39 replies to this topic

[DerHuhnTeufel]

Dogstar, on 22 March 2018 - 12:47 AM, said:

Except that SRM boats rely on other mechs to get in close, just like LRM boats rely on other mechs to get locks.

The OP was blaming everyone else for the same fault he was committing - relying on others to support a situational build

No, they don't. Especially not on HPG where there's tons of cover.

[Jackal Noble]

Krivvan, on 22 March 2018 - 12:33 AM, said:

On a side note, you can easily add 4 more SRM2s to that build without sacrificing much of anything. The Arctic Wolf with only 4 SRM4 is pretty lacking in firepower. I wouldn't have expected those volleys to have killed the rear CT even if they 100% registered on the CT.

He does that build so he can go 152 with it. Otherwise you have to add more arm armor when it's needed for ammo.

[Dogstar]

DerHuhnTeufel, on 22 March 2018 - 02:55 AM, said:

Especially not on HPG where there's tons of cover.

All you've done there is confirm my point - SRM boats are situational because they need some way to close the distance, just like LRM boats are situational because they need some way to get locks

Once again the point was that the OP was blaming others for making the same mistake he did.

[Damnedtroll]

Some time ago, was playing a kitfox with quad srm6 and seen that a lot of damage was just not registering. Just to test, played games with my SRM on chainfire and my damage gone up insanely....like doubled.

The same when firing multiple ppc or med laser, sometimes it look like it just count half of them...

You just need to fire more, your target have the same problems. So it's fair in the end.

Edited by Damnedtroll, 22 March 2018 - 04:40 AM.

[Nightbird]

Scout Derek, on 21 March 2018 - 08:21 PM, said:

Even if I was getting half damage, 16 damage per salvo should've killed it long ago. 16x3= 48 damage. more than enough to kill it if it WAS transferring damage to the CT.



5 SRMs triggers ghost heat. 4 SRMs do not.

48 damage would not be enough. A mad cat has comes with 58hp in it's CT. That yellow orange color it start out with is only slight damage, my guess 53hp left at least?

That is a close range build so I assume full survival tree so the true number should be around 65?

My suggestion is to add Artemis to improve spread.

[Duncan Aravain]

Nightbird, on 22 March 2018 - 05:28 AM, said:

48 damage would not be enough. A mad cat has comes with 58hp in it's CT. That yellow orange color it start out with is only slight damage, my guess 53hp left at least?

That is a close range build so I assume full survival tree so the true number should be around 65?

My suggestion is to add Artemis to improve spread.

Er, what MCM2 has 58hp on its REAR CT? The attacks he is complaining about not registering ccorrectly are the ones directed at the rear of the enemy. Hit registration in the game always seems to be a problem; from the beginning of MWO we have had an ebb and flow in its reliability depending on weapon systems and targeted mech. As a previous poster noted, chain firing appears to up the registered damage and certain mech hitboxes were faulty at introduction and PGI had to be clubbed with dozens of videos before they acknowledged their error. I think the current meta of many light mech boating 8+ machine guns with each round having to be analysed for effect has had a noticeable effect on the hit registration ability by the server. It is most frustrating when a shut down mech is targeted at under 100 meters and still runs off despite a carefully targeted volley or two at its weakspot.

Well, to paraphrase from The Curse of Oak island: " That's MWO for you".

[Scout Derek]

Teer Kerensky, on 22 March 2018 - 02:00 AM, said:

That's really odd config. We are talking about battlemech with 9 missile hardpoints, 40 tons with full customization. And you've only used 4 of them. You could use the omnimech versions of the mech for the same with fixed engine and ECM. Sure I can see you've made a novelty of really fast SRM boat.

Also I personally prefer having weapons in arms when it's an option, like with ACW-1, because you can aim faster and shoot more accurate.

More does not mean better Teer.

If you've seen how well I've been performing with it you'd be surprised. and a 152kph mech with 4srm4 is no slouch. it will get the work done if the missiles land where they are supposed to go.

