182 replies to this topic

[dario03]

Ted Wayz, on 13 April 2018 - 05:04 PM, said:

Huh?

I think someone forgets lights are supposed to have roles. That role isn't doing the same damage and getting the same score as other weight classes. In BT, which you brought up,lights were scout and didn't go anywhere near heavies and assaults and most mediums. Because the game mechanics confined them to a role.

But because PGI couldn't handle roles they instead needed to find ways to make lights competitive with other weight classes. They have also been very inconsistent with coding. Broken hitboxes on a heavy can be overlooked because of size. On light they scale in a manner which is not linear.

Lag shield no longer exists? Okay. Again coding says no unless everyone unanimously agrees that there are no server client issues or ways to "game the game". Also you are giving PGI mucho credit on fixing things that I must have missed in the patch notes for the past five years.

Leading shots? Used to be a thing. You used to be able to leg a light with a single AC20 shot, like it should be. But between hit reg, hit boxes (they are different things), added structure and armor it just doesn't happen.

And what is the best DPS you can get with those "light killers" you mention? What is the best DPS with 2 AC5's? Three? And why should a light be able to approach or exceeds those numbers? They should not be remotely close.

And stop confusing OP with EZ Mode. OP does not mean everyone can succeed with a mech. It means that it performs well beyond what it should for its class/weight in this case. EZ mode means anyone can get a relatively good score while piloting.

When a mech is OP just enjoy it. The more you defend it the more you bring it into question. The passion with which people defend a mech indicts it. That in turn leads a quicker nerf.

In that case...please create more threads!

So exactly how much damage is a light allowed to do before its EZ or OP?
And while we're at it, what about the other classes?

[Athom83]

Ted Wayz, on 13 April 2018 - 05:04 PM, said:

I think someone forgets lights are supposed to have roles. That role isn't doing the same damage and getting the same score as other weight classes. In BT, which you brought up,lights were scout and didn't go anywhere near heavies and assaults and most mediums. Because the game mechanics confined them to a role.

1) I was generalizing.
2) They do have different roles (Skirmisher, Sniper, Scout, etc).
3) Didn't bring up BT.
4) WTF are you on about?

Ted Wayz, on 13 April 2018 - 05:04 PM, said:

But because PGI couldn't handle roles they instead needed to find ways to make lights competitive with other weight classes. They have also been very inconsistent with coding. Broken hitboxes on a heavy can be overlooked because of size. On light they scale in a manner which is not linear.

Except they do have roles...

Ted Wayz, on 13 April 2018 - 05:04 PM, said:

Lag shield no longer exists? Okay. Again coding says no unless everyone unanimously agrees that there are no server client issues or ways to "game the game". Also you are giving PGI mucho credit on fixing things that I must have missed in the patch notes for the past five years.

Didn't say that. I said it was much less prevalent than before, so much so that it rarely is a factor at all.

Ted Wayz, on 13 April 2018 - 05:04 PM, said:

Leading shots? Used to be a thing. You used to be able to leg a light with a single AC20 shot, like it should be. But between hit reg, hit boxes (they are different things), added structure and armor it just doesn't happen.

Except I do it all the time?

Ted Wayz, on 13 April 2018 - 05:04 PM, said:

And what is the best DPS you can get with those "light killers" you mention? What is the best DPS with 2 AC5's? Three? And why should a light be able to approach or exceeds those numbers? They should not be remotely close.

... wut? Killing lights isn't about DPS. Using DPS against lights is a bad Idea. You want to alpha lights to destroy components asap so you have an easier time taking it out.

Ted Wayz, on 13 April 2018 - 05:04 PM, said:

And stop confusing OP with EZ Mode. OP does not mean everyone can succeed with a mech. It means that it performs well beyond what it should for its class/weight in this case. EZ mode means anyone can get a relatively good score while piloting.

.. again wut? Are you even quoting the right guy?
\

Ted Wayz, on 13 April 2018 - 05:04 PM, said:

When a mech is OP just enjoy it. The more you defend it the more you bring it into question. The passion with which people defend a mech indicts it. That in turn leads a quicker nerf.

