453 replies to this topic

[Robert Bruce]

Holly shikaki mushrooms!

PGI listening to the wrong crowd again :/ .......

[Pihoqahiak]

Axys Rageborn, on 21 August 2018 - 04:00 AM, said:

I have been doing some digging and it looks like everyone before this patch believes that streaks gaining the bonus from Artemis is a bug. Is this true and if so aren't PGI just fixing a bug?

The problem is that the change affects more than just Streaks, and ATMs are intended to have Artemis built into them. They are also reducing the lock on area by more than half (even though they try to present it as only by half), combined with increased time to lock on, that will cause all lock on weapons to take significant more time to deal their damage than the very minor velocity increase compensates for.
PGI will preach trying to implement balance changes in smaller iterations in one hand, while carrying a sledgehammer for changes in the other. It really doesn't present a well coordinated development process unfortunately.

[Pihoqahiak]

Story Time, on 21 August 2018 - 04:01 AM, said:

I did find it a little funny that a World Champion who took 1st place 2 years in a row managed to do consistently better in an LRM boat than any other mech. I wonder if actually aiming will be better than not exposing and not aiming again?

yes. A nearly six year old bug

If you define "better" as having a higher damage total at the end of a QP match against lower skilled players than him, yes. If he had taken direct fire builds, I am very sure he would have ended those matches much more quickly by taking 1/3 of the time (and damage output) to destroy the enemy team, and I think he would agree, since he did play his direct fire mechs during some of those same streams and that is exactly what happened much more often than not.

[Kirito Kerenksy]

HammerMaster, on 21 August 2018 - 03:45 PM, said:

It's not faction play. It's abusers of faction play. Meta [Redacted]. And elitist [Redacted] that want to be top dog no matter the cost to lore.

(People who are better than me hate LRMs because of lore reasons, not because people who practice and git gud at a game would naturally be better)

[Redacted]

Edited by draiocht, 22 August 2018 - 08:00 PM.
unconstructive, Quote Clean-Up

[Pihoqahiak]

Admiral Ackbar 86, on 21 August 2018 - 05:46 AM, said:

Can we get some more buffs for AMS though, in it's current form it is pretty useless in quickplay since you can't depend on most of the team carrying it, and 1 AMS basically does nothing and is wasted tonnage if no one else brings it to the fight.

I usually see between 60-150 missiles destroyed (at a minimum) while using a single AMS with 1/2 ton of ammo, that will equal the damage soaking potential of at least 1 ton worth of armor in most cases, and it is applied to the team, not just for you, so it's already worth it to me on a lot of mech builds.

Edited by Pihoqahiak, 21 August 2018 - 04:21 PM.

[Mikayshen]

So what's going on with Spiders capping the base in about 30 seconds? Working as intended to just be a 'defend the base' game when that mission comes up? Just had a match with 2 spiders who capped our base super fast and it only showed 50% capped when the game ended.

[HammerMaster]

Story Time, on 21 August 2018 - 04:15 PM, said:

(People who are better than me hate LRMs because of lore reasons, not because people who practice and git gud at a game would naturally be better)

[Redacted]

Oh no. The dreaded git gud.
Droll.
Predictable.
Redundant.
[Redacted]

Edited by draiocht, 22 August 2018 - 08:03 PM.
unconstructive, inappropriate reference, Quote Clean-Up

[Kirito Kerenksy]

HammerMaster, on 21 August 2018 - 04:35 PM, said:

Oh no. The dreaded git gud.
Droll.
Predictable.
Redundant.

Dreaded indeed. When you outright say players who play the game better than you are cancer there really is nothing more to say is there?

[HammerMaster]

Story Time, on 21 August 2018 - 04:42 PM, said:

Dreaded indeed. When you outright say players who play the game better than you are cancer there really is nothing more to say is there?

Better than me I can accept.
Better than lore?
Blasphemy!

[SilentScreamer]

Mikayshen, on 21 August 2018 - 04:23 PM, said:

So what's going on with Spiders capping the base in about 30 seconds? Working as intended to just be a 'defend the base' game when that mission comes up? Just had a match with 2 spiders who capped our base super fast and it only showed 50% capped when the game ended.

Were you alive or dead at the time the Spiders capped? Cap Screens have always been a bit buggy for dead pilots.

[Kirito Kerenksy]

HammerMaster, on 21 August 2018 - 04:44 PM, said:

Better than me I can accept.
Better than lore?
Blasphemy!

Better than lore? I Think you'll find most custom mechs in Table Top are better than their counterparts. You ever run a stock Atlas K against an Atlas with TSM, Tandem charge SRMs and a Heavy Gauss rifle? Its not pretty for the Atlas K.

If you want stock mechs and lore gameplay, play the World Championship. I think you'll find that there's a meta for that too.

[Axys Rageborn]

Pihoqahiak, on 21 August 2018 - 04:01 PM, said:

The problem is that the change affects more than just Streaks, and ATMs are intended to have Artemis built into them. They are also reducing the lock on area by more than half (even though they try to present it as only by half), combined with increased time to lock on, that will cause all lock on weapons to take significant more time to deal their damage than the very minor velocity increase compensates for.
PGI will preach trying to implement balance changes in smaller iterations in one hand, while carrying a sledgehammer for changes in the other. It really doesn't present a well coordinated development process unfortunately.