[Scout Derek]

Krivvan, on 22 March 2018 - 12:33 AM, said:

On a side note, you can easily add 4 more SRM2s to that build without sacrificing much of anything. The Arctic Wolf with only 4 SRM4 is pretty lacking in firepower. I wouldn't have expected those volleys to have killed the rear CT even if they 100% registered on the CT.

lacking firepower yes but not in speed. I might consider dropping engine by one size to put in srm2s...

[LORD ORION]

I haven't played since December event and it was bad, but it is even worse right now.

[Dimento Graven]

What you are witnessing is PGI's "crit averse algorithm" they added for missles.

Essentially missiles will function as expected until internal armor is exposed allowing for potential crit hits. What happens then is the server suddenly starts significantly reducing the number of hits to those locations shifting the hits to locations that still have armor, to the point that sometimes locations impossible to hit start registering damage, or worse hits just cease registering at all.

For SRMs this is less noticable but for LRMs it can be seen more readily if you're paying attention.

It was done because of boating and the affect of multiple boats hitting a single target.

[mogs01gt]

Scout Derek, on 21 March 2018 - 07:55 PM, said:

missiles suck soo much in MWO. I cant tell if that just ******** mechanics or hit reg. But a similar situation happened to me the last time I played...and I havent played since. So ******* annoying.

Dimento Graven, on 22 March 2018 - 10:13 AM, said:

What you are witnessing is PGI's "crit averse algorithm" they added for missles.
Essentially missiles will function as expected until internal armor is exposed allowing for potential crit hits. What happens then is the server suddenly starts significantly reducing the number of hits to those locations shifting the hits to locations that still have armor, to the point that sometimes locations impossible to hit start registering damage, or worse hits just cease registering at all.
For SRMs this is less noticable but for LRMs it can be seen more readily if you're paying attention.
It was done because of boating and the affect of multiple boats hitting a single target.

got any proof on this? Sounds pretty outlandish.

Edited by mogs01gt, 22 March 2018 - 11:40 AM.

[Tiewolf]

Dogstar, on 22 March 2018 - 04:00 AM, said:

All you've done there is confirm my point - SRM boats are situational because they need some way to close the distance, just like LRM boats are situational because they need some way to get locks

Once again the point was that the OP was blaming others for making the same mistake he did.

LRM/ATM boats are dependent on the team because they have a minimum distance and are toast if the enemy manages to get close. They can and should get their own locks - no team needed. SRM boats on the other hand can protect themself. Did you realize that most games end in a brawl? Who decides if a game is turned around or lost? Brawlers maybe? What is a SRM boat? A good Brawler! Boating SRMs is no mistake. You are right, that they are better on some maps/contexts in the early phase of a game but they are allways effective if played right.

Edited by Tiewolf, 22 March 2018 - 12:24 PM.

[Dimento Graven]

mogs01gt, on 22 March 2018 - 11:26 AM, said:

...

got any proof on this? Sounds pretty outlandish.

At one time I was making a vid about it but then in one of PGIs Town Halls about 3 or 4 years ago after one of the many LRM-ageddons Russ stated something very similar to this so I didn't bother with it.

I'll see if I can't find it referenced somewhere for you.

Anyway it's fairly obvious. Find a 'mech that's under LRM fire and ONLY LRM fire and watch what happens to the hits registration as locations get opened.

[Cyrion]

Everyone is focusing on the missiles not doing damage to that Cat's back, but what was more egregious and obvious to me was the missiles totally disappearing when he shot them at the Cat's legs early on in the video. He lands a full alpha across both legs, yet the left leg registers nothing and the right leg, which was already cored yellow, barely flashes.

The bad hit reg happens with all weapons at some point or another, but the really bad offenders are SRMs, AC/20s, and Peeps. The AC/20 actually gets worse the closer to the enemy you get because the game seems to 'tard out because it doesn't have enough time to register that you actually hit the opponent. I've never had it fail to register if I'm hitting from 270+ though.

