53 replies to this topic

[Cer6erus]

I bring 4 heavy small lasers in my Kodiak to try and fend off the lights. I even preemptively back into a corner that is lower then the surrounding terrain so the enemy mech has to be relatively higher to me. The problem is I still cant even see the mech I'm trying to aim at when its at my ankles. I just have to aim my reticle down and pray. Its the lack of counter play that's frustrating, not as much the bad matchup.

To make it worse is it seems like DIV 2 is settling into a rock paper scissors matchup already. From personal experience I can shred 90% of 'light' assaults and heavies in a kodiak, but lose to a light. If I take a heavy or more mobile assault, I lose 90% of the time to the kodiaks or atlases. Its never fun to win or lose before the match has even started. Im sure im not the only one who gets bored when I wait 4 minutes to see an enemy mech that I know I will be able to shred on a matchup alone. Take a hollow victory, then wait another 4 minutes just to get in a match vs a light that you know you will get murdered by that you cant even look down enough to aim.

And to those saying bring more back up weapons for the 25% of the time you see the light, you forget about the 50% of the time you run into brawler atlas and Kodiak who don't take the back up weapons and have an advantage in your mirror matchup.

Before I go on a farther rant, I just think the division system needs some more tweaks and it should all work itself out.

[Trollololololol]

All of you ******** on the OP for a valid complaint about divisions seriously need to look in the mirror. Playing an MLX or PIR is a coin flip to see if you win, and it ruins the game for people actually trying to play it. I made this account just to prove that, and it's truly sad people want to pretend as if they're uber skilled and could take on 10 mechs at a time.

Going off on a tangent about how they should mount weapons to deal with 2 mechs out of a plethora of possible opponents and ruining their heat ratio is hilarious, and it really shows how people will argue just for the sake of argument because their ego's are so big. Get over yourselves.

Even someone in EmP has a hard time dealing with this nonsense.

https://www.youtube....6&v=2DdNutXaaFA

Hurr durr git good.

(Note, I'm also about 10 beers in every time I hop on this account. This is how hilariously easy it is to play a light in Div2)

Edited by Trollololololol, 22 April 2018 - 08:55 PM.

[RickySpanish]

Gwydion Ward, on 22 April 2018 - 06:58 PM, said:

Its not that the 'light mech' is OP..

Its the 100% broken, and likely never going to be fixed by PGI, game-mechanic where There are no 'risks' involved for a 30ton mech to run head-first into the legs of a 100ton beast.

I faced a dope in a Piranha this evening, I couldn't help but notice he had 100 or so games with an even win/loss rate. That's not great at 1550, and it was no surprise when he also believed there was "no risks involved for a 30 ton mech to run head first into the legs of a 100ton beast". Only there was - two of them, strapped to my torsos. They immediately helped contribute to keeping him in that starter Elo range where he surely belongs.

[Wil McCullough]

Trollololololol, on 22 April 2018 - 08:53 PM, said:

All of you ******** on the OP for a valid complaint about divisions seriously need to look in the mirror. Playing an MLX or PIR is a coin flip to see if you win, and it ruins the game for people actually trying to play it. I made this account just to prove that, and it's truly sad people want to pretend as if they're uber skilled and could take on 10 mechs at a time.

Going off on a tangent about how they should mount weapons to deal with 2 mechs out of a plethora of possible opponents and ruining their heat ratio is hilarious, and it really shows how people will argue just for the sake of argument because their ego's are so big. Get over yourselves.

Even someone in EmP has a hard time dealing with this nonsense.

https://www.youtube....6&v=2DdNutXaaFA

Hurr durr git good.

(Note, I'm also about 10 beers in every time I hop on this account. This is how hilariously easy it is to play a light in Div2)

The moment the pilot refuses to take steps to counter "2 mechs out of a plethora of possible opponents" is the moment he loses all right to complain about said mechs.

Basically that pilot made the concious decision to gimp him/herself against his natural counter in a gamble that he wouldn't face that matchup much. That's the trade off for being more effective against everything else.

You can't have your cake and eat it too.

If i load up my mad dog with streaks to take out mediums and lights, i'll have to be some kind of special to complain about getting owned by heavies and assaults.

