1169 replies to this topic

[Cato Zilks]

Paul Inouye, on 08 August 2018 - 05:16 PM, said:

One other thing I need to ask here. Thoughts on a 'Mech spawning into the match without dropship animations? Kinda like Battlefield/CoD/et al. I know it's not the greatest for immersion but it will help address some other issues on the table.

Personally, I am not a fan, but I could live with it. Especially if it allows us to spawn closer together.

[Wing 0]

wait a second. didn't we had a feature about drop locations awhile back with the battle grid? I think its still there but it hasn't been utilized.

[justcallme A S H]

Paul Inouye, on 08 August 2018 - 05:16 PM, said:

One other thing I need to ask here. Thoughts on a 'Mech spawning into the match without dropship animations? Kinda like Battlefield/CoD/et al. I know it's not the greatest for immersion but it will help address some other issues on the table.

Depends what you are trying to achieve from it?

Or perhaps - What benefits do you see / aiming for from doing this?


From an immersion perspective I think its good to have animation. The 30s timer and stuff I know was a restriction you gave once before if my memory is correct. Plus 30s allows people to 'swap out' dropzones if needed. Either that or make it selectable...

If removing the animation makes it selectable, well then I'd forgo the animation for that as it's overall a value-add.

Edited by justcallme A S H, 08 August 2018 - 05:50 PM.

[slide]

How exactly does CoD etc do it? I have never played them.

If it is instant teleport in then I guess I could live with it.

Is the problem dropship animations with select able spawn locations?

If so might I suggest 5 or 6 fixed mechbay buildings (or grounded dropships) per side, with indestructible turrets, which we could then spawn inside of, power up and walk out of. Removes a lot of the animation issues with the drop ships and helps to prevent spawn camping as the enemy don't know where you will appear from.

I can live with the immersion of a pilot getting back to base (on foot/rescues) to get in another mech.

[Appogee]

Paul Inouye, on 08 August 2018 - 05:16 PM, said:

One other thing I need to ask here. Thoughts on a 'Mech spawning into the match without dropship animations? Kinda like Battlefield/CoD/et al. I know it's not the greatest for immersion but it will help address some other issues on the table.

The dropship animation is great for immersion and I'd be loathe to lose it.

Can you tell us what we'd potentially get if we traded it off? It's hard to advise you otherwise.

Edited by Appogee, 08 August 2018 - 06:24 PM.

[Appogee]

justcallme A S H, on 08 August 2018 - 05:41 PM, said:

If removing the animation makes it selectable, well then I'd forgo the animation for that as it's overall a value-add.

I wouldn't. While I'd overall like to be able to select my dropzone, I think anything that makes the game more 'arcadey' is a bad thing.

There is a downside to selectable dropzones, too. Deathballs will become more concentrated more quickly. With the three dropzones it opens up the engagement a little.

Sure, at times you drop into an encamped enemy and that sucks. But it doesn't happen all that often.

[Therax]

Feature suggestion: after the second wave of the attackers mechs are dead there is the option to surrender for the attacking team. Require the surrender vote to be unanimous so that if any of the attacking players want to play it out they will be able to, but allow a way out of the match if everyone agrees to end it.
Pugs complain about drop zone camping all the time and as the defending team in the siege game type there is no other way to quickly end a match against a vastly outclassed opponent. Often a few pugs will just disconnect after the first wave goes very badly for their team, which I take as an indication of how little fun they are having, and as the defenders it is not fun to have to stay and clean up all 48 mechs against an opponent that has almost no chance of winning.

[SilentScreamer]

Paul Inouye, on 08 August 2018 - 05:16 PM, said:

One other thing I need to ask here. Thoughts on a 'Mech spawning into the match without dropship animations? Kinda like Battlefield/CoD/et al. I know it's not the greatest for immersion but it will help address some other issues on the table.

Depends on what you mean by "without dropship animation"? Are we:
a) removing the PointofView flyby from the cockpit of our own mech, or
b) Dropship will be there but static...no hovering & when it leaves it vanishes, or
c) Dropship removed entirely...mechs to materialize out of thin air.

