17 replies to this topic

[razenWing]

Rather than a single bloated tournament with weird seeding format that nobody really cares about (honestly, I still don't understand this "losers" bracket and ffa preseason... it's total bogus)

Why don't we have like mini tournaments with specific rules guidelines? Solaris arena is not just one big end of the year tourney. It's circuits and seasons.

And this is where the part where pgi has to do some work... just program a tournament only arena where they can dictate conditions and mech loadouts. For example, people don't have the idea of restricted mechs. People hate the idea of always stock. So, maybe tournament A in April will be these mechs with restrictions on setup like in Battletech (no engine switch, only weapon modification)

Maybe tournament B can be like a light fest in October. Where you can't play anything BUT lights.

And for the love of god, just post your circuit schedule early, and just let people sign up for whatever they want to up to say.. 2 weeks before start of circuit tournament. No more of this "hey, go play as much as you want, and let EMP farm every single one of ya" Cause you know, that's always fun.

(single elim small tournaments that don't last more than a week, top)

4-5 tournaments yearly, tournament winner automatically gets a seat in the semi of the end of year tourney. Those are your one method of qualifying. And then you can still run your main qualifying tournament (with much better format than this of go figure it out amongst yourself, we will just some banner ads in october when nobody has one iota of interest left)

This way, people can sign up for tournaments that play to their strengths. It's not a burden to players that just wanna play. It keeps the interest up for the whole year. It's different and refreshing, rather than just 40 consecutive matches of canyon network where one side try to air strike and range the other team to oblivion.

Is that not more fun?

Edited by razenWing, 07 October 2018 - 06:37 PM.

[Vxheous]

How do you not understand a double elimination bracket?

[thievingmagpi]

Lol

[justcallme A S H]

That while first post is:



...

[Khobai]

id be okay with no tournaments at all too.

[razenWing]

Vxheous, on 07 October 2018 - 06:42 PM, said:

How do you not understand a double elimination bracket?

the only sporting event that uses double elimination is the little league world series. and it's done so, so that the kids won't feel bad. are we... little kids?

[Vxheous]

razenWing, on 08 October 2018 - 02:58 AM, said:

the only sporting event that uses double elimination is the little league world series. and it's done so, so that the kids won't feel bad. are we... little kids?

Lots of e-sports tourneys utilize a double elimination system. Most notably League of Legends, which has a Gauntlet style system to make Worlds for those teams that didn't win their respective Regional Finals.

Funny that you attack the idea from a "little kids don't feel bad" angle, did you even participate in any of the MWOWC?

[razenWing]

Vxheous, on 10 October 2018 - 08:03 AM, said:

Lots of e-sports tourneys utilize a double elimination system. Most notably League of Legends, which has a Gauntlet style system to make Worlds for those teams that didn't win their respective Regional Finals.

Funny that you attack the idea from a "little kids don't feel bad" angle, did you even participate in any of the MWOWC?

Yea, you guys farmed us. Which I don't even mind. I only take offense when we got like gajillion losses from you guys. Meanwhile, you guys strategically avoid other strong teams. (And you know hows that's painfully obvious? Cause those top teams all have like fewer than 3-4 losses.). Nobody participating in this format outside of the teams that's predetermined going to Toronto think the current format is fun.

And let's be real. League of legends and other real e"sports" are not sporting events.

[Vxheous]

razenWing, on 10 October 2018 - 10:46 AM, said:

Yea, you guys farmed us. Which I don't even mind. I only take offense when we got like gajillion losses from you guys. Meanwhile, you guys strategically avoid other strong teams. (And you know hows that's painfully obvious? Cause those top teams all have like fewer than 3-4 losses.). Nobody participating in this format outside of the teams that's predetermined going to Toronto think the current format is fun.

And let's be real. League of legends and other real e"sports" are not sporting events.

No, EmpyreaL sat in the queue, and the moment we beat another top team, they would log out. Same with if they happen to take a game off us, they would log out. We never avoided fighting anyone on days that we decided to do comp queue instead of practice. The moment it looked like we were active in queue, all other teams disappeared.

League of Legends are esporting events, they fill entire stadiums full of fans for tourneys. Their pro players are paid a salary, with a Pro team and a minor league team systems. They have actual owners, and franchises are actually worth money. Many of their pro teams are backed financially by pro sports teams.\

To be fair, I have more respect for you coming into comp queue to play us than many teams queue dodging.

Edit: as an aside, for 1 day, we were EmP Beer Leagues Matter (EmP BLM), but apparently that was too edgy for PGI, and they reverted our name to EmpyreaL.