[Dimento Graven]

PoPuP, on 22 April 2018 - 02:31 PM, said:

Love the game finally only 1 idiot to deal with ME:)

but seriously lights against assaults head to knee cap -- WTF no knock downs, for anyone who takes a light in against assaults your gonna win just get in close not even in back and your single machine gun can chew them up.. wtf I saw a tractor trailer that could not stop at a stop light and Volkswagen beetle once, hell there was just a mess but the tractor trail only had some scratches on it.


a machine gun on an atlas would be a fracken AC20 on these tiny mechs. this game is fun until those little (*&&*^%#^ show up and ruin it. Bring back some friggen knock downs and fall downs back those pieces of crap need to be afraid of larger mechs like that beetle vs he tracto trailer.

am I whinning YUP. thank god battletech is release on the horizon.

HEY why not sell powerups so you can knock those little crap mechs across the arena!

Probably too late to respond to this, but queue the ***-hats who insist that "knock downs" can't ever be fixed and it's ok that they should be allowed to bash their 'mech into a larger 'mech's legs with impunity because "well they have arms derp derp derp"... Hey for quite a few assaults and lights even with arms that can maybe move weapons that low, there's no ability for us to see below a certain point, specifically the f'ing mini map that hides where our target reticule is. If the damned minimap would move or become transparent, MAYBE there'd be less of an issue.

Then again, HOW THE F CAN YOU HAVE SOLARIS WITHOUT PHYSICAL ATTACKS?!!?!?!?

It's the most goddamned obvious "cool" thing to have in 1v1 and 2v2 action...

So all you little light F's, go ahead, make your excuses why we shouldn't have something that might make you pilot your 'mechs in a more reasonable and intelligent manner, instead of exploiting the fact that we're missing a key portion of this game...

[Wil McCullough]

Dimento Graven, on 22 April 2018 - 10:04 PM, said:

Probably too late to respond to this, but queue the ***-hats who insist that "knock downs" can't ever be fixed and it's ok that they should be allowed to bash their 'mech into a larger 'mech's legs with impunity because "well they have arms derp derp derp"... Hey for quite a few assaults and lights even with arms that can maybe move weapons that low, there's no ability for us to see below a certain point, specifically the f'ing mini map that hides where our target reticule is. If the damned minimap would move or become transparent, MAYBE there'd be less of an issue.

Then again, HOW THE F CAN YOU HAVE SOLARIS WITHOUT PHYSICAL ATTACKS?!!?!?!?

It's the most goddamned obvious "cool" thing to have in 1v1 and 2v2 action...

So all you little light F's, go ahead, make your excuses why we shouldn't have something that might make you pilot your 'mechs in a more reasonable and intelligent manner, instead of exploiting the fact that we're missing a key portion of this game...

It's important to keep context in mind when it comes to balance.

Mwo is a game with a rock paper scissors mechanic. Battletech roles (sadly) don't apply here because it's at its core, an arena shooter where killing the opponent is the only real gameplay objective.

In mwo's format, lights counter assaults due to the difference in speed and agility.

In battletech, lights had a different purpose due to repair and rearm, economy, available resources and the need for things like scouting and support. In bt lore, justin allard in a light mech, almost died when he faced gray noton in a rifleman. There was no way he would have won.

That "flavor" of light capability wouldn't work in mwo where everyone and their mother can bring an assault mech every match.

As it stands right now, light pilots already have to think about how to approach assaults and execute that approach perfectly. A single mistake means they evaporate in an alpha. To ask for more is to demand that assaults have a balanced or advantageous match up every time against any mech class, which is a terrible idea.

Edited by Wil McCullough, 23 April 2018 - 04:07 PM.

[Zergling]

Lights are so blatantly disadvantaged in Solaris compared to other modes, that I'm just luling at anyone complaining about lights being OP or hard to defeat in Solaris.


See this Div 2 battle in an Executioner, one of the worst Div 2 assaults:


I played like an idiot; I didn't back up to a wall and the Piranha got behind me a couple times. It out-damaged me heavily at 351 to 139, but it still lost badly; I wasn't in any serious danger of a loss.

[Metus regem]

Matt2496, on 22 April 2018 - 06:27 PM, said:

assault with arm mounted weapons + backing up against a wall = problem solved

Also SSRM/s lights are deathly allergic to them....

[Novakaine]

[Darian DelFord]

Trollololololol, on 22 April 2018 - 08:53 PM, said:

All of you ******** on the OP for a valid complaint about divisions seriously need to look in the mirror. Playing an MLX or PIR is a coin flip to see if you win, and it ruins the game for people actually trying to play it. I made this account just to prove that, and it's truly sad people want to pretend as if they're uber skilled and could take on 10 mechs at a time.

