23 replies to this topic

[Nightbird]

Even in Lore, famed pilots created customized versions of Battlemechs (not Omnimechs). This means it did not have to be done in the factory and have a manufacturing line dedicated to it.

What if you could select components from within each chassis and for an enormous cbill cost have engineers build your own custom Battlemech for both IS and Clan? (different from Omnimechs in that you can't move components around for free, it's one and done, and you have to rebuild from scratch if you want any changes)

Cost could be from 10x to 100x the cbills for a normal mech, and at least in the beginning would have no quirks (maybe added later).

Discuss

[FupDup]

This would probably result in people making their custom heroes objectively superior to C-Bill variants and even the normal heroes, especially on units that already lack quirks in the first place (thus not having quirks in the beginning is no downside at all).

There are literally hundreds of Battlemechs and thousands of variants in this IP. We don't need to let everybody custom design their own from the ground up. If you want a certain layout you should be asking for a specific chassis or variant already built to carry it.

Edited by FupDup, 01 July 2018 - 10:12 AM.

[Nightbird]

Superior, like you can already do with Omnimechs? Omnis have locked engine and upgrades, Battlemechs will lose all quirks. Seems fair enough. The only Battlemechs without Quirks are those already perfect and can't be improved upon with this change.

FupDup, on 01 July 2018 - 10:11 AM, said:

This would probably result in people making their custom heroes objectively superior to C-Bill variants and even the normal heroes, especially on units that already lack quirks in the first place (thus not having quirks in the beginning is no downside at all).

There are literally hundreds of Battlemechs and thousands of variants in this IP. We don't need to let everybody custom design their own from the ground up. If you want a certain layout you should be asking for a specific chassis or variant already built to carry it.

[Jay Leon Hart]

Oh yes, I would make so many crazy IS energy & MG boats with this. It would be glorious!

[Y E O N N E]

Nightbird, on 01 July 2018 - 10:20 AM, said:

Superior, like you can already do with Omnimechs? Omnis have locked engine and upgrades, Battlemechs will lose all quirks. Seems fair enough. The only Battlemechs without Quirks are those already perfect and can't be improved upon with this change.

Difference being that Omnis have to choose from a selection of pods with limited hard-point variety. Or are you proposing that I can only choose components from existing variants of a BattleMech, i.e. I can only choose arms and torsos from the current suite of Locusts when building my custom Locust hero?

The best Locust, the 1E, doesn't really have any quirks except the small amount of armor all Locusts get on their legs and arms, but I can definitely improve upon it by combining LCT-1E arms with the LCT-1M center torso and LCT-PB side torsos. 12x Small Lasers? Yes, I'll take that.

[Nightbird]

Yeonne Greene, on 01 July 2018 - 11:00 AM, said:

Difference being that Omnis have to choose from a selection of pods with limited hard-point variety. Or are you proposing that I can only choose components from existing variants of a BattleMech, i.e. I can only choose arms and torsos from the current suite of Locusts when building my custom Locust hero?

The best Locust, the 1E, doesn't really have any quirks except the small amount of armor all Locusts get on their legs and arms, but I can definitely improve upon it by combining LCT-1E arms with the LCT-1M center torso and LCT-PB side torsos. 12x Small Lasers? Yes, I'll take that.

Yes, only existing components. Can do the same with Piranha.

[Y E O N N E]

Nightbird, on 01 July 2018 - 11:03 AM, said:

Yes, only existing components. Can do the same with Piranha.

Eh, I'm still not too keen on it, it just obsoletes the Omnis. Being expensive and locked to a specific configuration doesn't really ameliorate this redundancy, since we tend to run our Omnis only in their most optimal configuration as it is and an increased, one-time cost for a recurring benefit just doesn't work to balance anything out.

[Nightbird]

Instead of speaking in generalities, could you point out one omni that is good/great today that would be obsoleted by this?

[TheArisen]

Nightbird, on 01 July 2018 - 11:32 AM, said:

Instead of speaking in generalities, could you point out one omni that is good/great today that would be obsoleted by this?

You're basically proposing an omni system for battlemechs. They would be able to get the HPs you want but still be able to change engines, etc.

[JC Daxion]

Jay Leon Hart, on 01 July 2018 - 10:53 AM, said:

Oh yes, I would make so many crazy IS energy & MG boats with this. It would be glorious!

we already have the arrow, that is a fun mech

[Nightbird]

TheArisen, on 01 July 2018 - 12:00 PM, said:

You're basically proposing an omni system for battlemechs. They would be able to get the HPs you want but still be able to change engines, etc.

Not exactly, the Omni system is designed for quick and easy battlefield refits. Battlemech customization was always possible with extensive engineering that was too expensive for the normal pilot and impractical for the armed forces. The cbill cost will reflect this.

