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Matchmaking Is Broken


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#1 M4DH4X

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Posted 26 April 2018 - 10:36 AM

How did I get paired with #3 on the ladder? I mean SERIOUSLY, I'm struggling for a .5 w/l and this dude has over 3.0 w/l -- how is that legit in the slightest? What's up with that, just no one playing Solaris?

#2 Dionnsai

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Posted 26 April 2018 - 10:42 AM

idk, but you were able to see where he is on the leaderboard, look at the other mechs on the leaderboard and build one of those mechs to fight with, you should at least be able to get 1/1 win loss ratio

#3 So long and thanks for the fish

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Posted 26 April 2018 - 10:54 PM

You can see the number of players in queue for the division you have selected. So likely it was just two of you.

#4 Nesutizale

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Posted 26 April 2018 - 11:45 PM

Jup. When the matchmaker has no one else to match you with you end up fighting people of much higher but also lower standing.
I just crawled back to a 1.0 standing and when I fight people with Zero stats I kinda feel bad. Sometimes they are just people who play the devision the first time but often its also new players. You notice that in their builds and how they play.

Its a bit sad and I am torn between letting them win and me wanting to win myself.

Edited by Nesutizale, 26 April 2018 - 11:46 PM.


#5 RickySpanish

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Posted 27 April 2018 - 04:18 AM

Happened to me last night, went up against someone with 1900 Elo when I was first in the queue and 5 others were in it. I thought ti myself, there's no way he isn't going to run an ac5 anni and back into an open space. Yep, that's what he did. He also knocked my RT to orange armour through the Steiner bridge, pillar and presumably a sand dune (as we were both on the ground) so that went well. The trouble is, at prime-time EST from 8-10pm, there are only ever about 6 pilots in the queue. The games are almost always the same - its either an Anni who isn't quite a potatoe, so game over. Or, it's a new player who you never see again, because they get wasted. The only good matches I had last night were against Teer and his frigging jump jet equipped Dire Wolf, and one exceptional Anni who I managed to duke on Caves. We need more players!

#6 Rick T Dangerous

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Posted 27 April 2018 - 03:18 PM

As soon as I manage to get to a W/LR of 1, the matchmaker starts throwing people at me that have far higher ELO and W/LR. Then, after five or six losses in a row, my ELO drops again to the point where I can get equal (or worse) opponents. Some of the high ELO people the matchmaker throws at me have a far higher ELO, so to them it's no challenge at all.

Also, there's sometimes people with something like 5 or 10 wins, but no losses. Yet their ELO is in a range that they play against people in the average ELO range (by which I mean around 1500). That's no wonder, as it is now, they gain an average of 15 points per win, so W/LR of 5 means ELO of around 1575. Wouldn't it be better to have an ELO system that get's them into fights that match their skill level much sooner? Like, for example, if the W/LR is bigger than one, the standard ELO gain is multiplied with the W/LR. And if the ELO difference between two players exceeds 100, there's no ELO change for both if the player with the higher ELO wins.

The way it is now, the ELO system in S7 is broken.

Edited by Rick T Dangerous, 27 April 2018 - 03:19 PM.


#7 Throe

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Posted 27 April 2018 - 08:14 PM

View PostTeer Kerensky, on 26 April 2018 - 10:54 PM, said:

You can see the number of players in queue for the division you have selected. So likely it was just two of you.

This.

It's also worth noting that SSR isn't completely accurate all the time. You can "buck" the system by winning that kind of match, and gain a substantial amount of SSR from that individual. (or you should be able to, assuming SSR works the same way it does in chess).

Edited by Throe, 27 April 2018 - 08:33 PM.


#8 Yondu Udonta

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Posted 27 April 2018 - 10:29 PM

They have to deal with a lower population so your SSR doesn't affect whether you fight a high SSR or a low SSR opponent, it only affects the amount of SSR you win/lose at the end of the match. However having the highest SSR in an odd-numbered queue makes you very likely to be skipped should there not be an opponent of SSR similar to yours (which means they try to avoid queuing the best with an average player). So no it is not broken.

#9 Rick T Dangerous

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Posted 28 April 2018 - 03:49 AM

View PostYondu Udonta, on 27 April 2018 - 10:29 PM, said:

However having the highest SSR in an odd-numbered queue makes you very likely to be skipped should there not be an opponent of SSR similar to yours (which means they try to avoid queuing the best with an average player). So no it is not broken.


