34 replies to this topic

[SmokedJag]

There is nothing more BS rage inducing, hand breaking in the entire game and it's why this mode is dying. This !&#! is even showing up in D7 now and on trolls with smurfed records at that. There's no real counter, just playing it yourself despite it being inane or working way too hard to maybe beat the person playing turret. Why bother? Hint: People aren't.

And I'm joining them because this isn't worth it. Hell, PGI managed to make it way WORSE in Division 2 by getting rid of the best alternate playstyles.

Since PGI is apparently too lazy to break up pinpoint convergence from multiple ballistic weapons (this weapon isn't remotely supposed to work the way it does in MWO), they can at least ban those loadouts from this mode like they did with other troll/OP builds. That's within their technical grasp. Ban the damn weapon entirely for that matter.

I'm done. This isn't worth it.

Edited by SmokedJag, 28 July 2018 - 08:29 AM.

[UnkerZ]

I managed to beat the **** out of AC2 annis before with a DWF - but yea it requires a hell lot more precision on my side than the anni.

For D2, there is a sliver of hope with SRM6x6 cyclops with some side arms - i managed to core out a kgc spreading damage before I melted.

Then there was this potato of KGC with 4ac2 and 2ac10. I swear to god that was surely an XL engine, but i would lose half my torso before even getting past one half his armor.

But this AC2 thing... is so annoying I retaliate with the same annoying cheese (i.e. hiding round a corner shutdown, then sticking up your arse kinda thing) to have at least some odds. But I dunno... I guess Anni can't hide round any corner - so fair? Mmm

[Red-Mattila]

I love people who try and sell me on the counters to the ac 2 turrets. They may work but only on morons, the top tier people don't let you get close enough to hurt them.

[Marius Evander]

I love how people get a few bad games where they lose and come running to the forums crying something is unbeatable rather than investigate and learn for themselves hoping someone will solve it for them.

Until 2 weeks before the end of season 1 I had 3 accounts top 10 of division 1 with a brawler, not ac2's.

Beaten the King Crab 6 ac2's plenty of time, yes i agree it should be division 1 since all the other assaults like it got moved to div 1.

the 6 ac2 Jager div 4 I lose when I am piloting often to people who can shoot its arms off, I have yet to meet anyone piloting it when I am piloting its counter, (which gets countered by a lot of other stuff so #rockpaperscissorbalance).

The ac2 mechs in div 6 and 7 ....... please dont make me laugh.

So ac2's is dominating / needs moving in 1, maybe 2 divisions, thats not 7 divisions.

Edited by Cadoazreal, 29 July 2018 - 12:05 AM.

[SmokedJag]

KassimBaba, on 28 July 2018 - 10:34 AM, said:

I managed to beat the **** out of AC2 annis before with a DWF - but yea it requires a hell lot more precision on my side than the anni.

For D2, there is a sliver of hope with SRM6x6 cyclops with some side arms - i managed to core out a kgc spreading damage before I melted.

Then there was this potato of KGC with 4ac2 and 2ac10. I swear to god that was surely an XL engine, but i would lose half my torso before even getting past one half his armor.

But this AC2 thing... is so annoying I retaliate with the same annoying cheese (i.e. hiding round a corner shutdown, then sticking up your arse kinda thing) to have at least some odds. But I dunno... I guess Anni can't hide round any corner - so fair? Mmm

It's that asymmetry that I can't stand. There is no downside whatsoever to taking this build. If the opponent gets caught out in the open or winds up on an open map, the small AC boat wins. If the opponent is using more intuitive/less exploitative ACs, the small AC boat wins or is at least a strong favorite. If the opponent uses tricks and terrain and a full shield arm to close with a brawl loadout it is still around 50/50 because of raw pinpoint DPS and blinding. If the opponent is a striker light, back into a corner and again, 50/50 with the light having to work way harder with no room for error (not to mention being hard countered by most other things...).

The only time the small AC boat is likely to *lose* is if it gets jumped by a heavily armed brawler. But anything including a mirror of the brawler is likely to lose if jumped like that.

This is flagrantly broken power for a playstyle involving one button for one weapon system and I'm just sick of dealing with it. That it *can* be beaten when it's not an Annihilator isn't the point.

Edited by SmokedJag, 29 July 2018 - 03:28 AM.

[Mister Maf]

I'm guilty of this because I got sick of losing to it in D1 and D2. Bought a KGC-000 at the start of the season with my season 1 winnings and it's been zero effort maintaining a spot in the top 100 because the thing is just so much more blatantly powerful than everything that isn't itself. I've more or less abandoned divisions 3-5 because it's even more of the same with the KGC-000B, JM6-DD, and RFL-3C and one can only own so many AC2 boats. Really the only fun division for me is D6 because it's a fast-paced brawl of medium mechs that don't have the tonnage to mount a meaningful number of AC2s.