Again... wut da [Redacted]?

Ted Wayz, on 13 April 2018 - 05:04 PM, said:

In that case...please create more threads!

?!?!?

Edited by draiocht, 14 April 2018 - 12:22 PM.
inappropriate language

[Demoulius]

Been playing since beta and played light mechs since beta. Ive seen some funky **** but Piranhas with machineguns take the ******* cake. Firestarters were beasts to take down as well when they were new and honestly its a problem with hit boxes in most cases of new mechs. Its just that 12 machine guns pack a redicilous amount of firepower on such a light and small mech.

Honestly PGI needs a while with each new mech that they bring out to sort out the hit boxes but imho machine gun damage is a bigger part of the problem. Theyre better at stripping armour (well when you have 12 of them anyway) then any other weapon, aside from a direct hit with an AC (and with their hit boxes beeing FUBAR'ed atm thats abit of an issue) on the flipside they hit you with a constant stream of damage thats hitscan, doesent generate heat and that ALSO chews through internals faster......

Cant wait for the hitboxes (and possibly machineguns) to get fixed. An anti-infantry weapon that performs better as an anti-mech weapon comes across as a LITTLE odd to me....

[ShaneoftheDead]

According to the Word of God, as seen here, any given Piranha is equally combat effective as any given Atlas.

[Judah Malganis]

Quote

An anti-infantry weapon that performs better as an anti-mech weapon comes across as a LITTLE odd to me

People need to get off the dang 'infantry weapon' kick when it comes to machine guns. TT machine guns have the same damage as AC2s, and with 100 ammo per ton, and carry more dmg potential than any of the ACs but have a horribly short range as a penalty. Even Sarna.net concedes that mech machine guns are effective vs both infantry and mechs because they are VEHICULAR scale weapons, not your daddy's AK-47. That argument of mech machine guns as purely infantry weapons is old, boring and entirely inaccurate. They get a BONUS vs infantry, that does not imply they are weak vs mechs...

Here, straight from Sarna.net:

Vehicular-scale machine guns mounted on BattleMechs can lay low entire platoons in just
a few passes thanks to their high rate of fire, though they are more commonly found
on Combat Vehicles and ProtoMechs.^[1] These weapons are much heavier than those
typically carried by infantry, but can be used by them when placed on a static mount, where
they are called Support Machine Guns.

[gamingogre]

No mech should be able to kill outright in under 2 seconds with 20+ armor to go through. That's right, every time I die from the back in under two seconds there is a fish mech with teeth. This is making the game unplayable. That's right, this may just be a game breaker here.

[Judah Malganis]

Quote

No mech should be able to kill outright in under 2 seconds with 20+ armor to go through. That's right, every time I die from the back in under two seconds there is a fish mech with teeth. This is making the game unplayable. That's right, this may just be a game breaker here.

Machine guns are not the problem; mechs packing 12 of them are. Indvidually, they are wayyyy underwhelming. If you followed TT logic, their DPS would be about 2.5x better, even against armor. Were it not for 6+ boating in clan or the fact that some IS mechs have slots that realistically can't be used for anything else (Locust, Spider, etc.), the tonnage would be better spent on a small laser.

What you should be asking for is to bring boats down to size, not looking to screw MGs so hard that ONLY boats can use them.

Edited by Judah Malganis, 14 April 2018 - 07:44 PM.

[Darian DelFord]

gamingogre, on 14 April 2018 - 07:22 PM, said:

No mech should be able to kill outright in under 2 seconds with 20+ armor to go through. That's right, every time I die from the back in under two seconds there is a fish mech with teeth. This is making the game unplayable. That's right, this may just be a game breaker here.

Your kidding right?

You do realize that even the almighty piranha can not do this.

Edited by Darian DelFord, 14 April 2018 - 07:43 PM.

