22 replies to this topic

[Angel of Annihilation]

Champion of Khorne Lord of Blood, on 24 April 2018 - 03:36 PM, said:

There's a lot of synergy missing from that build, and synergy is what I love. A lone HLL negates any benefit of the MPLs, the ERSLs can't be fired with the MPLs and have longer durations than them, and in the end even the alpha strike through ghost heat only barely goes above the alpha of the generic laser builds all while having less range. Even going for the average laser alpha build you're faced with low mounts for the majority of your weaponry.

Then comes the whole issue of if its going to be a poking mech why not just bring a lighter and more agile mech so that you just take less damage in the first place since you don't have to expose as much to get shots off and you can get back to cover quicker. All the locked equipment positions and ferro instead of endo don't help it much either. With some agility quirks to make up for the massive weight of that 380xl maybe it could be a bit better.

Personally I don't see a problem with synergy myself then again, I go out of my way to find non-meta builds that work just as good as the stale, generic meta builds.

Here is how I see it. I mount the HLL up high in the left torso mount. It is my mid range poke weapon as well as a strong finish weapon. 18 damage on a single hard point is no joke any way you look at it. My MPL all reside on my right side. 3 up high in the RT and 3 down low in the RA. This gives me a strong Right Side Poke with the ability to Alpha 42 points of damage very rapidly. Further since 3 of the MPLs are up high in the RT, I can use them in conjunction with the HLL to hill hump. Combined Alpha on a hill hump is 39 Alpha as long as I am in the optimal range of my MPLs anyway. I mount the 3 ER SL in my left arm primarily just to give me a fair amount of back up firepower. Also I can use them, and the other arms MPLs to easily engage pesky, fast moving light mechs. Also it gives me another 15 damage for only a 1.5 ton investment. If I am out in the open and running cool enough to deal with the Ghost heat, I can alpha 75 points of damage or if I am running a bit too hot, just disregard the ER SLs all together and still dump 60 damage into my target.

So as you can see from my perspective, I feel there is an absolute ton of synergy to the build and in fact have a fairly powerful tool built in for just about every scenario that I might come across. It the terrain offers more beneficial positioning to take advantage of hill humping, I can hill hump. If the match is a fast Nascar with lots of right side poke, I can easily right side poke. If it goes to a in your face brawl, I can do this as well. If a light mech decided he wants screw around with me, I can effectively engage the light with near overwhelming firepower. This gives me a ton of flexibility that many more meta-friendly mech builds can't offer. About the only thing I can't easily deal with with my Build is the long range snipefest.

[Champion of Khorne Lord of Blood]

Viktor Drake, on 24 April 2018 - 07:32 PM, said:

Personally I don't see a problem with synergy myself then again, I go out of my way to find non-meta builds that work just as good as the stale, generic meta builds.

Here is how I see it. I mount the HLL up high in the left torso mount. It is my mid range poke weapon as well as a strong finish weapon. 18 damage on a single hard point is no joke any way you look at it. My MPL all reside on my right side. 3 up high in the RT and 3 down low in the RA. This gives me a strong Right Side Poke with the ability to Alpha 42 points of damage very rapidly. Further since 3 of the MPLs are up high in the RT, I can use them in conjunction with the HLL to hill hump. Combined Alpha on a hill hump is 39 Alpha as long as I am in the optimal range of my MPLs anyway. I mount the 3 ER SL in my left arm primarily just to give me a fair amount of back up firepower. Also I can use them, and the other arms MPLs to easily engage pesky, fast moving light mechs. Also it gives me another 15 damage for only a 1.5 ton investment. If I am out in the open and running cool enough to deal with the Ghost heat, I can alpha 75 points of damage or if I am running a bit too hot, just disregard the ER SLs all together and still dump 60 damage into my target.

So as you can see from my perspective, I feel there is an absolute ton of synergy to the build and in fact have a fairly powerful tool built in for just about every scenario that I might come across. It the terrain offers more beneficial positioning to take advantage of hill humping, I can hill hump. If the match is a fast Nascar with lots of right side poke, I can easily right side poke. If it goes to a in your face brawl, I can do this as well. If a light mech decided he wants screw around with me, I can effectively engage the light with near overwhelming firepower. This gives me a ton of flexibility that many more meta-friendly mech builds can't offer. About the only thing I can't easily deal with with my Build is the long range snipefest.

See, I'm a meta man, I don't try to build a build that does everything decently, I prefer a specialized build then play to that, yet I find the meta build easily capable of doing all that I need done. For example with the 72 damage 2HLL+6ERML Hellbringer, I have high mounts and high damage for hill humping, its its nascar then I'm keeping up with it and have high torso mounts anyway so what side we are going doesn't matter, if it becomes a brawl then I've surely opened up the enemy before he has gotten into range and have the speed to retreat if needed, if a light mech comes into sight then 72 damage to the legs is going to ruin his day. As I see it, the meta build does all those things your non-meta build does but more effectively, as meta itself isn't meant to just be totally specialized, the whole point of meta is that its general purpose and the best option in a large variety of situations.

[Angel of Annihilation]

Champion of Khorne Lord of Blood, on 24 April 2018 - 11:20 PM, said:

See, I'm a meta man, I don't try to build a build that does everything decently, I prefer a specialized build then play to that, yet I find the meta build easily capable of doing all that I need done. For example with the 72 damage 2HLL+6ERML Hellbringer, I have high mounts and high damage for hill humping, its its nascar then I'm keeping up with it and have high torso mounts anyway so what side we are going doesn't matter, if it becomes a brawl then I've surely opened up the enemy before he has gotten into range and have the speed to retreat if needed, if a light mech comes into sight then 72 damage to the legs is going to ruin his day. As I see it, the meta build does all those things your non-meta build does but more effectively, as meta itself isn't meant to just be totally specialized, the whole point of meta is that its general purpose and the best option in a large variety of situations.

There is nothing really wrong with meta builds, else they wouldn't be meta. Also some mechs don't work with within the meta however that doesn't make the mech bad, instead you just have to work around the limitations of the mech to find something that works. The Executioner is that sort of mech. It doesn't conform the to meta so you have to think outside the box and honestly, truthfully, it isn't less effective that the meta, it is just different. I can generally get top 3 in Matchscore and Damage done in 95% of every match I play in it.

Also while while I recognize the meta as being effective, I often tend to find meta builds to be over specialized. Take a deadside build. You can shield with your left side, reduce armor on that arm to mount more weapons, have everything on the right side of the mech for very concentrated firepower and can take advantage of the counter clockwise rotation that tends to happen in the vast majority of matches. It makes sense, however what happens if the most efficient angle of attack requires you to peek left of a pillar? What happens if you get attacked from your right side and can't use your left arm to effectively shield? What happens if a dual Heavy Gauss Fafnir or Anny takes off your RT taking all your weapons with it? I mean the deadside build work and works well IF the situation your in allows you to take advantage of its benefits but the second you can't, your at a huge disadvantage.

So my point is meta or not, there can be many right ways to achieve the same goal which is overall efficiency. Myself I prize flexibility and adaptability in a mech or build while your typical Alpha Warrior's choose ease of use, ie. click the left mouse button over and over and win. Honestly I see value in both methods and also value in your Hellbringer Build. I have many mechs with similar builds to be honest but I tend to believe people get to hung up the meta way too much and overlook alot of good mechs because of a failure to look outside the box. Then again, that failure is what keeps the advantages I see with the Executioner intact. If people saw what I saw with the Executioner and used it accordingly, I can guarantee PGI would be batting it down, right and left.