27 replies to this topic

[Ted Wayz]

The Kintaro 18 has always been my go to when I need to snap out of a funk. Until I bought an ACW-1.

Faster.

More firepower.

More maneuverable.

Equal durability.

Clan missiles.

Anyone who says IS equals clan must be looking at one or two mechs and not the whole picture.

RIP Kintaro.

[FupDup]

Equal durabaility? I don't see Kints very often but on-paper they should be way more durable than the instantly crippled Arctic Wolves I see every other match on the enemy team.

Also Clans don't get MRMs, they depend too heavily on autoaim missiles (SRMs are the only aimable missiles Clans get and their effective range is super short because of spread).

All of that being said if I'm gonna use a missile medium I'm gonna use the Wolverine 7D. One of the worst mechs in the game before the Civil War, but after Civil War it became a Super Saiyan MRM bomber. MRM50 Wolvie is bae.

Edited by FupDup, 28 October 2018 - 09:51 AM.

[ShiverMeRivets]

FupDup, on 28 October 2018 - 09:46 AM, said:

Equal durabaility? I don't see Kints very often but on-paper they should be way more durable than the instantly crippled Arctic Wolves I see every other match on the enemy team.

Also Clans don't get MRMs, they depend too heavily on autoaim missiles (SRMs are the only aimable missiles Clans get and their effective range is super short because of spread).

All of that being said if I'm gonna use a missile medium I'm gonna use the Wolverine 7D. One of the worst mechs in the game before the Civil War, but after Civil War it became a Super Saiyan MRM bomber. MRM50 Wolvie is bae.

When you get 9 hard points for SRMs and they weight less than cork - all the above does not matter.

[Alcom Isst]

Ted Wayz, on 28 October 2018 - 09:45 AM, said:

Equal durability.

So CT/LT/LL/LA, ignoring skills since both are medium mechs and get the same percentages anyways.

ACW-1 has 48/40/40/24 armor and 29/20/20/12 structure.

KTO-18 has 87/65/59/46 armor and 36/26/26/18 structure, and then a 10% 20% bay door damage reduction in the CT on top of that.

Arctic Wolf is still leagues better than the Kintaro due to its speed, mobility, clan, and hardpoints, but among all the benifits it's certainly not equally durable.

Edited by Alcom Isst, 28 October 2018 - 11:02 AM.

[Battlemaster56]

ShiverMeRivets, on 28 October 2018 - 09:56 AM, said:

When you get 9 hard points for SRMs and they weight less than cork - all the above does not matter.

Unless you running 9x csrm2, most of the time you not bothering to use all nine and just do 5x csrm4 w Artemis and use the arms as shields.

And above does matter because it strictly limits the amount of builds the ACW-1 can reasonable do.

[Spheroid]

@Alcom: The damage reduction was upped several patches ago. Its now 20%.

Edited by Spheroid, 28 October 2018 - 10:13 AM.

[B L O O D W I T C H]

Remember the thing called faction play? where you only can have one or the other?

[lazorbeamz]

Battlemaster56, on 28 October 2018 - 10:12 AM, said:

Unless you running 9x csrm2, most of the time you not bothering to use all nine and just do 5x csrm4 w Artemis and use the arms as shields.

And above does matter because it strictly limits the amount of builds the ACW-1 can reasonable do.

You can 5 artemis srm6.

[K O Z A K]

Looks at only one or two mechs, follows up with:

Ted Wayz, on 28 October 2018 - 09:45 AM, said:

Anyone who says IS equals clan must be looking at one or two mechs and not the whole picture.

like, really?

Kintaro is not a very good mech, one of many not very good mechs in this game

[Battlemaster56]

lazorbeamz, on 28 October 2018 - 11:04 AM, said:

You can 5 artemis srm6.

I tried it but didn't work out for me had no cooling because no heatsinks unless I downgrade from a xl300, and it cooldown, and spread really put it off.

[LordNothing]

i havent used kintaro since lrm5 spam became ineffective. it was really the only way to have fun with lerms and its gone and never coming back. it will live out its days as another sub par mrm boat.

[Ted Wayz]

Hazeclaw, on 28 October 2018 - 11:11 AM, said:

Looks at only one or two mechs, follows up with:



like, really?

Kintaro is not a very good mech, one of many not very good mechs in this game

I own 363 mechs, so not looking at just two mechs.

If you do not know how to Kintaro then yes it can be a bad mech. L2K.

LordNothing, on 28 October 2018 - 03:00 PM, said:

i havent used kintaro since lrm5 spam became ineffective. it was really the only way to have fun with lerms and its gone and never coming back. it will live out its days as another sub par mrm boat.

With the clan systems the LRM5 spam becomes LRM10 spam on the Artic Wolf. Not completely nullified by AMS.

[Ted Wayz]

Alcom Isst, on 28 October 2018 - 10:02 AM, said:

So CT/LT/LL/LA, ignoring skills since both are medium mechs and get the same percentages anyways.

ACW-1 has 48/40/40/24 armor and 29/20/20/12 structure.

KTO-18 has 87/65/59/46 armor and 36/26/26/18 structure, and then a 10% 20% bay door damage reduction in the CT on top of that.

Arctic Wolf is still leagues better than the Kintaro due to its speed, mobility, clan, and hardpoints, but among all the benifits it's certainly not equally durable.

On paper. Have both been piloted?