Edited by Vxheous, 10 October 2018 - 11:17 AM.

[Prototelis]

Not going to lie, getting our faces smashed in by you guys wasn't fun. Still a good learning experience, and everyone was respectful. The only takeaway for us was that we managed to science out a mech roster very similar to your own, and that was reassurance that at the very least we had improved our knowledge of the game.

I'm not sure what the solution is, or even if there is one.

Next year (if there is one) I hope they expand the seeding process long enough that they can form divisions from accumulated SSR so that disparate match ups aren't as much of a thing. Division based semi-finals would have been dope.

I think the whole format could be more inclusive and still provide an exclusive competitive environment for high level teams. That way we all have a chance to grow and get better.

Edited by Prototelis, 10 October 2018 - 11:35 AM.

[Vxheous]

Prototelis, on 10 October 2018 - 11:34 AM, said:

Not going to lie, getting our faces smashed in by you guys wasn't fun. Still a good learning experience, and everyone was respectful. The only takeaway for us was that we managed to science out a mech roster very similar to your own, and that was reassurance that at the very least we had improved our knowledge of the game.

I'm not sure what the solution is, or even if there is one.

Next year (if there is one) I hope they expand the seeding process long enough that they can form divisions from accumulated SSR so that disparate match ups aren't as much of a thing. Division based semi-finals would have been dope.

I think the whole format could be more inclusive and still provide an exclusive competitive environment for high level teams. That way we all have a chance to grow and get better.

I think several times we offered our opponents advice on how to improve if they wanted it, without overtly giving away our strats. If the opponent agreed, we would let them know what they were doing wrong, and what they were doing right. I think Ash (EmP prospect) actually went and coached Nuttyrat's team and helped them out with better practice habits, and it's really paid off. Watching Nuttyrat's team play in May vs Sept was night and day.

[Prototelis]

Vxheous, on 10 October 2018 - 11:40 AM, said:

I think several times we offered our opponents advice on how to improve if they wanted it, without overtly giving away our strats. If the opponent agreed, we would let them know what they were doing wrong, and what they were doing right. I think Ash (EmP prospect) actually went and coached Nuttyrat's team and helped them out with better practice habits, and it's really paid off. Watching Nuttyrat's team play in May vs Sept was night and day.

You guys were cool as hell to us. No worries there.

I don't remember an offer for suggestions, but I don't doubt you guys would have given them if we had asked.

99% of the top level players I run into offer wisdom freely, and I wouldn't have progressed this far on my own without their help and suggestions.

I owe a lot of people a big debt of gratitude for taking the time to help me improve.

This is the first season I can say that I have progressed to a level where I can affect the outcome of the majority of the solo matches I've played.


It is absolutely thrilling playing against high level players. The one and only time I've beat you specifically in a one on one encounter in GQ was probably the most fun I've ever had in the game.

I don't know if you remember because it was so long ago, but we played against each other in GQ on Solaris City. I was in the PIR, and you were in a centurion approaching one of our flanks. I was able to spot you, get behind you, and open you up well enough that when you turned to deal with me (Very vivid memory for me, you looked straight down at me because I was literally on your *** and I swear your mech looked ******* ANGRY) that the another player I set up at the end of the alley was able to finish you off.

That guy was a 40% at the time, and he was ******* THRILLED. It was cheap move, but it worked, and not one person on your team said anything negative about it or during the entire match.

But then again, I'm apparently weird, because I go well out of my way to fight top level peeps when I see them.

This community is filled to the brim with people who think highly competitive players only have their own interests in mind, and that it is patently false.

Edited by Prototelis, 10 October 2018 - 12:22 PM.

[Vxheous]

Prototelis, on 10 October 2018 - 12:20 PM, said:

It is absolutely thrilling playing against high level players. The one and only time I've beat you specifically in a one on one encounter in GQ was probably the most fun I've ever had in the game.

I don't know if you remember because it was so long ago, but we played against each other in GQ on Solaris City. I was in the PIR, and you were in a centurion approaching one of our flanks. I was able to spot you, get behind you, and open you up well enough that when you turned to deal with me (Very vivid memory for me, you looked straight down at me because I was literally on your *** and I swear your mech looked ******* ANGRY) that the another player I set up at the end of the alley was able to finish you off.

That guy was a 40% at the time, and he was ******* THRILLED. It was cheap move, but it worked, and not one person on your team said anything negative about it or during the entire match.

