84 replies to this topic

[Obiwayne]

edit: after messing up this thread, I had to recreate it entirely.

What i wanted to say is, that clan advantages in speed, weight, range, heat management and alpha damage massively outweigh IS sturdiness.
Some people say that IS has the ability to "outbrawl" clan mechs but in reality this doesnt effectively apply. IS mechs are much slower if they dont want to sacrifice their only real advantage (sturdiness and the ability to carry enough "brawling" weapons) for speed and weight in form of an xl engine to be able to pursue retreating clan mechs.
There is still a 150m to 300m gap of effective weapons range a IS mech has to close before being able to output its full potential in terms of cooldowns and heat.
Meanwhile clans can exploit a higher alpha damage output, the range and effective damage range of clan weapons and a better heat management before fully commiting to go "all in" by overriding and maximizing the damage output before ending their own life as a martyr.
I appreciate the changes. Even if they may not be final/have to be adjusted afterwards, they are necessary.

second edit:

Allright, this was complete salty bullcrap. After more testing I'm not even sure anymore if we need changes at all.
Oysters seem to be equally good as clams so yeah...

Edited by EdSt0nE, 12 July 2018 - 02:54 AM.

[Noguchi-san]

Sry but you are wrong in my Opinion. (i edited this because you edited your first post to which i was responding)

IS got all the nice advantages over Clan Mechs when it comes to a brawl situation and in every Siege Map you will get your Chance of brawl. Dual Heavy Gauss plus 6 Med Lasers and the paper Clan Mechs goes "pouuuuf" - so easy to say!

When it comes down to PUGS vs PREMADE - the outcome is in 99% sure the PREMADE will win!

YOU cannot nerf TEAMPLAY!

Edited by Noguchi-san, 11 July 2018 - 05:01 AM.

[Obiwayne]

Noguchi-san, on 10 July 2018 - 04:08 PM, said:

Sry but you are absolutly wrong.

IS got all the nice advantages over Clan Mechs when it comes to a brawl situation and in every Siege Map you will get your Chance of brawl. Dual Heavy Gauss plus 6 Med Lasers and the paper Clan Mechs goes "pouuuuf" - so easy to say!

When it comes down to PUGS vs PREMADE - the outcome is in 99% sure the PREMADE will win!

YOU cannot nerf TEAMPLAY!

Given the unpredictability of game modes or maps in faction play, IS will never be able to fully exploit their advantages. As you say, "when it comes to a brawling situation", which can not be forced on every map and/or game mode.

It is much easier to adapt to a hide and seek/pseudo "firing discipline" strategy at max range after a thousand games than to fully commit and take 99% of all the risks that come with a ballsy push to get in effective weapons range.

[Jaybles-The-PegLeg-PotatoCaptain]

EdSt0nE, on 10 July 2018 - 04:37 PM, said:

Given the unpredictability of game modes or maps in faction play, IS will never be able to fully exploit their advantages. As you say, "when it comes to a brawling situation", which can not be forced on every map and/or game mode.

It is much easier to adapt to a hide and seek/pseudo "firing discipline" strategy at max range after a thousand games than to fully commit and take 99% of all the risks that come with a ballsy push to get in effective weapons range.

Unpredictability? You have at least 1 minute notice or more before every FP drop. Plenty of time to pick 4 mechs that are completely capable of taking advantage of all the maps and game modes currently in rotation. Of course, working with a team and having set strategies before you even press the launch button helps too...

[Obiwayne]

Touche you s*n of a b****h.

Even after ******* thousand games I didnt know that I can pick my drop deck accordingly to the maps and game modes. Should probably have played more fw. But it didnt seem appealing enough because of 99% of clan stomps.

I cant belive that this only has to do with premade or not. It is a well known fact that clans hold the w/l advantage over Is.

[Jaybles-The-PegLeg-PotatoCaptain]

EdSt0nE, on 10 July 2018 - 05:12 PM, said:

Touche you s*n of a b****h.

Even after ******* thousand games I didnt know that I can pick my drop deck accordingly to the maps and game modes. Should probably have played more fw. But it didnt seem appealing enough because of 99% of clan stomps.

I cant belive that this only has to do with premade or not. It is a well known fact that clans hold the w/l advantage over Is.

Source please?

I mean if we want to use anecdotal evidence, I play both sides, IS and Clan in FP just about equally and have a W/L of 3.5. I win just as much on IS side as I do on clan side. So, I guess based on my thousands of FP drops and W/L, the tech bases are pretty darn equal right now from my point of view, but if you have stats from PGI showing this well known fact please do share.

Edited by Jaybles-The-PegLeg-PotatoCaptain, 10 July 2018 - 05:27 PM.

[Obiwayne]

Jaybles-The-PegLeg-PotatoCaptain, on 10 July 2018 - 05:25 PM, said:

[/size]

Source please?