Hitboxes lie. Especially at 110 kmph vs 87 kmph. My perception is based on use, not paper although saying equal durability is maybe a little off as getting hit less with the Artic Wolf due to the speed and maneuverability. Might have to hit the training grounds.

[K O Z A K]

Ted Wayz, on 28 October 2018 - 03:02 PM, said:

I own 363 mechs, so not looking at just two mechs.

If you do not know how to Kintaro then yes it can be a bad mech. L2K.


With the clan systems the LRM5 spam becomes LRM10 spam on the Artic Wolf. Not completely nullified by AMS.

you did in you comparing it to the ACW

lol, it is a bad mech, every single thing a kintaro does another mech can do better

if you want a medium IS missile boat depending on your exact requirements assassin, bushie or treb 7m are all way better

[lazorbeamz]

Most 50-55 ton mechs are like that. Already too slow and still not too beefy.

[Tiewolf]

Hazeclaw, on 28 October 2018 - 03:17 PM, said:

you did in you comparing it to the ACW

lol, it is a bad mech, every single thing a kintaro does another mech can do better

if you want a medium IS missile boat depending on your exact requirements assassin, bushie or treb 7m are all way better

A SRM bushie with its hitboxes or a MRM trenchbucket are completely different to play then a ACW or Kintaro. Due to the hitbox glitch the assassin is close but it is more a harasser because it lacks the on spot damage output of the ACW or Kintaro.

The comparison between ACW and Kintaro is not that bad because most of the times you have to play them as fast heavy hitting flanker to be effective. There is simply no IS match for the ACW-1 with 7-8 SRM6 because it got the speed combined with the survivabilty to get close and the damage to pull off assault solo kills in seconds if they get flanked or separated. All IS mechs have to sacifice one variable of the firepower, speed and survivabilty trinity to get the other 2. ACW can have all 3 thanks to clan tech. The higher clan missle spread that should be the downside for the lighter clan tech does not matter much at the ranges you fight with a ACW-1 and with the speed it can cool down in cover after a strike.
So yes i have to agree that the ACW is outright better as heavy hitting flanker then the Kintaro or any IS mech at the moment.

[K O Z A K]

Tiewolf, on 29 October 2018 - 12:09 AM, said:

A SRM bushie with its hitboxes or a MRM trenchbucket are completely different to play then a ACW or Kintaro. Due to the hitbox glitch the assassin is close but it is more a harasser because it lacks the on spot damage output of the ACW or Kintaro.

The comparison between ACW and Kintaro is not that bad because most of the times you have to play them as fast heavy hitting flanker to be effective. There is simply no IS match for the ACW-1 with 7-8 SRM6 because it got the speed combined with the survivabilty to get close and the damage to pull off assault solo kills in seconds if they get flanked or separated. All IS mechs have to sacifice one variable of the firepower, speed and survivabilty trinity to get the other 2. ACW can have all 3 thanks to clan tech. The higher clan missle spread that should be the downside for the lighter clan tech does not matter much at the ranges you fight with a ACW-1 and with the speed it can cool down in cover after a strike.
So yes i have to agree that the ACW is outright better as heavy hitting flanker then the Kintaro or any IS mech at the moment.

srm6s are bad right now, both clan and IS

my point was that kintaro is a bad mech, how is srm bushie different to play than a kintaro, it's exactly the same only better

go open the mech lab, look at the armour values for the ACW, now look at them for the bushie/kintaro, now come back and tell me ACW doesn't sacrifice survivability in comparison to those 2

assassin is definitely closer in playstyle to the acw, it has less firepower, but will generally be running faster, is more difficult to hit, and has JJs. The 7-8 SRM6 ACW is a meme mech, if you don't understand why it's not good I can't help you

[Siegegun]

Hazeclaw, on 28 October 2018 - 03:17 PM, said:

you did in you comparing it to the ACW

lol, it is a bad mech, every single thing a kintaro does another mech can do better

if you want a medium IS missile boat depending on your exact requirements assassin, bushie or treb 7m are all way better

This is not actually true, well it sort of is now but only because after the skill tree AMS became a lot more common. The Kintaro is the best LRM small launcher there is on the IS side. The Golden Boy setup as a 5x5 launcher is was the best medium LRM boat. Its quirks are amazing for doing so. But now that AMS is far, far more common, it has become ineffective in such a role. Literally ineffective in half the battles as combined AMS just eats all the missiles it can fire. RIP Kintaro. Incidentally this is also the cause of the rise of the assault LRM boat. Of course people were taking assaults as LRM boats before, but not like they tend to do now, anyone that was playing the smaller boats have upgraded to more tubes and tonnage to remain effective.

[Snowbluff]

I like the Arctic Wolf as a little speedy missile guy. I either run 5x SRM2 or 4xSRM2 + 1 NARC, which back up 4xSRM4.
However, it is super noodly. My arms fall off all of the time, so I go "better than losing the mech I guess" and keep spamming missiles.

Sorry, I'm not on my home PC so I don't have a game to show.

[Koniving]

Alcom Isst, on 28 October 2018 - 10:02 AM, said:

KTO-18 has 87/65/59/46 armor and 36/26/26/18 structure, and then a 10% 20% bay door damage reduction in the CT on top of that.

Good catch; all doors give 20% reduction.

Its unknown if the double door gives double reduction, though.