Going off on a tangent about how they should mount weapons to deal with 2 mechs out of a plethora of possible opponents and ruining their heat ratio is hilarious, and it really shows how people will argue just for the sake of argument because their ego's are so big. Get over yourselves.

Even someone in EmP has a hard time dealing with this nonsense.

https://www.youtube....6&v=2DdNutXaaFA

Hurr durr git good.

(Note, I'm also about 10 beers in every time I hop on this account. This is how hilariously easy it is to play a light in Div2)

Interesting In every other divsions the heaviest of the mechs merely sits in a corner and waits for the lights to peek their heads and then damn near one shots them.

I am sorry but unfortunately the population as a whole agrees that hiding in a corner with clear LoS is a legitimate tactic. Works in every division to.

[Dimento Graven]

Wil McCullough, on 22 April 2018 - 10:37 PM, said:

It's important to keep context in mind when it comes to balance.

...

ACTUALLY the 'important' thing to keep in mind is that in the original TT game this is based on, there was a chance, small as it was, for a LIGHT to knock down heavier opponents too.

The rules in TT can EASILY be ported over to this game with RNGesus implementation it can be "balanced"...

Zergling, on 22 April 2018 - 11:03 PM, said:

...

I played like an idiot; I didn't back up to a wall and the Piranha got behind me a couple times. It out-damaged me heavily at 351 to 139, but it still lost badly; I wasn't in any serious danger of a loss.

I take it you haven't seen the thread where the light pilot complains when assaults backup into a corner and won't come out...

Yeah far be it from an assault pilot to NOT voluntarily stick his *** out in the middle of the map for this derpy light pilot to run up and leg hump him to death...

I've had 2 more ties in Solaris because I refused to move myself into a disadvantageous position, just as that light pilot refused to put himself in a disadvantageous position.

Unfortunately PGI has to fix 'wall warping'... Had a non-JJ Commando, get flung up into the air where his feet were higher than my KGC's cockpit, when I cornered him against the wall. He'd have been dead those two matches without the wall warp (this was in Stiener Colleseum both times, though in Borealis any 'mech touching/walking into the 'force field' in certain areas seems to warp too).

[Nightbird]

Give all mechs pitch, add dom circle to all solaris maps. Problem fixed?

[zugnish]

Dimento Graven, on 23 April 2018 - 05:58 AM, said:

I take it you haven't seen the thread where the light pilot complains when assaults backup into a corner and won't come out...

There's now also a thread where an assault pilot complains about lights not engaging when he's positioned himself against the wall. I can already see how this drama will be resolved amicably.

[Dimento Graven]

zugnish, on 23 April 2018 - 06:31 AM, said:

There's now also a thread where an assault pilot complains about lights not engaging when he's positioned himself against the wall. I can already see how this drama will be resolved amicably.

When it happens in my matches, I don't begrudge the light pilot one bit. I'm as prepared to sit there 10 minutes waiting for the Tie as he is.

[UnkerZ]

I wonder why the ingenuity of future humans cannot comprehend the usefulness of turrets.. Imagine an ALS (Anti Light System) that you could spam and it will MG those flies away.

Or at least allow me to load an LBX20 on my leg. I'm fine with the low hardpoint *wink*

[Samantha Rbnsn1990]

So the day Solaris released I took my Kodillyak in just to see what would happen.

I was in the 3, which is outfitted with 2 UAC 10 and 2 LB10X-AC. 1 UAC and 1 LB10X in each side torso.

The opponent was in a Piranha. As he closed in, I nail him with my guns. Does he die? No.

He then is point blank shooting my legs, and to my horror I discover my Kodillyak cannot bend at the hips enough to bring my guns to bear.


Conclusion: The Piranha has quirks which make it invincible against UAC 10 & LB 10X AC damage.

[Gwydion Ward]

Zergling, on 22 April 2018 - 11:03 PM, said:

Lights are so blatantly disadvantaged in Solaris compared to other modes, that I'm just luling at anyone complaining about lights being OP or hard to defeat in Solaris.


See this Div 2 battle in an Executioner, one of the worst Div 2 assaults:


I played like an idiot; I didn't back up to a wall and the Piranha got behind me a couple times. It out-damaged me heavily at 351 to 139, but it still lost badly; I wasn't in any serious danger of a loss.

