66 replies to this topic

[Tarl Cabot]

Bishop Six, on 17 December 2018 - 01:00 AM, said:

Both sides are used to fight each other in lore, so i think its a really good idea from OP to create this emergency queue to do civil war after long waiting times or one sided population.

Im in, want to feel IS-Opness by myself...

What would the criteria for Civil war / inter-IS fights or Clan vs Clan? How long would the wait before it opens up? Or would it be premade vs premade w/fillers? And what if the fillers are all of the same faction?

Would a few Kurita+ Davion+Marik vs a few Kurita+Marik+Steiner? PGI would not set it up to break up a premade/co-op made up of mixed factions.

It sounds good but how what would that flowchart look like?

[Jun Watarase]

Pretty much every faction vs faction game does not allow you to switch sides at will for a reason. People will join the winning side most of the time.

Thats another problem with two factions only. Even if you cant switch sides at will, people on the losing side get frustrated and re-roll as the winning side or just quit.

I used to play warhammer online. Before the Australian server shut down, the evil faction outnumbered the good faction by 4:1 or more in realm vs realm pvp. Players generally liked their character design better and they had more OP classes on average. People obviously did not want to join the losing faction, because who wants to lose right?

With 3 factions, 2 factions can keep the winning faction in check better.

[LordNothing]

Tarl Cabot, on 17 December 2018 - 06:28 AM, said:

What would the criteria for Civil war / inter-IS fights or Clan vs Clan? How long would the wait before it opens up? Or would it be premade vs premade w/fillers? And what if the fillers are all of the same faction?

Would a few Kurita+ Davion+Marik vs a few Kurita+Marik+Steiner? PGI would not set it up to break up a premade/co-op made up of mixed factions.

It sounds good but how what would that flowchart look like?

it would be based on where the players are. civil wars would kick in when the disparity is around 2:1. civil wars then drop until the disparity returns to normal. ideally it would work in concert with the proposed match maker. larger groups would get first priority, the only difference is that it checks both sides for a team when its over the disparity threshold.

[Geewiz 27]

I doubt people would switch to the side that's winning and most populated because that just means your not going to get a drop. I and my friends all do the opposite and switch to the least populated side to get a drop and if we come up against BCMC EVIL EMP 3 -4 times in a row at that point you've had enough and group breaks up. I honestly think you just need to give it some more time for peopleto get used to the new queue counter and that will mostly solve the problem.

Edited by Geewiz 27, 17 December 2018 - 01:29 PM.

[Grus]

Geewiz 27, on 17 December 2018 - 01:27 PM, said:

I doubt people would switch to the side that's winning and most populated because that just means your not going to get a drop. I and my friends all do the opposite and switch to the least populated side to get a drop and if we come up against BCMC EVIL EMP 3 -4 times in a row at that point you've had enough and group breaks up. I honestly think you just need to give it some more time for peopleto get used to the new queue counter and that will mostly solve the problem.

Yeah, missing the fact that loyalists just get shafted.

[Grus]

All we can really do in that scenario is just try to do better the next match and the next match.

[justcallme A S H]

Grus, on 17 December 2018 - 02:25 PM, said:

Yeah, missing the fact that loyalists just get shafted.

Anbd the queue counter STILL does not actually work...

[Nightbird]

Queue counter is working now I think. It has't rocketed up to 300 today at least.

[Bowelhacker]

Jun Watarase, on 17 December 2018 - 11:34 AM, said:

Pretty much every faction vs faction game does not allow you to switch sides at will for a reason. People will join the winning side most of the time.

Thats another problem with two factions only. Even if you cant switch sides at will, people on the losing side get frustrated and re-roll as the winning side or just quit.

I used to play warhammer online. Before the Australian server shut down, the evil faction outnumbered the good faction by 4:1 or more in realm vs realm pvp. Players generally liked their character design better and they had more OP classes on average. People obviously did not want to join the losing faction, because who wants to lose right?

With 3 factions, 2 factions can keep the winning faction in check better.

Right, Comstar/WoB time.

[Major Major Catch 22]

Daurock, on 14 December 2018 - 07:43 AM, said:

This type of behavior does lead to an honest question though.