I mean if we want to use anecdotal evidence, I play both sides, IS and Clan IN fp just about equally and have a W/L of 3.5. I win just as much on IS side as I do on clan side. So, I guess based on my thousands of FP drops and W/L, the tech bases are pretty darn equal right now from my point of view, but if you have stats from PGI showing this will known fact please do share.

dream on. If you are really asking for insight from PGI about their ingame mechanics you should first adress heat management inaccuracies. I havent played on both sides, you are right. But my brother played this game for a reason on clan side continuously for the last like 5 years.
If you think that the majority of one sided stomps in FW happen because clan players are naturally better (even in matches without "obvious" premades) you must be truly blinded by something.

[Jaybles-The-PegLeg-PotatoCaptain]

EdSt0nE, on 10 July 2018 - 05:34 PM, said:

dream on. If you are really asking for insight from PGI about their ingame mechanics you should first adress heat management inaccuracies. I havent played on both sides, you are right. But my brother played this game for a reason on clan side continuously for the last like 5 years.
If you think that the majority of one sided stomps in FW happen because clan players are naturally better (even in matches without "obvious" premades) you must be truly blinded by something.

https://gyazo.com/79...6ea93a6057fa692

Match ended at 7:00PM PST

12 v 12 premade IS win just now. 40-18 on conquest. They dropped 8 lights first and played the cap game hard which shows in the close final tally. Good match and well played Templars

[Nightbird]

Come play Clan side, we will make you believe that IS is OP.

[Rick T Dangerous]

EdSt0nE, on 10 July 2018 - 05:34 PM, said:

If you think that the majority of one sided stomps in FW happen because clan players are naturally better (even in matches without "obvious" premades) you must be truly blinded by something.

Here's something to consider: Over the last one and a half years clans have been nerfed while IS has been buffed. Result: Claners had to get better to compensate for nerfs, while lots of long time IS players got worse. In recent weeks I've seen plenty of IS players stand around somewhere on the map, waiting for targets. Some days ago I've seen a pilot I know for a long time just stand there in his Phoenix Hawk, taking cheap shots until he got killed. Some months ago you would only see that kind of behaviour with pilots in assaults, maybe a heavily armoured heavy mech. But now with mediums and sometimes even lights? C'mon! I had a LOCUST standing around "scouting". Doesn't that dude know that if your light stands still, your light runs out?
Lately I've seen more and more formerly very good IS pilots do stuff they wouldn't have done a year ago. Stupid stuff. Those buffs ain't good for you, guys. You are spoiled.

P.S.: And don't get me started on how some ISers obviously lost their ability to aim thanks to those seductive LRMs...

[Johnathan Tanner]

The IS has become ridiculously spoiled thru the LFE and armor-structure quirks made insane by the skill tree. I miss when IS was hard mode and almost every single build ran an XL. Team play beats everything. That will never change. But shits getting really stupid really fast.

[Roland09]

OP, I hate to write it, but your over-simplifications are almost as bad as "The Clans have been nerfed into the ground again, ZOMG!!!11!".

[justcallme A S H]

Well I came expecting something.

What I got was just a facepalm.

[Grus]

Show me on this bear where the Premade touched you...

[Ragnar Rock]

Aloha

Edstone says:
What i wanted to say is, that clan advantages in speed, weight, range, heat management and alpha damage massively outweigh IS sturdiness.

but he wants to say
i really dont know anything about MWO, i cant hit a target direct in front of me ( Jarls List ), please give me a Mech with a Killallenemy-Button

Edited by Ragnar Rock, 10 July 2018 - 11:23 PM.

[Fuerchtenichts]

Just another example when a player tries to blame everyone and everything else but to realize that FP is at least a team game. In >90% of all games it's a team and not a tech balance issue when you loose. Learn to accept that there are better players than you and improve your game together with others. If you do so, you will win >50% of your matches.

@EdStonE
Da du offenbar aus Köln kommst, geh doch mal ins deutsche Forum, suche dir dort die TS Daten von deutschen IS Units raus die viel FP spielen und trete mal mit denen in Kontakt. Mein Vorschlag wären aktuell die OSOs, die Blutigen Templer oder die 31HR.

Edited by Fuerchtenichts, 10 July 2018 - 11:35 PM.

[MTier Slayed Up]

Crikey! Look over der! What we got here is another "x Faction is OP, nerf dem!" thread! Careful handling with dis one, they're a bit poisonous and will set you up for a doozy if ya ain't careful, but with the right touch, dese here buggers r' harmless.



I think we can all agree on this timeless argument that both factions feel pretty good where they currently sit at.
Here's the problem though - A more skilled coordinated team will beat the less skilled coordinated team, no matter which faction they decide to play as.
Shocking revelation, I know.

[Obiwayne]

And it happened. Apparantly I struck a nerve and people seem to feel a need to gank up and trashtalk me with no constructivity whatsoever.
Just a bunch of conceited pri cks.
We talk again after laser changes and see what happens. 99% of you guys will be crying rivers in forums.
Im looking forward to that and to whoop your asses

Edited by EdSt0nE, 11 July 2018 - 01:33 AM.

[Obiwayne]

Most of you guys are already crying rivers. Some even did b4 details about the changes were released. You also do gank up in other subforums on people that critizie clans.
Its basically what clan Players do: cry rivers and gank up on single targets.

[Obiwayne]

And for the record I am not complaining about premades. Its a natural thing that Teamwork wins.