I'm okay with starting in my mech at power-up, but I really don't like the idea of an enemy mechs or dropships popping up out of nowhere.

Keep some immersion. If dropships showing up are causing problems, what about Drop Pods? http://www.sarna.net/wiki/Drop_Pod

Edited by SilentScreamer, 09 August 2018 - 06:23 AM.

[Bowelhacker]

Paul Inouye, on 08 August 2018 - 05:16 PM, said:

One other thing I need to ask here. Thoughts on a 'Mech spawning into the match without dropship animations? Kinda like Battlefield/CoD/et al. I know it's not the greatest for immersion but it will help address some other issues on the table.

I think once you've seen it a couple of times the general thrill is lost. I'd rather just get back out there and shoot.

Although you'd miss out on the dropship having a few potshots at any badguys lurking in your drop zone. In some matches it's only the dropships doing any damage...

Edited by Bowelhacker, 08 August 2018 - 07:56 PM.

[Terrorsdawn]

I could live with the dropship flying at the start of the match and then hovering over the drop zone till the end. KEEPS a bit of Emerson, provides continues cover to assist against drop zone farming. Dropship could suspend firing when a x numbering of mechs from there drop are in the zone to prevent friendly fire damage and people abusing the extra coverage they provide.


Lastly in total way out there thought if a match is so lopsided let the dropship take damage and be shot down to be captured as huge bonus salvage rewards. Or driven off to reduce drop zones shifting remaining mechs to small zones were the drop is concentrated.

Edited by Terrorsdawn, 08 August 2018 - 08:21 PM.

[Iron Buccaneer]

ADI84000, on 06 August 2018 - 04:03 AM, said:

just give a random quality supply cache to everyone who wins a FP match , and 1 every 2 games lost for the ones who loose, and people will have an incentive to play it more, its like random salvage

How about awarding a supply cache to anyone who achieved say a certain cumulative match score during a planetary conflict phase? Perhaps just award it to the winning side.

[Starwulfe]

Paul Inouye, on 08 August 2018 - 05:16 PM, said:

One other thing I need to ask here. Thoughts on a 'Mech spawning into the match without dropship animations? Kinda like Battlefield/CoD/et al. I know it's not the greatest for immersion but it will help address some other issues on the table.

Story-wise, mechs can be equipped with rockets for high altitude drops. So we just don;t see the dropship fly over.

[MischiefSC]

Paul Inouye, on 08 August 2018 - 05:16 PM, said:

One other thing I need to ask here. Thoughts on a 'Mech spawning into the match without dropship animations? Kinda like Battlefield/CoD/et al. I know it's not the greatest for immersion but it will help address some other issues on the table.

No question at all.

Immersion is great and something you want to have. However, take a look at HBS Battletech. Most people would say it's very immersive for a Battletech game - however it takes way more liberties with original lore/tabletop values than MWO does. While it shows dropships they just sorta pop in and out and mechs just appear. Enemies just appear right out of sensor range. All that immersion that it provides is done outside of the main gameplay.

Most of us have thousands or even tens of thousands of drops. All the stuff you put into the actual match isn't going to mean much after a few hundred drops and be invisible a thousand later. The immersion that matters and really hits people is the stuff that happens between matches. It's why people cared so much about faction identity, distinct fronts, etc.

Gameplay/fun in matches is >>>>> over immersion fluff in matches. You can trade 10 in game immersion flare bits for 1 out-of-match meta-level immersion. Many thousands of players got into MWO and were hyped over FW not because of respawns and dropships and because the Omega McGuffin was a generator for a gun instead of just a glowing box to stand in. They did it because they wanted to play Davions and shoot the damn Dracs, or because they wanted to be Clan Muppet Kisser and say 'Aff' and 'Neg' and 'YOU DARE REFUSE MY BATCHAL' on comms. Make the matches more fun to play, put the immersion in outside the matches, we'll have fun shooting each other and have an easier time with our pretendy-fun-time games.

