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How To Make My Victor 9S Better


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#1 MarauderAlphaTango

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Posted 20 March 2019 - 03:20 PM

Hi All,

I used to play a lot and was at the time reasonably competitive. I stopped playing for a bit and I am unsure what to do. I am looking to make my older mechs better or buy some newer mechs but I don't know where to start.

my current Victor 9S is ok, but I don't know what to do to make it better. I tend to poke shot as I was never great at dealing enough damage in a short period of time to use a brawler build.

here is what I have for now https://mwo.smurfy-n...de98a72b41e5469

tips are appreciated. I tend to be stronger with my Catapult K2 or my DRG 1N

Edited by MarauderAlphaTango, 20 March 2019 - 03:27 PM.


#2 Gagis

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Posted 20 March 2019 - 03:59 PM

Thats... 4 different weapon systems with barely any synergy between them. Not a good approach.

The 9S is practically made for brawling, so its hard to think of alternative approaches. The champion version of it runs an AC20 and 2x LPL, which seems reasonably poky but the version with SRM's is just better.

The 9A2 on the other hand can run 3x AC10, which is some serious pinpoint firepower and is probably the second viable Victor along with the AC20+3ASRM6 brawler. VTR-9A1

Edited by Gagis, 20 March 2019 - 03:59 PM.


#3 WrathOfDeadguy

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Posted 20 March 2019 - 04:58 PM

There are a few things holding this build back. Let's just go step by step:

First, Laser AMS. It seems like a good idea to take an AMS with no ammo limitations, but in practice LAMS- especially IS LAMS- just generates far more heat than it's worth. For the same exact tonnage and crit slot requirement, you can take regular AMS and a ton of ammo, which will still last for quite a long time but adds no additional heat. It's a much better deal. The only time I'd even consider LAMS as an option is if I had only cool-running small-bore ballistics (AC2, AC5) or LB10X as the rest of my armament. That's an easy swap-out to make.

Second, as Gagis mentioned, there isn't much synergy between your weapons. Lasers like to run in batteries of the same or similar type, with similar durations and range brackets. The LPL is a short-mid range weapon, while the LL is a mid-long range weapon. The LPL's shorter burn duration does you no good because you still have to wait out the LL's longer burn, so all you get from it is the one extra point of damage- not really worth two extra tons; better just to run a pair of LLs or a pair of LPLs and fully commit to one or the other. LPLs do pair well with ERML, but that's really advice for a build with four or more energy hardpoints.

Third, a single LRM launcher isn't much of a threat. The cycle time is too long, the throw weight is too light, and the tonnage is too heavy compared to other launchers; all you get is the range, which likely won't matter because your other weapons can't reach that far, and enemy AMS will likely devour the whole salvo before it can land any significant damage. If you want a missile launcher with some reach, consider running MRMs instead, and practice leading them on midrange targets. If you do want to keep the LRMs- which isn't recommended on an IS assault- you will want to commit to the weapon system and fill all three hardpoints with launchers.

Fourth, engine size. 80-ton assaults are in a pretty sub-optimal place, so they really need to be able to move and keep pace with the heavies to see consistent success. Their best 'role' is adding a little bit more throw weight to a push, which they can't do if they're lumbering along in the backline with the 90-100t assaults. 60-70kph is a good speed range to shoot for, and speed tweak (mobility skill tree) is generally a good investment. Try to run a 300 or higher rated engine whenever you are able to- and, with the IS 80-tonners, make it LFE if you can. The extra tonnage is worth the extra risk, and LFE strikes a good balance between STD durability and XL weight savings in most 80t builds. Also, consider this: the Victor doesn't have any CT or head hardpoints, so there aren't really any advantages to surviving beyond the loss of both side torsos in any case.

Fifth, jump jets. While you won't get a whole lot of lift out of them, they do help with getting around maps, allowing you to scale up walls when you'd otherwise have to go around. Additionally, 'Mechs can turn slightly faster while jump-jetting, which is a great feature for assault 'Mechs to have when fighting smaller, faster enemies. Since the Victor can take jets, you will always want to take at least one just for the mobility benefits.

So, here are a few suggestions for Victor builds, which cover several different playstyles the 'Mech is suited for:

1. Classic brawler (AC20+3xSRM6A). Here you give up any midrange or longrange ability in favor of a punchy, focused, cool-running alpha strike up close. A bigger engine helps you close the distance faster (~65kph stock, 70+ with full speed tweak). Ignores the energy weapons altogether, because in this case they'd only get in the way by overheating the build in the middle of close fights. If you still want to keep the AMS, then take the Operations skill tree for cool run and drop the two extra heat sinks in favor of AMS+1t ammo (and add half a ton of AC20 or SRM ammo with the rest of the savings).