[Mortalcoil]

Behold, the crazy spread that is machine guns. https://imgur.com/a/lYSje

Der Geisterbaer, on 10 April 2018 - 11:52 AM, said:

Depends on the target, the terrain and of course standing completely still on either end. Now the fun thing is: I just tested your claim on Tourmaline against that well known Atlas ... turns out that "hitting where you're pointing them" occured between optimum range and up to 67% of max range. Still nothing I'd even remotely consider "pinpoint".



Now as far as "in most circumstance" is concerned: I rarely see that "crotch hugging" if at all ... just like I'm not necessarily seeing myself or my targets actually standing still even if I manage to sneak up from behind. As always YMMV

I also did that test, and I prove you completely wrong, https://imgur.com/a/lYSje

[Jay Sovereign]

Jenner IIC was considered OP and got nerfed...
Yet you think the piranha doesn't deserve a nerf?
Grow up. It's OP

[Xeno Phalcon]

You couldnt dig up a more recent PIR-QQ thread?

[Kaini Industries]

'Tis the season to necro light whine threads?

[R5D4]

Jay Sovereign, on 24 December 2018 - 05:12 AM, said:

Jenner IIC was considered OP and got nerfed...
Yet you think the piranha doesn't deserve a nerf?
Grow up. It's OP

You Necromance an old thread to point out a light mech that had a whopping ONE variant (The missile Jenner) that needed a balance change that PGI instead had every variant nerfed into oblivion with a series of horrible changes and this is supposed to what? Prove your point that the Piranha needs the same treatment as well because it touched you in a naughty place?

Clearly no bias or malicious intent here *eyeroll*

Merry Christmas maybe Santa will bring you some back Armour.

Edited by R5D4, 24 December 2018 - 09:24 AM.

[Darian DelFord]

Only one thing to do here since I started the topic 7 months ago....

Damn can't get my necro gif to work (

Edited by Darian DelFord, 24 December 2018 - 08:42 AM.

[R Valentine]

The Piranha was a problem anyone with half a brain could have seen coming. Boating has always been an issue, especially on clan mechs with 8-12x any one hard point. 12 cSPL nova? 7 cSPL Artic Cheetah? Those two mechs got the cSPL nerfed into unusable status. The cMPL has also seen significant nerfs due to boating, enough to where it doesn't even do more damage than a cERML. But PGI, in all its brilliance, releases a mech than can boat 12 cMGs and is small enough and fast enough to utilize them. What's gonna happen to the cMG? Because we KNOW PGI won't nerf the mech. They almost never do. Sure negative quirks happened in the past, but that's way past now and they've never touched hard points except for rare "oopsies". So what's going to happen to the cMG? I estimate it'll be nerfed into cSPL, or near cSPL levels of uselessness. And PGI will release the next boating mech that will ruin a single weapon for every other mech in existence.

[NRP]

Nerfing drives players away from the game.

Stop the nerf.

[Prototelis]

Boating has never been the problem with this game or this series.

The problem has always been people who play terrible kitchen sink bracket builds like its a good idea.

[Y E O N N E]

But muh lore!

[Weeny Machine]

@Darian:
Why do you even argue?

Let me open your eyes: go to the leaderboard and check the stats of some people who cry here so much. You will see that they haven't touched these "light op killing machines" for several seasons or have done a few games and/or their stats are nothing to brag about - at least not when we talk about lights ...

GBxGhostRyder, on 12 April 2018 - 07:37 AM, said:

...like the piranha-spider-arctic chaeta-locust-commando have the ability to tank more damage than assaults /snip

These people will never admit that their aim, positioning, awareness of their surroundings etc is to blame because they cannot handle those mechs.

It is much easier to cry on the forum than admit that sometimes you made mistakes and simply have to get better. And this comes from someone with mediocre aiming skills


What makes me chuckle is that I see now and then matches with 6 assaults. I cannot remember if I have ever seen a match with 6 lights on one team - especially outside an event. Considering that people gravitate the most powerful stuff in a pvp environment this says all, plus the queue numbers.

Edited by Bush Hopper, 24 December 2018 - 02:46 PM.

[Prototelis]

Yeonne Greene, on 24 December 2018 - 02:17 PM, said:

But muh lore!

MUH ASSULT!