Edit: I say this, but right after I finished this post I got matched against a 3xAC2 Hunchback in D6 which probably would have beaten me if I were in anything else but my tanky Vindicator with maxed survival skills.

Anyway, complaining about the problem is all well and good, but what do y'all actually propose doing about it? Move every mech that can mount more than three autocannons to division 1? One would hope there's a more elegant solution than that.

Edited by Mister Maf, 29 July 2018 - 05:15 AM.

[Makenzie71]

I don’t think there’s anything wrong with the ac2’s. I run a 6x king crab and an 8x dwf...I get a lot of kills (and a lot of whiners) and I get killed a lot. Seems like there’s a lot of alternative weapons and there’s a lot of strategies that get around them. The people who whine the most are the ones who sat still 900m away and let me hammer them until they died...then ***** and ***** about macros and AC2 spam.

[Kurbeks]

Point isn't that AC2 spam can't be beaten point is that most of mechs in div1-5 boats them. Thus making gameplay very similar and boring. Same as with scouting in it's early days where 90% of clan players did run SSRM crows. Thus you will same same 5 mechs in first 5 divs. Although i would say now that queue again has died out, plp are running counters of those mechs. More apparent in div4-5.

Also beating some nub running meta mech, doesn't mean that AC2 mechs can be easily beaten. Means you are just better pilot than AC2 spammer.

[Makenzie71]

I think you’re one of those people who are under the impression that the game is suppose to be self-balancing...that, if outfitted correctly, a spider should be able to go toe to toe with an atlas and hold its own. It’s not suppose to be that way and it never was. The game is balanced by players...or, rather, isn’t at all at times. If you’re seeing a lot of AC2 spam it’s because it’s a platform that works. A bunch of assaults boating ballistics makes game play similar and boring? What do you think will change if you instead have a bunch of assaults boating lasers? Or missiles? If AC boats bore you, you have very little hope of enjoying the game because, so long as AC boats are effective brawlers, that’s what you’re going to face.

Since you’re aware of how they can be beaten and how to counter the ac boats I don’t see what’s to complain about. Your fights should be all excitement as you’re ducking under their cannon spam and hamstringing them.

And fwiw I only see a lot of ac2 spam in div 1...and it’s mostly mine since I can carry 8 of them.

[UnkerZ]

Well.. managed to blow up a few AC2 annis today - on the key condition I could play hide and seek and spam ultra acs + hide before the anni manages to pull my pants off.

Then again.. hell lot of cheese required. It would be a nightmare to meet an anni doing that to me - and wed both have similar agility profiles being 100 ton I guess. That torso armor and critical immunity is obnoxious. But ac2x8 DWF should be able to put up a fight against a heavily armored anni 6ac2. but im a sad hobo who can't afford a UV to even begin testing that out.

[Makenzie71]

8 ac2’s is actually disappointingly ineffective against an ANH that’s got all it’s ct armor shifted forward. I can sit on top of the gate on Borean Reach and plug away at an ANH and it can just tank the damage until I’m in it’s range...and then it’s over. Plus I swear clan AC’s only do splatter damage. I do measurably less damage with my 6x ac2 king crab than I do with my 8x ultraviolet, yet the king crab gets more kills.

I’ve also tried some energy builds and had worse luck with the UV. It can’t handle the burn time. Various SRM builds, too, also with poor luck. Currently I’m having pretty good luck with 4x AC10’s and 4x heavy machine guns...but still hit or miss with the ANH.

Fought someone last night in an ultraviolet that had a ridiculous win loss ratio (mid 30’s) running ac10’s And ac5’s...I just can’t wrap my head around that combo holding up against annihilators.

[Brauer]

Makenzie71, on 31 July 2018 - 07:21 AM, said:

8 ac2’s is actually disappointingly ineffective against an ANH that’s got all it’s ct armor shifted forward. I can sit on top of the gate on Borean Reach and plug away at an ANH and it can just tank the damage until I’m in it’s range...and then it’s over. Plus I swear clan AC’s only do splatter damage. I do measurably less damage with my 6x ac2 king crab than I do with my 8x ultraviolet, yet the king crab gets more kills.

I’ve also tried some energy builds and had worse luck with the UV. It can’t handle the burn time. Various SRM builds, too, also with poor luck. Currently I’m having pretty good luck with 4x AC10’s and 4x heavy machine guns...but still hit or miss with the ANH.