But then again, I'm apparently weird, because I go well out of my way to fight top level peeps when I see them.

This community is filled to the brim with people who think highly competitive players only have their own interests in mind, and that it is patently false.

I'm glad you enjoyed that, and to think people say top players on play meta, lol. That said, I got rekted in that YLW.

[justcallme A S H]

Prototelis, on 10 October 2018 - 11:34 AM, said:

Next year (if there is one) I hope they expand the seeding process long enough that they can form divisions from accumulated SSR so that disparate match ups aren't as much of a thing. Division based semi-finals would have been dope.

After 3 years of this format I highly doubt it would change for year 4.

The reason quite simply comes down to one thing... Cost.

If you have 3-4 divisions of finalists with 3 teams competing. PGI suddenly go from flying 3 teams to Mechcon to flying up to 12.

razenWing, on 10 October 2018 - 10:46 AM, said:

Yea, you guys farmed us. Which I don't even mind. I only take offense when we got like gajillion losses from you guys. Meanwhile, you guys strategically avoid other strong teams. (And you know hows that's painfully obvious? Cause those top teams all have like fewer than 3-4 losses.)

Absolute rubbish. You are showing ignorance by saying such things.

I regularly left work for 2.5hrs on a Friday (the busiest day of my week) for this tournament only to go back to work afterwards with basically nothing achieved in terms of the queue/matches.

We (EmP) sat in queue for 60mins at a time regularly without any opponents. We would get one match (win) and then opponents would simply never queue again. All we could do was talk about Fosters Beer, Kangaroo's and how nice the weather was.

If memory servers correct EmP played 228BW 2-4 times out of ~50 matches. The rest were filled with 228SF, 228DFA, -D4- and a few other teams who were high in the pecking order for NA with a smattering of the lower teams in there.

Where your ignorance hits n obvious high is the "top teams never played each other". Do you realise it is spread across 3 time zones? EU teams will basically never see NA teams? The Oceanic team (228WO) played on NA Sat night which is Sunday Lunch in Oceanic - Most of the top NA teams did not play NA Sat evening because that is just how they are. EmP got online once but 228WO, just our luck, were not online that weekend so we didn't bother again.

razenWing, on 10 October 2018 - 10:46 AM, said:

And let's be real. League of legends and other real e"sports" are not sporting events.

That is taking your ignorance to an all time high right there.

[justcallme A S H]

Vxheous, on 10 October 2018 - 11:40 AM, said:

I think several times we offered our opponents advice on how to improve if they wanted it, without overtly giving away our strats. If the opponent agreed, we would let them know what they were doing wrong, and what they were doing right. I think Ash (EmP prospect) actually went and coached Nuttyrat's team and helped them out with better practice habits, and it's really paid off. Watching Nuttyrat's team play in May vs Sept was night and day.

Correct. I have been giving Nutty's (CCdn) team help here/there with the blessing of EmP while I'm in prospect mode with the team.

I attended one of their training sessions to give them pointers/drills to use and then bits and pieces along the way with mechs, ideas that suit their game play style and other things like skill tree suggestions and... Making sure Nutty got his damn weapon groups right

Totally agree in their performance improvement was amazing. That was not just due to my help though, I know others helped and they actually wanted to improve as a team so they regularly practiced. Which is what you have to do if you want to get better.

Prototelis, on 10 October 2018 - 12:20 PM, said:

This community is filled to the brim with people who think highly competitive players only have their own interests in mind, and that it is patently false.

Yep... It is often the lower level of players who claim this.

I see it as simply them projecting/deflecting as a reason why they can't/don't/won't or whatever in terms of looking to improve their own gameplay. Also at the very same time complaining about those who have spent the time/effort to become better and how unfair it all is.

It just makes no sense to me when there is so much help people freely give in this community.

Hell I've done training with I think 4 or 5 units now in various capacities.

[dante245]

yes

[TLBFestus]

Don't they already have the MWO WORLD Championships? In comparison to all other eSports it's definitely "mini".

[Prototelis]

justcallme A S H, on 10 October 2018 - 06:00 PM, said:

After 3 years of this format I highly doubt it would change for year 4.

The reason quite simply comes down to one thing... Cost.

If you have 3-4 divisions of finalists with 3 teams competing. PGI suddenly go from flying 3 teams to Mechcon to flying up to 12.

I was thinking more along the lines of the lower divs not having a go at worlds once the semis are locked, like just have their own finals in the tournament client during the lead up to mechcon for some better in game rewards. But I totally see where you're coming from.