Edited by MischiefSC, 08 August 2018 - 10:13 PM.

[Deathshade]

Let us take a look at this objectively. Nobody else has done a planetary system except for maybe NBT Hardcore but even then, it was a system just made up to essentially allow the Planetary Assaults/Raids/Recons typical of Battletech.

What we need to do is list our current mechanics which doesn't need any additional coding so it can be put forth with little effort. There are all the pieces there for a good planetary and/or community warfare on a galactic scale. It just needs to be organized and paired with a good economy for the planets and battles that include salvage.

What do the supply caches essentially give us? Just salvage, albeit random which mechwarrior want what they fought as salvage. Even the economy structure is there with the current unit coffers and/or mercenary contracts. What did the mechwarriors buy with their money? More metal to fight with and defend what we won. It is really pretty basic and it will give the units reason to fight as a loyalist or as a merc.

Maybe we can even have Pirates someday with all their crazy units and constant raids. You guys think it is worth me compiling this or am I just blowing hot air into the wind?

Edited by Deathshade, 08 August 2018 - 11:32 PM.

[DarkFhoenix]

I think Scouting mode needs an overhaul or possibly renamed to suite its proper role which i would say skirmish but that words taken . Nobody scouts , We get ahead in that game using 55 ton SRM / Streak boats blow everyone up and download a beacon . This is combat not scouting . Dont get me wrong I find it cool but for all the reasons not scout related . Its mini invasion.

The mechs that should be shining and most wanted in scout land should be Locusts and Arctic cheetahs .
Engaging in combat should be penalized . Stealth and speed should be rewarded .

QP is what gives a player a real chance to be a proper scout . Not fighting but taking resources or powering up a tower at the base or stealing a base . Spotting enemies , narcing enemies .

Yes that kind of play is not for everyone but we have lots of other game modes where you can blow up mechs.

If i could suggest
something , say at the top of your screen in scout mode you have a number say 100 friendly mechs engaging 100 enemies too far to see . Just numbers representing a battle supposedly taking place 40 miles away

You do something say grab a power node and take back to base and power up a gun / artillary and this Cannon say as big as that cannon in siege mode Shoots off once
reduces enemy number counter eventually to
zero and your team wins . To be honest i would love to do something scouty and have the mega cannon fire off a shot . Have a significant reduction in numbers representing mechs destroyed by cannon shots and a minimum number ticking down every couple minutes representing mechs destroying other mechs . Who said those numbers needed to be mechs , could be spaceships , infantry or tanks ...........possibly
Toad Suites . XD

You have a siege mode where mega cannon is attacked / defended .
You could have the same map where scout mechs
do funny tasks needing speed to fire off this thing faster than the enemy scouts doing funny things to disable it and prevent it firing off. Spotting checks on
enemy players should be consequential for enemies . Engaging in direct combat should be counter productive .

Lets be honest , scouts engaging enemy scouts is not scouting.

Another cool idea faction play could use .
A Co Op mode . 12 mechs or since you have the numbers possibly
24 mechs all engaging and firing at say for example A huge enemy battleship and this behemoth is defending itself . Something like that would be loads of fun . Everyone loves a dragon fight .

Edited by DarkFhoenix, 08 August 2018 - 11:56 PM.

[Tarl Cabot]

Starwulfe, on 08 August 2018 - 09:50 PM, said:

Story-wise, mechs can be equipped with rockets for high altitude drops. So we just don;t see the dropship fly over.

Or change it from an Aerodyne dropship doing flybys to a Spheroid dropship that stays put....

Edited by Tarl Cabot, 09 August 2018 - 12:40 AM.

[creativeabyss]

Tarl Cabot, on 09 August 2018 - 12:40 AM, said:

Or change it from an Aerodyne dropship doing flybys to a Spheroid dropship that stays put....

if there was just a stationary union class sitting in front of were you just magic-poof into existence, then you wouldnt even need walls. anything gets close it just dissapears in a haze of missles and lasers immediatly. thatd be cool AF if pgi could do that.