2. Midrange brawler (3xMRM20+LB10X). With this, you have some reach but you also still have the ability to just power through other 'Mechs in a close brawl. You could run 2xMRM30 for the same tube count, but MRM20s give you a tighter pattern (read: better damage focus). The LB10X adds in some DPS that runs cool enough as not to get in the way of your missile spam, and also gives you a quick follow-up finishing weapon for when you open up components with the MRMs. Possible adaptations: You could drop the heat sink to swap out for an AC10 instead, for a bit of pinpoint utility, or else shave a little armor off of your empty arm and (only a very little bit) from your legs and slap AMS back on.

3. Hybrid brawler (AC20+MRM40+2xERML). The idea here is to lean on your MRMs and lasers during the early part of the game, and then stop using the lasers in favor of the AC20 when the range closes and the brawl starts. Again, you have some ranged trading ability, but you also have a nice big punchy alpha to fall back on up close.

4. Midrange PPFLD (AC10+2xHPPC). This one runs hot. Very hot. The ability to smack a single component for the full 40 damage is wonderful, however, if you can manage the heat. Unlike the first three builds, this one can't brawl. It is almost exclusively a midrange trading 'Mech. Step out, take the shot, get back in cover- and repeat. Lean back on the AC10 when you are too hot to fire the HPPCs, or if something gets inside their 90m minimum range. A bit of practice, and this is easily one of the most lethal builds for the 'Mech, but it is definitely an advanced-user build. Also note that, since all of your weapons would be arm mounted, you also have to worry a bit about getting turned into a stick- protect your HPPC arm by preference, because it's got 3/4 of your alpha strike in it.

5. PPFLD brawler (AC20+2xSNPPC). Has the same alpha as the midrange version, but it's entirely focused on close combat (and lacks the minimum range handicap). The alpha might seem a bit small for an assault, but remember- it's all going in a single component, unlike the missile builds which will scatter damage everywhere. I plugged a STD engine in this one because it does run quite hot after a few shots in a row, and since you'll be brawling with it you will at some point lose a side torso while you're running warmish. If you want to run faster and take the risk, LFE325 is the same tonnage as STD300 so you can just swap one for the other and keep the exact same number of heat sinks. I've run similar builds on other 'Mechs and had great results with them, but- again, heat management is key. When at high heat, the AC20 is safe to fire (you have more than enough sinks to deal with that) while you hold fire with the SNPPCs until your heat goes down. You still have to worry about having all arm mounted weapons, but at least here each arm has the same amount of firepower in it.

Edited by WrathOfDeadguy, 20 March 2019 - 05:36 PM.


#4 Gagis

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Posted 20 March 2019 - 05:14 PM

Wrath's loadout #2 looks really solid to my eye. It is probably a good one to try out first.

You can actually fit one more heat sink in it if you upgrade the armour to light ferro-fibrous and shave a few points from the legs.

Edited by Gagis, 20 March 2019 - 05:17 PM.


#5 WrathOfDeadguy

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Posted 20 March 2019 - 05:36 PM

Goodness, you're right. Dunno how I missed that. Updated.

#6 Koniving

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Posted 20 March 2019 - 06:41 PM

Ditch laser ams.

Make a choice between large lasers or a big ac... Doing both forces the need for the xl engine. That leaves you very vulnerable, in addition to the hefty heat.

#7 ImperialKnight

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Posted 20 March 2019 - 06:49 PM

MRM deadside build, although you wouldn't really want to lose that RT. 2xMRM30s is 1 ton light than 3xMRM20s. The difference in spread is negligible. MPLas just to chase away lights, and clean up kills. Otherwise the MRM60 is your primary.

https://mech.nav-alp...3a83f05d_VTR-9S

#8 justcallme A S H

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Posted 20 March 2019 - 09:48 PM

Victor 9S - THIS.

The end. Literally the way to do it.

You can XL350 and 2 JJ if you want, the mech is, IMO, reasonably XL safe. I crank 1k damage in it regularly. You need to shield properly though, the 2nd JJ helps with that.

Edited by justcallme A S H, 20 March 2019 - 09:49 PM.


#9 MarauderAlphaTango

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Posted 25 March 2019 - 09:30 PM

View PostGagis, on 20 March 2019 - 03:59 PM, said:

Thats... 4 different weapon systems with barely any synergy between them. Not a good approach.

The 9S is practically made for brawling, so its hard to think of alternative approaches. The champion version of it runs an AC20 and 2x LPL, which seems reasonably poky but the version with SRM's is just better.

The 9A2 on the other hand can run 3x AC10, which is some serious pinpoint firepower and is probably the second viable Victor along with the AC20+3ASRM6 brawler. VTR-9A1


Does the 9B or the 9K make any difference?

#10 MarauderAlphaTango

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Posted 25 March 2019 - 09:45 PM

View PostWrathOfDeadguy, on 20 March 2019 - 05:36 PM, said:

Goodness, you're right. Dunno how I missed that. Updated.