[FupDup]

Nightbird, on 01 July 2018 - 12:04 PM, said:

Not exactly, the Omni system is designed for quick and easy battlefield refits. Battlemech customization was always possible with extensive engineering that was too expensive for the normal pilot and impractical for the armed forces. The cbill cost will reflect this.

Imposing a monopoly money cost does not change the fundamental gameplay mechanics of the system.

[IllCaesar]

Well I'm actually gonna answer this becacuse I don't have a stick quite so far up my own bum that I can't have a little fun every now and then and say that I would make a Commando hero. More specifically, I would make a Commando with weapons in the side torso. I really like the chassis and have noticed that it doesn't have any weapons located there in any of it's variants. I feel like one of the main issues with the Commando is that the arms fall off easily, especially on the existing hero. As such, I think adding some weapons on the side torsos would be an interesting modification. However I think that making them heavy weapon mounts would break the spirit of the chassis so instead of missile or energy I woud have them be ballistic mounts - two or three in each side torso. That alongside one energy mount in each arm and one energy in the center torso. To help keep it distinct from the MG Locusts I would put the engine cap at 200 - fast enough to hit 130KPH with speed tweak but not so fast as to make the Locust-1V and the Flea-19 and Fireant obsolete. The fact that the MGs on this one are in the side torso while the MGs on those three variants are on the arms should help differentiate as well. Ideally the Flea and Locust would have higher engine caps but, you know, PGI gonna PGI.

So yeah, a Commando that is a little outside the norm and sets itself apart in a unique way but not in any way a straight upgrade of any existing variants in it's chassis line or adjacent chassis lines while still having a practical use in the current game.

[Y E O N N E]

Nightbird, on 01 July 2018 - 11:32 AM, said:

Instead of speaking in generalities, could you point out one omni that is good/great today that would be obsoleted by this?

That's an irrelevant, and backwards, query;

1. It's am Omni that's worse or niche that you should be worried about obsoleting; in that case, consider the Nova versus an HBK-IIC with the A torsos and Deathwish arms; do you want a 12x ER Small nuke-boat at 81 kph with excess JJs and 22 DHS or do you want a 12x ER Small nuke-boat at 89 kph with 23 DHS? Personally, I'll take neither; I'll take a Blackjack with 11x Medium Lasers using the BJ-1DC sides, BJ-A center, and BJ-1X arms, all with 35% more inherent range than either of those Clan options and considerably shorter duration.

2. it's the future options you are rendering obsolete. Why should I continue to campaign for the Raptor OmniMech that is stuck running 113 kph with its 11x Energy party trick when I can now build a Locust at 165 kph with 12x energy?

[Nightbird]

Raptor would be the quirked tanky option and the locust the fragile speedster version?

The option doesn't really hurt the over quirked IS mech niche nor the already optimized Clan battlemech niche.

If you want to take a fragile Blackjack with terrible hitboxes, go ahead, choices are added not eliminated.

[RickySpanish]

I'd slap 4 ballistic hard points onto each arm of *insert energy boat here* and trade a laser plus heatsinks for any combination of component stripping machine gun death. It's a cool idea, but it would add a ton of complexity to balancing the game, not to mention an almighty gulf between those with the means and those without... Which would be fine if the population was big enough to make the pilot tier system workable. I'm all for it though, because some folk just want to see the world burn.

[The6thMessenger]

Isn't that already the MechLab's job? Costs modulated by it's equipments? Designs handled by different colors we can apply, or decals we can stick?

Edited by The6thMessenger, 01 July 2018 - 07:00 PM.

[BrunoSSace]

8 light machine guns and 6 er mediums. Custom build any mech you want. Probably want it to be a medium but it probably be a heavy once I finished. Slap that onto a Bushwacker and I would call it a day. I could have some serious fun with this.

[Battlemaster56]

Well if I want a custom hero would love a PIR with 10M hp's a 2E hp's and call it Sheer Heartattack! I would run that glorious ******* for days.

[Vellron2005]

Nightbird, on 01 July 2018 - 10:05 AM, said:

Even in Lore, famed pilots created customized versions of Battlemechs (not Omnimechs). This means it did not have to be done in the factory and have a manufacturing line dedicated to it.

What if you could select components from within each chassis and for an enormous cbill cost have engineers build your own custom Battlemech for both IS and Clan? (different from Omnimechs in that you can't move components around for free, it's one and done, and you have to rebuild from scratch if you want any changes)

Cost could be from 10x to 100x the cbills for a normal mech, and at least in the beginning would have no quirks (maybe added later).

Discuss

If we allowed custom-component mechs, we could just throw balance out the window..

In a game where you can buy resources for real money, and where most of the top-tier buy-every-mechpack-whales have more resources than they know what to do with, this would be game breaking.

So.. NO.

What would be nice tho, is investing 1 million mech XP to turn a regular mech into a hero mech with a 25% cbill bonus.

That way, it would still be weaker than a MC-only Hero, but would give us something to do with all the unused mech XP.