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The Art Of The Push


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#1 Throe

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Posted 11 April 2018 - 04:59 PM

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Edited by Throe, 08 November 2018 - 03:06 PM.


#2 loopala

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Posted 11 April 2018 - 05:06 PM

nice start. keep feeding what you know.

also check out this thread. it has in very easy to understand comics the basics of small unit tactic, which is what MWO is all about

https://mwomercs.com...ics-101-comics/

#3 CFC Conky

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Posted 11 April 2018 - 05:06 PM

A good thread, I hope to see some good ideas here.

I have one comment on your post, NASCAR usually runs counter-clockwise.


Good hunting,
CFC Conky

#4 Spare Parts Bin

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Posted 11 April 2018 - 05:54 PM

Better than a push but harder to achieve is a coordinated firing line at a choke point. The enemy comes at you in ones to threes. 5-12 waiting Mechs converge fire on one target at a time. When done right it is devstating.

Edited by Spare Parts Bin, 11 April 2018 - 05:57 PM.


#5 Leone

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Posted 11 April 2018 - 06:41 PM

Pushing is about utilizing a numbers disparity, or if need be, making one.

https://mwomercs.com...rimer-by-leone/

Check the first vid. What the opfor is doing isn't a push, it's just moving through the gates. They all have an idea and a goal, but they get strung out, and they don't work together. They do not engineer, not maintain cohesion. When the defending group pushes in, check the minimap. Unity of purpose, focus firing, and sweeping up the opposition in what ends up being a constant numbers disparity.

More mechs are better'n less. The push is about abusing that mechanic in your favour.

~Leone.

#6 Yondu Udonta

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Posted 11 April 2018 - 07:09 PM

The loadouts on your team's mechs vs the enemy's. There is no way in hell you would want to push into a brawl heavy enemy lineup while having a laser vomit mech.

#7 Throe

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Posted 12 April 2018 - 08:19 AM

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Edited by Throe, 08 November 2018 - 03:06 PM.


#8 Spare Parts Bin

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Posted 12 April 2018 - 03:54 PM

View PostThroe, on 12 April 2018 - 08:19 AM, said:


You're absolutely right. I was thinking counter-clockwise, and I have no idea why I said clockwise.


Great thread indeed.

#9 Throe

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Posted 12 April 2018 - 11:02 PM

[deleted by user]

Edited by Throe, 08 November 2018 - 03:06 PM.


#10 B0oN

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Posted 13 April 2018 - 01:08 AM

The lost art of pushing ...
Ingredients needed as followed, not necessarily in the order they are being written :
-Salt´n Pepa (the music, what else ? ^^ )
-Balls of steel
-Cohesion
-Knowledge about weakspots of mech-loadouts
-Knowledge about the map and to push from which position into another
-Motivation
-Momentum
-Luck
-Chinese minister of keeping an eye on the clock, also called Mr. Ti-Ming

Mix all of those, shake well, add some hotsauce if you like, stir gently, then unleash ...

Edited by B0oN, 13 April 2018 - 01:10 AM.


#11 Tier5ForLife

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Posted 15 April 2018 - 11:17 AM

Great stuff.

MWO is not about one on one. It is about finding and making three on ones (simple version of "numbers disparity") That is why units and/or players that know and trust each other wipe out scattered teams. I wish I could draw but what you want is a "Band of the Hand". In the case of MWO, tuck your thumb under and take your hand and put it flat on a table etc. Now, look at your fingernails. That is how you want to move together. Not following each other but side by side.

Recently I was watching a guy on Twitch and he mentioned that all games are math. Figure out the math of the game and you will be good at it. And he is good at a lot of games.

The simple way in MWO is to think of tonnage and the number of mechs. If you are in a 40-ton mech, do not take on a 75-ton mech (I'm looking at you Buddha). So if you can create a situation where 3 of your team's mechs, let's say a 75 tonner, a 55 tonner and a 60 tonner can attack a 100-ton mech, it should not have a chance.

Just having a "battle buddy" helps. There is a player named YouCallThisClean (or close). He has a unique style of getting the team to push and leading it by getting behind a heavy or assault and telling him that he has his six, telling the other players to "not be that guy". He will call out targets for the guy in front of him and "push" him and the team along.

I thought I had a video with him. It seems like all my old Youtube videos are gone. Do they only keep a certain amount or for an amount of time? The oldest one is only one month.

Ah, I think I found it.