Assuming a top team has no one around that actually desires to fight them - Is it better to give the top team a ghost drop, or is it better that they get put in a match with those that have no desire to see that top team? Which is better for the long term health of the mode?

I'm honestly not sure which it is at this point. The mode needs new players desperately, (AND needs them to stay around for more than 1 or two lopsided matches) but without those top teams to form the backbone, the whole thing flops over anyway.

Actually I and others have made two groups to get games, Theyve always been fun because we re shooting friends ! and were all about the same strength.

So make friends, form a g roup and wait for them to be in lobby only takes 10 mins

[Bishop Six]

Major Major Catch 22, on 19 December 2018 - 12:05 AM, said:

Actually I and others have made two groups to get games, Theyve always been fun because we re shooting friends ! and were all about the same strength.

So make friends, form a g roup and wait for them to be in lobby only takes 10 mins

Always enjoy to play with you guys

[Gabrielpendragon]

One big fix is let mercs play both sides. The clanners hired merc units to help with the war, the IS used mercs heavily in the war. Often a single merc unit was killing IS on day and clanners the next.
The next fix that needs to be made is if one side is ready to go, and there are no defenders, they should just win. This happened all the time in the war. An invasion force landed on a planet, and were able to take it with only local resistances. No one should have to sit around for an hour waiting for the other side to get their acts together. While this doesn't stop the dogpile scenario you are talking about, its a reality to war.

[justcallme A S H]

Gabrielpendragon, on 27 December 2018 - 11:45 AM, said:

One big fix is let mercs play both sides. The clanners hired merc units to help with the war, the IS used mercs heavily in the war.

Honestly... Have you even played Faction Play?

Mercs can and have been able to play both sides since the outset. Letting them switch sides instantly is half the issue.

[ccrider]

Honestly, as a guy who switches sometimes every other match, I really wish FP had 4 month seasons. Clear everyone's loyalty, make faction population 0 to start. Then show a counter as people sign up. Loyalist contracts last the entire 4 months, mercenary contracts are also 4 months but you can switch between houses or clans depending on which side you chose to be a mercenary for. To be clear, for 4 months you are either IS merc or clan merc, no switching Tech bases in that season. Then allow for faction points to be earned by mercenaries in the house/clan they are currently aligned to at a 50% rate of their mercenary earnings. Loyalists get a 50% boost to the house/clan they are with. It might keep people from dogpiling if they know the actual population, the season isn't so long that you get stuck missing out on the opposite tech base and the boosts to loyalty points and the resulting faster rewards might encourage more people to dive into FP for the MC, mechbays etc.

[ccrider]

Oh, and ditch probation matches. They serve no purpose.

[Gabrielpendragon]

Don't even let mercs pick a side, they just que up and get filled into the empty slots.

[Grus]

Gabrielpendragon, on 27 December 2018 - 09:09 PM, said:

Don't even let mercs pick a side, they just que up and get filled into the empty slots.

that would be interesting, add to that being able to affiliate with a lore merc unit.

[LordNothing]

using mercs to offset disparities might help the dogpile situation. i dont really see it as a way to solve all the problems. though it might solve enough of them where it doesnt matter. mercs no longer fly the banner of the house they are contracted to, but their own merc logo. even go so far as allowing mercs mixed decks (no mixed tech builds but you can have clan and is mechs in your deck and possibly a unique tonnage allotment).

[HammerMaster]

Gabrielpendragon, on 27 December 2018 - 11:45 AM, said:

One big fix is let mercs play both sides. The clanners hired merc units to help with the war, the IS used mercs heavily in the war. Often a single merc unit was killing IS on day and clanners the next.
The next fix that needs to be made is if one side is ready to go, and there are no defenders, they should just win. This happened all the time in the war. An invasion force landed on a planet, and were able to take it with only local resistances. No one should have to sit around for an hour waiting for the other side to get their acts together. While this doesn't stop the dogpile scenario you are talking about, its a reality to war.

Cite examples in Lore or Fluff where a Clan hired a merc unit.

[Tarl Cabot]

HammerMaster, on 28 December 2018 - 04:27 PM, said:

Cite examples in Lore or Fluff where a Clan hired a merc unit.

Does Clan Davion count???