similar GH damage cap as the big launchers if they don't have any tradeoffs to justify a low cap.

I am more pissed at PGI for linking LRM5 GH with other launchers. GH LRM5 all you want, but don't link the penalty, FFS.

[Brain Cancer]

Seranov, on 14 March 2018 - 05:49 PM, said:

It's to prevent people from using the smaller ATM launchers, which is for their own good.

If I've got an Arctic Wolf with that many missile hardpoints, it'd be nice to be able to dump 24 missiles on something please and thank you very much.

Yeah, they're weak to AMS due to low tube count. And the GH being as messed up as it is prevents people from using massed launchers to overcome it, if they desired.