Edited by LikeUntoBuddha, 15 April 2018 - 11:19 AM.


#12 Tier5ForLife

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Posted 15 April 2018 - 11:29 AM

O Snap, I found it! Funny because he is in a Stalker and I'm in a Blackjack.

No, not this one, the next one.




This is before I found out how to make my screen fuller by going to the full window, saving and then going back to windowed so it is hard to see the names of the people talking.


Edited by LikeUntoBuddha, 15 April 2018 - 11:31 AM.


#13 Spare Parts Bin

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Posted 15 April 2018 - 12:54 PM

Having three folks work together can be devastating. An SRM&ERSL Linebacker with a Streakcrow if they focused one target would smoke torsos or leave armour thin as rice paper before help arrived.

#14 TooDumbToQuit

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Posted 18 April 2018 - 05:33 AM

It is like chess even down to taking and controlling certain grid squares in certain games.

In chess, you are always looking for the 2 on 1 advantage.

I wish I could do animation or video work better. I have some video clips I'd like to show. Like a team doing a perfect and fast "conga line" into Boreal Vault. And on the same map, how to correctly take down the gates there. You do it with your mechs running in a circle. The 1st mech runs up, fires an alpha strike at the gate Gen and then quickly drop down and circle back around to get back in line. 2nd mech follows him etc etc.

I can tell if the other team knows what they are doing by how they take these gates down.


I've been doing a fair amount of faction lately (my Clan Alt LikeUntoBuddha is pissed about losing faction xp) and in it and in quick play you can just look at your minimap. All 12 mechs on your team should be in the same grid square. One of the best ways to get a number or firepower disparity is to be right next to two teammates.

I was looking at a video of a game last night and we had players in at least 6 grid squares. They were in the same grid square (trading paint) and just rolled us up one and two at a time.

And the other side of the Numbers or Firepower Disparity is NOT TO ALLOW yourself into being forced into worse, causing the disparity yourself.

Yesterday I ran a Supernova too forward (I have a problem that I always feel the need to be in front) and turned a corner and met most of the other team. And 90 tons went poof. I watched some of the videos about the MWP champions. Some of the people in charge said that one special thing about this team is that they never put themselves in a bad position.

So while looking for a two on one (Numbers Disparity), also work not to allow yourself or team get into one.

I play with a lot of PUGS (I like PUGS) as I very slowly go up the Tiers. And so many just do not get it. I can imagine being a training officer and linking two mechs with a huge 200-meter cable to get them used to stay tight.

As the one video, I linked shows, just working in a buddy system (battle buddy) system works well. The two of you look for a single to take on calling on other teammates to add in if possible once the attack opens up.

You can sometimes hear in Quick Play two or more players who know and trust each other. And they will talk among themselves a lot and do well in the game. LikeUntoBuddha has been allowed to train with the Praetorian-Legion. They have one training mode where two lights take on a heavy. The purpose of the training session is to get two players who might rarely use a mic used too using one all the time. They want constant talk between the two.

You get Firepower Disparity by talking together and planning it. In a perfect world, each Lance would have its own channel with the player in charge being able to listen or speak to all of them.

Here is where I complain that the "chat" here still sucks. There seems to be no on one them. They are very small and you cannot make it bigger. You cannot link to it.

And there is no "friends only" chat. Or an "LFG" for friends only.

P.S. When I'm using one of my (stupid) flamer build mechs I always try to get with another mech that is aggressive. I shut the enemy mech down and he kills it.

Edited by LikeUntoGod, 18 April 2018 - 05:35 AM.


#15 Spare Parts Bin

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Posted 18 April 2018 - 04:24 PM

View PostLikeUntoGod, on 18 April 2018 - 05:33 AM, said:

It is like chess even down to taking and controlling certain grid squares in certain games.

In chess, you are always looking for the 2 on 1 advantage.

I wish I could do animation or video work better. I have some video clips I'd like to show. Like a team doing a perfect and fast "conga line" into Boreal Vault. And on the same map, how to correctly take down the gates there. You do it with your mechs running in a circle. The 1st mech runs up, fires an alpha strike at the gate Gen and then quickly drop down and circle back around to get back in line. 2nd mech follows him etc etc.

I can tell if the other team knows what they are doing by how they take these gates down.


I've been doing a fair amount of faction lately (my Clan Alt LikeUntoBuddha is pissed about losing faction xp) and in it and in quick play you can just look at your minimap. All 12 mechs on your team should be in the same grid square. One of the best ways to get a number or firepower disparity is to be right next to two teammates.