Fought someone last night in an ultraviolet that had a ridiculous win loss ratio (mid 30’s) running ac10’s And ac5’s...I just can’t wrap my head around that combo holding up against annihilators.

I would guess (not having run the DWF-UV) that you do less concentrated damage because of hardpoint location. The KGC has 3 AC2s in each claw, so they all track the arm reticle and despite the convergence you should have two tight groups of three shells each time you fire. For the Dire I think you have torso and arm mounted weapons spread out a bit more, so unless you arm lock (which can be a good idea to concentrate damage at times) you might be spreading shots between arm and torso reticles. On top of that having more and more spread hardpoints you might have more clusters of hits naturally. An experienced UV pilot could probably give better insight though.

[SpeedyRR]

My solution to this problem is to fight the Meta, not partake in it. So I've worked on mechs and builds that aren't the typical ac boat turret mechs. It's made it a more challenging mode because I've had to learn the maps, work out how to close with brawl, or flank with pop-tarts, keep distance with kites or hit and run mechs.
The amount of salt that flew my way when I started using hit and run mrm tactics was entertaining as well. Kept getting accused of aimboting/cheating when I shot legs off Ani's and Kcrabs with mrms, which is just amusing. Yeah I just spent 8-10mins moving all over the map shooting from different angles, and over 1200 rounds to do about 250-300 damage to get your legs off, must be an aimbot lol
And considering I'm currently in the top 30 solo overall means I've had a reasonable amount of success doing just this, not running meta mechs and builds.

[Scout Derek]

SpeedyRR, on 31 July 2018 - 10:26 PM, said:

My solution to this problem is to fight the Meta, not partake in it. So I've worked on mechs and builds that aren't the typical ac boat turret mechs. It's made it a more challenging mode because I've had to learn the maps, work out how to close with brawl, or flank with pop-tarts, keep distance with kites or hit and run mechs.
The amount of salt that flew my way when I started using hit and run mrm tactics was entertaining as well. Kept getting accused of aimboting/cheating when I shot legs off Ani's and Kcrabs with mrms, which is just amusing. Yeah I just spent 8-10mins moving all over the map shooting from different angles, and over 1200 rounds to do about 250-300 damage to get your legs off, must be an aimbot lol
And considering I'm currently in the top 30 solo overall means I've had a reasonable amount of success doing just this, not running meta mechs and builds.

takes some effort and dedication, that's all.

[Dee Eight]

Red-Mattila, on 28 July 2018 - 07:35 PM, said:

I love people who try and sell me on the counters to the ac 2 turrets. They may work but only on morons, the top tier people don't let you get close enough to hurt them.

Except...they always get impatient, and will come looking for you. Tuck into an ambush point, and wait for them. Or pop in and out and get them to waste ammo at a distance. The problem with 5 & 6 AC2 Jagers for example, is a lack of ammo. What's more...to do the 6 AC2 on one, they need to run an XL engine, so just aim for one shoulder and wait for the XL death.

[Dionnsai]

I kill AC/2 Mechs all day long, no it's not easy, but it pushes my limits and is definitely improving my skill as a pilot. Use weapons combinations that hit hard from a similar range and don't require you to facetank and you'll be fine. I can tell you that my PPC poptarting game is definitely getting sharper due to the time I have to spend running, jumping and taking shots on the move.

If you don't know what to bring, dig through the leaderboards until you find something you like and just keep at it til you get strong.

[Monkey Lover]

I have killed ac2 spam with brawl and even super alpha laser vomit.

Ac2 spammers dont want to close so use that. Pop up spam 60+ alpha to thier ct and cool down. They will never push. Only down side is when you get a brawler you might as well give up haha.

[TAPAH 483-K]

Solaris 7 is piace of ****
div 1-5 only ac 2 spam

just never go to play it again
i want play assault vs assaul; heavy vs heavy and etc
now it is op meta vs op meta or meta vs troll sometimes op meta vs new player (massacre)

Edited by TAPAH 483-K, 12 August 2018 - 02:49 PM.

[Ghost Paladin117]

If you want to try something different in div 1 to counter the ac2 spam I suggest bringing Arctic wolf 1 with srms. Does very well on particular maps. Still at a disadvantage, but you can win more often than in other mechs.

[Makenzie71]

The thing with the SRM arctic wolf is that you can get a win, but you’re only going to get one. The number of people playing right now is such that if I get an SRM arctic wolf in a match with the DWF, I’m pretty sure to get the same SRM arctic wolf when I drop my 3x streak6 arctic wolf in the next match.

As a AC2 boat, other AC2 boats don’t really affect me. Honestly, the weapons builds that give me the most grief are dual heavy gauss builds and whatever Dionnsai is driving at the time.