PGI is always talking about how they want to up the TTK. I guess leaving awful hitreg in the game is an easy way to help accomplish that goal. Kappa.

[A Really Old Clan Dude]

Id rather take my arctic cheetah or mist lynx for up close and personal back stabbing.

The arctic cheetah can one shot kill mechs from behind and being up close. (4+h meds, 2 srm4) 50% heat so its a shoot once and run.

[Grus]

Scout Derek, on 21 March 2018 - 07:55 PM, said:

bet you wouldn't have that problem with IS srms..

Edited by Grus, 22 March 2018 - 04:14 PM.

[Scout Derek]

Dogstar, on 22 March 2018 - 04:00 AM, said:

All you've done there is confirm my point - SRM boats are situational because they need some way to close the distance, just like LRM boats are situational because they need some way to get locks

Once again the point was that the OP was blaming others for making the same mistake he did.

Blaming? what in the name of Kerensky?

I was explaining what was happening at the moment. if you want the full video I'll post the damn thing. and I'll show you what I was trying to do.

I don't rely on pugs in solo que at all with my srm build here. I go wherever I want if it's possible. here, there was no way. I tried for a flank and it wouldn't work because the pugs were incompetent and didn't rotate accordingly.

I'll accept that hitreg is crap or something else, but I won't let someone tell me I'm a coward because I need pugs. Come back when you want to take something else out of context hombre.

Edit: and yes, they're incompetent regardless or not of they're using lrms. just take a look at their statistics. More importantly take a look at yours and mine and think on it ya? and when I do post the video, you tell me how you'd play it yeah? that is if you even want me to post it.

Edited by Scout Derek, 27 March 2018 - 11:09 AM.

[Scout Derek]

Random Carnage, on 22 March 2018 - 01:33 AM, said:

Karma for ignoring the light that was coring the Fk out of his team mates back and allowing him to simply die while he did nothing to help.

You mean at 0:20?

There's nothing I could do at that moment. you think I can take on a mist lynx with MGs? no, I can't. I know that for a fact when my back is cored out and I'm less than 60% health. I'll show you the video too. that way you can see how I got beat up so bad huh?

[Nightbird]

Duncan Aravain, on 22 March 2018 - 07:00 AM, said:

Er, what MCM2 has 58hp on its REAR CT? The attacks he is complaining about not registering ccorrectly are the ones directed at the rear of the enemy. Hit registration in the game always seems to be a problem; from the beginning of MWO we have had an ebb and flow in its reliability depending on weapon systems and targeted mech. As a previous poster noted, chain firing appears to up the registered damage and certain mech hitboxes were faulty at introduction and PGI had to be clubbed with dozens of videos before they acknowledged their error. I think the current meta of many light mech boating 8+ machine guns with each round having to be analysed for effect has had a noticeable effect on the hit registration ability by the server. It is most frustrating when a shut down mech is targeted at under 100 meters and still runs off despite a carefully targeted volley or two at its weakspot.

Well, to paraphrase from The Curse of Oak island: " That's MWO for you".

Front CT has same structure hp as rear CT...

[mogs01gt]

Tiewolf, on 22 March 2018 - 12:00 PM, said:

LRM/ATM boats are dependent on the team because they have a minimum distance and are toast if the enemy manages to get close. They can and should get their own locks - no team needed. SRM boats on the other hand can protect themself. Did you realize that most games end in a brawl? Who decides if a game is turned around or lost? Brawlers maybe? What is a SRM boat? A good Brawler! Boating SRMs is no mistake. You are right, that they are better on some maps/contexts in the early phase of a game but they are allways effective if played right.

most games do not end in a brawl. Brawling is within 200m and by the time that distance is reached, the match is lost. Brawling hasnt been a thing in like 3 years.

Edited by mogs01gt, 27 March 2018 - 12:58 PM.