I'm not trying to defend PGI here as I think its pretty dumb the way they go around things but if gaining bonuses from artemis with out any of the draw backs (ie: extra tonnage per launcher) is a bug then its good that its gone. Also ATMs reflect having Artemis built into them by their core stats as stated in the thread.

Personally having to aim like 1 second more shouldn't get people so worked up and after playing for a bit its really not the doomsday ppl are crying about.

Aiming is part of an fps and if its hard find ways around it ie lower sensitivity.

Edited by Axys Rageborn, 21 August 2018 - 05:06 PM.

[Kirito Kerenksy]

Axys Rageborn, on 21 August 2018 - 04:55 PM, said:

Aiming is part of an fps and if its hard find ways around it ie lower sensitivity.

I think you wrapped up the entirety of my umbrage with people's complaints. The only additional lock on time needed is what was lost with INDIRECT fire which means the amount of time needed to acquire lock doesn't mater because you're not risking armor.

If not needing to aim was what people liked about LRMs in their current previous state, then good riddance.

Edited by Story Time, 21 August 2018 - 05:01 PM.

[HammerMaster]

Story Time, on 21 August 2018 - 04:55 PM, said:

Better than lore? I Think you'll find most custom mechs in Table Top are better than their counterparts. You ever run a stock Atlas K against an Atlas with TSM, Tandem charge SRMs and a Heavy Gauss rifle? Its not pretty for the Atlas K.

If you want stock mechs and lore gameplay, play the World Championship. I think you'll find that there's a meta for that too.

I have previously expressed our need for mechlab hard mode many times thank you.
Of course you can't compare a custom rig like that vs stock K. Proves nothing.

[Bwah Ha Ha]

I need to play the SSRMs to see how well they work now.
I have learned to get rid of Artemis and add more useful equipment.
EchoHotel I used SSRM boats to pop Mediums and up that like to hang in the back. Nothing like 48pts damage from 4 SSRM6s.
EchoHotel My Nova and Night Gyr will still be playing up towards the front. Nothing more satisfying then giving someone a face full of 80-90 LRMs.

[Marquis De Lafayette]

Mikayshen, on 21 August 2018 - 04:23 PM, said:

So what's going on with Spiders capping the base in about 30 seconds? Working as intended to just be a 'defend the base' game when that mission comes up? Just had a match with 2 spiders who capped our base super fast and it only showed 50% capped when the game ended.

A friend from another unit tried the spider 5v out (just to see how the buff was going to work) and confirms this exact bug (might have been the same game...idk). To his surprise they got a base win at what looked to be 50%-ish. So, I just the cap acceleration doesn’t seem to be visually represented in the bar....no one had an idea really how close to capture they actually were.

Edited by Marquis De Lafayette, 21 August 2018 - 06:05 PM.

[Natural Predator]

I welcome the weapons lock changes. I shouldn’t take a 2 second peek an get an immediate lurm 100 to the face. Lurm should be sustained fire force multiplier on LOS targets or in conjunction with narc/tag.

Edited by Ragnar Baron Leiningen, 21 August 2018 - 06:24 PM.

[Jackal Noble]

Marquis De Lafayette, on 21 August 2018 - 06:05 PM, said:

A friend from another unit tried the spider 5v out (just to see how the buff was going to work) and confirms this exact bug (might have been the same game...idk). To his surprise they got a base win at what looked to be 50%-ish. So, I just the cap acceleration doesn’t seem to be visually represented in the bar....no one had an idea really how close to capture they actually were.

I wish I was recording when this happened earlier. Was about 200m from our base in a Piranha and it was at about 20% the game ended. {Richard Cameron} just said " cap accel!" Was like no that's some bs right there.

Why is this game so borked all the time?

[Arkhangel]

As for people whining about the lock radius.... honestly... now it actually takes some skill to run a Streak Boat because you actually have to aim somewhat. I've honestly always used Streaks as a backup weapon, so actually semi-centering my crosshairs on the target is habit anyways.

As for the 5V, I do agree the Cap accel buff is a bit overpowered, but we're also talking about the 5V, one of the mechs with the lowest possible firepower in the game. thing is, if you have a problem with people capping, actually leave someone to guard your base. done. even if you have pugs, you still have voice comms for a reason. coordinate.

[C0y0tl45]

I'd like to see this ridiculous need for lrm style lock-on for streaks to go away tbh. From Sarna:

Quote

Originally developed in 2647 by the Star League, the Streak SRM Launcher is relatively similar to the standard SRM launcher but incorporates a unique Targa-7 fire control system. This system consists of a multi-lens sensor linked to a microwave targeting laser and battle computer built in to the launcher. When activated the system fires multiple light pulses at the target, and if the sensor detects a positive return signal from 90% or more of the pulses the battle computer authorizes missile launch; once airborne the missiles receive constant telemetry updates from the system to ensure they hit their target. In contrast if the system does not receive sufficient feedback before firing to guarantee a hit it will prevent the missiles from launching. This special feature of the system prevents the weapon from firing at a target when there is no lock-on, saving ammunition by preventing shots that would otherwise miss.

Unfortunately it seems that PGI can't duplicate here in MWO what was done in MW4 with it's streak launchers. Or maybe some players would whine that they would be too OP

Edited by C0y0tl45, 21 August 2018 - 07:30 PM.