Edited by creativeabyss, 09 August 2018 - 01:22 AM.

[50 50]

Eisenhorne, on 08 August 2018 - 05:53 AM, said:

Vellron2005, they have explicitly stated that changes like that (where planets held affect the costs of things, give other rewards) is not possible at this time. So it's more about suggesting things that CAN be done instead of what we would like it to be. I have fun with FP as it is now, but it could be tweaked with minor changes to make it even better. It won't be what we wanted in the first place, but it can still be fun.

What you don't really want either is to reward players for joining a faction and getting discounts in store but not actually playing the mode.

But, I'm curious.
The way this idea has been repeatedly put forward is to give members of a faction a discount on items in the store/mech lab.

• Wouldn't it be possible to instead increase match earnings according to the number of planets the faction controls?

That would specifically reward players for playing and give them more c-bills to spend which kind of has the same effect as a discount.

With any faction value that can be adjusted according to how many star systems the faction controls it should have a two sided impact. The more star systems = better for loyalists, less for mercs.

Edited by 50 50, 09 August 2018 - 01:55 AM.

[50 50]

MischiefSC, on 08 August 2018 - 10:12 PM, said:

No question at all.

Immersion is great and something you want to have. However, take a look at HBS Battletech. Most people would say it's very immersive for a Battletech game - however it takes way more liberties with original lore/tabletop values than MWO does. While it shows dropships they just sorta pop in and out and mechs just appear. Enemies just appear right out of sensor range. All that immersion that it provides is done outside of the main gameplay.

Most of us have thousands or even tens of thousands of drops. All the stuff you put into the actual match isn't going to mean much after a few hundred drops and be invisible a thousand later. The immersion that matters and really hits people is the stuff that happens between matches. It's why people cared so much about faction identity, distinct fronts, etc.

Gameplay/fun in matches is >>>>> over immersion fluff in matches. You can trade 10 in game immersion flare bits for 1 out-of-match meta-level immersion. Many thousands of players got into MWO and were hyped over FW not because of respawns and dropships and because the Omega McGuffin was a generator for a gun instead of just a glowing box to stand in. They did it because they wanted to play Davions and shoot the damn Dracs, or because they wanted to be Clan Muppet Kisser and say 'Aff' and 'Neg' and 'YOU DARE REFUSE MY BATCHAL' on comms. Make the matches more fun to play, put the immersion in outside the matches, we'll have fun shooting each other and have an easier time with our pretendy-fun-time games.

Absolutely +1 this.

The actual battles are always going to be what they are and have always been.
But you put in some sort of lead up that brings players in at that group and planning stage and then the debriefing after and having to deal with the results of the mission.

That's where I thought it would be interesting to explore turning the mode into a campaign where we had to stretch the 4 mechs from the drop deck over as many missions as possible.
Give each mission a benefit to your group which then gives you a reason to undertake it.
It allows that between match immersion.

Edited by 50 50, 09 August 2018 - 02:24 AM.

[Bishop Six]

50 50, on 09 August 2018 - 01:55 AM, said:

What you don't really want either is to reward players for joining a faction and getting discounts in store but not actually playing the mode.

But, I'm curious.
The way this idea has been repeatedly put forward is to give members of a faction a discount on items in the store/mech lab.

• Wouldn't it be possible to instead increase match earnings according to the number of planets the faction controls?

That would specifically reward players for playing and give them more c-bills to spend which kind of has the same effect as a discount.


With any faction value that can be adjusted according to how many star systems the faction controls it should have a two sided impact. The more star systems = better for loyalists, less for mercs.

The point is for me (and other teammates): We reached General rank and after that time i'm just collecting other stuff than cbills, because i have so many cbills, i could use it as ammo for racs to shoot you dead with cbill coins.

What i desire as Level 20 loyalist is some special stuff which i can put on my favourite mech to show the rest of the world that i am a FP badass xD
Something like special camo, (General) Warhorn or a special mech variant only achieving over the rank tree. And MCs. MCs always are good!