As i said in my first reply to this thread... Lights themselves are not OP... its the Tactic Lights use to 'ram into you and stay ramming into you' that is.

As i ALSO said in my first post. Backing up when a light tries to 'circle' you is a valid tactic. and its exactly what you did in your video because the light in your video was trying to circle you. He never 'stayed' ramming into you head-first. He tried to circle you. Hens why the 'back up when you fight one' worked for you.

Trust me, if he'd stayed facing your legs and never tried to circle you, that match would have ended far differently.

its the "ram into their legs and stay there, that needs SOME sort of fix. But PGI will continue to listen to the vocal minority who says there is no problem rather than the vocal majority that says there is :T

[Gwydion Ward]

Dimento Graven, on 23 April 2018 - 05:58 AM, said:

The rules in TT can EASILY be ported over to this game with RNGesus implementation it can be "balanced"...

Adding in any sort of RNGesus is something PGI will NEVER do. Even though its desperately needed.

'pinpoint damage' is something that has existed, and been a problem, ever since day 1 of Founders beta.

But to remove it will remove their attempt at making MWO a E-sport (at least in their eyes)

Its why Laser-vomit and Guass/PPC is a thing. All that damage hitting the exact same pixel you aim at.. despite having weapons that are nearly 5-8m apart from each other on the 'model'.

[KodiakGW]

Trollololololol, on 22 April 2018 - 08:53 PM, said:

All of you ******** on the OP for a valid complaint about divisions seriously need to look in the mirror. Playing an MLX or PIR is a coin flip to see if you win, and it ruins the game for people actually trying to play it. I made this account just to prove that, and it's truly sad people want to pretend as if they're uber skilled and could take on 10 mechs at a time.

Going off on a tangent about how they should mount weapons to deal with 2 mechs out of a plethora of possible opponents and ruining their heat ratio is hilarious, and it really shows how people will argue just for the sake of argument because their ego's are so big. Get over yourselves.

Even someone in EmP has a hard time dealing with this nonsense.

https://www.youtube....6&v=2DdNutXaaFA

Hurr durr git good.

(Note, I'm also about 10 beers in every time I hop on this account. This is how hilariously easy it is to play a light in Div2)

Agreed. Ran into you...Saturday? Got a video of that match? Forgot to hit record on that one. Yeah, I took you out. But with one leg gone, and the other about to drop on a full leg armored Spirit Bear. Only was able to do that becuase of the two MPLs and Streak 6, which everyone is suggesting. I want everyone to see how hard it is when the light is jammed up against your leg and you are getting registered hits with what they are suggesting you “git good” and do. Could not focus on the CT, because I could not see you. And the Streaks, well there you have a weapon system that spreads damage too much, even after the last “buff” ( and I use that term lightly). Really only good when running at least three.

So, I not only gimp myself by not taking the best loadout to deal with the other big bads in the same division, but I also have to deal with a mech that got it’s mobility overly nerfed thanks to the KDK-3 (even though the best loadouts on it are close range brawl for which you need better mobility) because it is the only one I have in inventory with HSP that could do what I needed to ‘git good’ and do.

BTW, PGI - evidently you can jam a PIR into the crotch of a Nova Cat backed up against a wall so it cannot shoot you at all with it’s 5 MPLs on it’s arms, and proceed to core it FROM BEHIND. Learned that last night when power leveling my Nova Cat in solo QP. Wonder if that can be done to every other heavy and assault in the game? Time to rethink all rear torsos hit boxes?

Funny thing is, at least one of people I see making the most toxic posts was one of the same toxic people defending the Skill Web. Who noticeably cut back their play time after it was implemented. Yep, seems like the right people to continue listening to PGI.

[Gwydion Ward]

KodiakGW, on 23 April 2018 - 07:53 AM, said:

BTW, PGI - evidently you can jam a PIR into the crotch of a Nova Cat backed up against a wall so it cannot shoot you at all with it’s 5 MPLs on it’s arms, and proceed to core it FROM BEHIND. Learned that last night when power leveling my Nova Cat in solo QP. Wonder if that can be done to every other heavy and assault in the game? Time to rethink all rear torsos hit boxes?

Happens alot.

Happens to all sorts of different mech's of different weight classes.

Been happening since Day 1 as well i believe. Like so many other issues with the game from Day 1 that never get fixed.

https://clips.twitch...amingoTheRinger