Sure it's the highest SSR and not the lowest? I lost a lot in Div 4, got a W/LR of about 0.2 there, and when there's an uneven number of players waiting for a match I always get skipped. So I reckon the lowest gets skipped, while the highest SSR gets an ELO boost with an opponent far below his skill.

Although, sometimes you see the timer running down and two players remaining, so there could be a threshold somewhere in the very high SSR values. Haven't heard about something like a player with around 1600 SSR being matched against a player with over 2000 SSR.

#10 Yondu Udonta

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Posted 28 April 2018 - 06:16 AM

View PostRick T Dangerous, on 28 April 2018 - 03:49 AM, said:


Sure it's the highest SSR and not the lowest? I lost a lot in Div 4, got a W/LR of about 0.2 there, and when there's an uneven number of players waiting for a match I always get skipped. So I reckon the lowest gets skipped, while the highest SSR gets an ELO boost with an opponent far below his skill.

Hmm I haven't been running around with a low WLR so based on your observation perhaps it is the extreme ends that are left out of matchmaking. Regardless, being matched up against a stronger opponent gives one the opportunity to learn from the opposition provided that one is bothered to analyze the match, along with losing less SSR than usual due to the huge difference.

#11 justcallme A S H

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Posted 28 April 2018 - 10:17 AM

View PostM4DH4X, on 26 April 2018 - 10:36 AM, said:

How did I get paired with #3 on the ladder? I mean SERIOUSLY, I'm struggling for a .5 w/l and this dude has over 3.0 w/l -- how is that legit in the slightest? What's up with that, just no one playing Solaris?


The way the matching works is rather simple.

If there are only two people in a queue, ELO does not CARE what the score is - there are only two people, it will match them no matter what. It's just a farm fest, essentially. SoloQ works better, even if the wait times are 15-20x as long at times (and that's saying something as SoloQ is horrid).

And that essentially is the key issue that was always going to plague Solaris and it's 14 buckets/queues...

POPULATION, or lack thereof

Edited by justcallme A S H, 28 April 2018 - 10:19 AM.


#12 Vellron2005

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Posted 03 May 2018 - 12:25 AM

That is why you never enter into a Solaris division que with 0 or only 1 player in there..

I actually find the Solaris 7 Matchmakeing by ELO vastly superior to that in QP..

90% of my matches are close and exciting, with only 10% being one-sided (when population is low).

Right now, I would actually rather play 1vs1 Solaris 7 than QP when I'm playing solo. (Shockingly, even without LRMs :P )

Edited by Vellron2005, 03 May 2018 - 12:27 AM.


#13 Willard Phule

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Posted 03 May 2018 - 09:59 PM

And you're surprised why?

At what point has PGI ever created a working matchmaker that even comes close to creating equal matches?

#14 Throe

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Posted 04 May 2018 - 09:13 AM

View PostWillard Phule, on 03 May 2018 - 09:59 PM, said:

And you're surprised why?

At what point has PGI ever created a working matchmaker that even comes close to creating equal matches?

*Fills up his salt storage container. Stows it back in his cupboard.*

We have several working matchmakers in MWO at this point.

#15 Exilyth

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Posted 05 May 2018 - 02:37 PM

View PostNesutizale, on 26 April 2018 - 11:45 PM, said:

I just crawled back to a 1.0 standing and when I fight people with Zero stats I kinda feel bad. Sometimes they are just people who play the devision the first time but often its also new players. You notice that in their builds and how they play.


So true. First solaris match I had, I went against a Mad Dog MDD-C w/2x LBX20 who shot me from across the map and then proclaimed being out of ammo. Walking over and helping out with some missiles of my own left a bad taste in my mouth. Posted Image

This would probably happen less if we had better tutorials.

Edited by Exilyth, 05 May 2018 - 02:38 PM.


#16 ArdvarkX

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Posted 09 May 2018 - 12:12 AM

I am at a loss on this also had 2 losses and 0 wins and the game puts me up against a guy who is 166 and 13

#17 Monkey Lover

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Posted 09 May 2018 - 12:40 AM

ggclose , we need battle values.

Posted Image

Edited by Monkey Lover, 09 May 2018 - 12:42 AM.


#18 surgetank

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Posted 09 May 2018 - 10:32 AM

yip this part of the game is broken , match maker is rubbish it just puts you against bigger mechs with more armour,weapons ,etc , so the game ends up one sided and to be honest not much fun to play , and after this session I have played I won't be playing it again

#19 Nesutizale

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Posted 09 May 2018 - 11:45 AM

I have been destroyed by a Shadowcat three times in a row piloting an assault....so weight isn't the entire problem.





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