I was looking at a video of a game last night and we had players in at least 6 grid squares. They were in the same grid square (trading paint) and just rolled us up one and two at a time.

And the other side of the Numbers or Firepower Disparity is NOT TO ALLOW yourself into being forced into worse, causing the disparity yourself.

Yesterday I ran a Supernova too forward (I have a problem that I always feel the need to be in front) and turned a corner and met most of the other team. And 90 tons went poof. I watched some of the videos about the MWP champions. Some of the people in charge said that one special thing about this team is that they never put themselves in a bad position.

So while looking for a two on one (Numbers Disparity), also work not to allow yourself or team get into one.

I play with a lot of PUGS (I like PUGS) as I very slowly go up the Tiers. And so many just do not get it. I can imagine being a training officer and linking two mechs with a huge 200-meter cable to get them used to stay tight.

As the one video, I linked shows, just working in a buddy system (battle buddy) system works well. The two of you look for a single to take on calling on other teammates to add in if possible once the attack opens up.

You can sometimes hear in Quick Play two or more players who know and trust each other. And they will talk among themselves a lot and do well in the game. LikeUntoBuddha has been allowed to train with the Praetorian-Legion. They have one training mode where two lights take on a heavy. The purpose of the training session is to get two players who might rarely use a mic used too using one all the time. They want constant talk between the two.

You get Firepower Disparity by talking together and planning it. In a perfect world, each Lance would have its own channel with the player in charge being able to listen or speak to all of them.

Here is where I complain that the "chat" here still sucks. There seems to be no on one them. They are very small and you cannot make it bigger. You cannot link to it.

And there is no "friends only" chat. Or an "LFG" for friends only.

P.S. When I'm using one of my (stupid) flamer build mechs I always try to get with another mech that is aggressive. I shut the enemy mech down and he kills it.


I have been blessed to get one FP match with you. That memory is how I gauge teamwork for all other matches. As of yet no one comes close.

#16 TooDumbToQuit

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Posted 19 April 2018 - 05:02 AM

Thanks! (Rats, now I have to keep trying hard...at times)

Here is an example of not pushing. First off, a lot of this is my fault. To do what I wanted to do means doing it from the drop. And I was talking BS and when I did talk about an attack, it was late and I was not REALLY pushing people. There are a certain percentage of players that get mad if someone speaks too much. They will say "please shut up and let's just play" and then we lose.

I semi tried to lead by example here which I do a lot (I am the first to die in a lot of games). Often if at least 3-4 people get on board others will follow.

What I wanted to do here depends on time. I've walked this map and I've timed it out. Everyone moves using buildings etc for concealment and everyone hits H6 and keeps going to their base. We have only done right 3 times and it worked each time. No one stops, no one shoots, everyone moves.

And here the movement was very slow and then it stopped. The thing that got me was the other team moved all the way around and came behind us.

P.S. No commenting on my build!


Edited by LikeUntoGod, 19 April 2018 - 06:16 AM.


#17 TooDumbToQuit

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Posted 19 April 2018 - 06:00 AM

View PostSpare Parts Bin, on 18 April 2018 - 04:24 PM, said:

I have been blessed to get one FP match with you. That memory is how I gauge teamwork for all other matches. As of yet no one comes close.



You can edit the quotes, lol. Thanks so much again, bro.

There is something I want to tell you about. I'm not sure it will happen but a couple of mysterious players using "cut-outs" approached me about starting something called "the PUG Club". It is supposed to be some sort of underground group of players that like Faction Warfare but not the way it is set up like Temple Grandin designed it.

I was told that they will be crazy things. "Sun Tzu stuff" I was told, whatever that means. They said something about not wanting to be an unpaid stuntman on someone's Twitch channel. (?)

I do not know if they will ever get a 12 man drop but if they are dropping 4-6 that is enough to have others follow the plan.

There is a TS called Stranamechty that anyone can use and it has at the bottom a number of dead units/channels. IF THE FREAKING SEARCH WORKED HERE I MIGHT BE ABLE TO FIND THE PAGE THAT EXPLAINS IT.

And they will be using the strat map which can be linked in Teamspeak and seen and used by everyone.

https://maps.mrbclea...oom=LikeUntoGod

Edited by LikeUntoGod, 19 April 2018 - 06:17 AM.


#18 Spare Parts Bin

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Posted 20 April 2018 - 04:18 AM

I will have to check this out.





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