So the MRM has no min range but it does not lock like and LRM? I find the Victor is fragile... at least in PUG. Can't get a team for support. Any tips for better brawling? is AC20 better than Rotary AC5? I see rotary AC5 is high firepower but there are better Sustained DPS? I just don't know what to aim for in a build.

I switched to my STK 3F for now but it is also very fragile, though I have had some success with the current trial mech. My 3f is a 2SSRM6 and 4LL build, I am averaging about 300 damage which is better than I was doing with the Victors. I am trying to decide if I should keep working with what I have or buy something new. My highest damage is currently my heavies. such as my DRG 1N and my CPLT K2.

So much is new in the game.. I am just not sure what is good anymore.

#11 Brethren

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Posted 26 March 2019 - 01:17 AM

View PostMarauderAlphaTango, on 25 March 2019 - 09:45 PM, said:

So the MRM has no min range but it does not lock like and LRM?

Correct. MRMs are like SRMs.

View PostMarauderAlphaTango, on 25 March 2019 - 09:45 PM, said:

I find the Victor is fragile... at least in PUG. Can't get a team for support. Any tips for better brawling? is AC20 better than Rotary AC5? I see rotary AC5 is high firepower but there are better Sustained DPS? I just don't know what to aim for in a build.

There's three things an AC20 has over a RAC5.
First, it cannot jam at an unfortunate moment.
Second, it puts all damage into a single component while the RAC depending on your aim and enemy movement, spreads its damage all over the place.
Third, the RAC has you staring at the enemy to deal damage, leaving your center torso wide open for incoming fire. The AC20 you fire, turn your torso to one side, turn back and fire when the cooldown is done. Twisting spreads incoming fire over your entire torso. Shielding with an (preferably) empty arm let's you take damage without getting taken out of action or losing firepower.

In addition there are some weapon cooldown times that align quite well - AC20 (or LB) and SRM6s come to mind. Both systems have 4 sec cooldown, which means you can "alpha strike, twist/shield, alpha strike" as long as your heat sinks permit. Posted Image Plus, your Victor will last quite a bit longer this way.

Edited by Brethren, 26 March 2019 - 01:18 AM.


#12 ShiverMeRivets

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Posted 26 March 2019 - 02:19 AM

RACs are pretty lousy weapons, except in particular situations. Not to mention that they are boring... oops, I mentioned it.

To use them effectively you either need to be able to take a lot of damage while staring at your target (i.e., heavier assults and/or a narrow frontal crosssection) or be small and mobile enough to flank and unload at least a few seconds of fire before you are focused by the enemies. The Victor is ill suited to their style.

Today it seems like it is triple RAC3, or nothing. Dual RAC5s are good at face hugging and killing 1 enemy, and then you are hot and jammed. Bushwhackers love this crap, but almost all other mechs are bad at this.

#13 MarauderAlphaTango

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Posted 27 March 2019 - 07:56 PM

View Postjustcallme A S H, on 20 March 2019 - 09:48 PM, said:

Victor 9S - THIS.

The end. Literally the way to do it.

You can XL350 and 2 JJ if you want, the mech is, IMO, reasonably XL safe. I crank 1k damage in it regularly. You need to shield properly though, the 2nd JJ helps with that.


I have been trying this build lately and I like it. I have been getting 2+ kills a match and around 500 dmg providing my team doesn't all poptart and leave me on my own, I still get 300 dmg those matches.

I just have to get better at spreading the damage across my arm and torsos

#14 Brethren

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Posted 29 March 2019 - 01:33 AM

View PostMarauderAlphaTango, on 27 March 2019 - 07:56 PM, said:


I have been trying this build lately and I like it. I have been getting 2+ kills a match and around 500 dmg providing my team doesn't all poptart and leave me on my own, I still get 300 dmg those matches.

I just have to get better at spreading the damage across my arm and torsos

An important side note:
The community has a tendency to look at the damage numbers first, because that's the first thing that pops up in the end screen and kind of the only one stat you can compare yourself with the other players in the team screen.

But here's a thing: If you complete a match with "just" 350 damage but manage go score 2 "solo kill" achievements, you actually kicked some major ***... provided your assault mech did not just accidentally one-shot 2 lights. Posted Image

Dealing a lot of damage is one thing. Destroying enemy mechs quickly with as little damage as possible is a whole other skillset. Posted Image

Edited by Brethren, 29 March 2019 - 01:41 AM.


#15 MarauderAlphaTango

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Posted 29 March 2019 - 08:27 PM

Between this and my remodified (again!!!) Stalker build, my gameplay has really stepped up. I have steadily gotten kills in matches and I am surviving the majority of matches and dealing way more damage than before. I feel like I am back to playing where I was just before my Hiatus.

Thanks for the advice and tips guys.

#16 Midgie

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Posted 01 April 2019 - 05:48 AM

For a brawler, try something like this:
VTR-9S
Treat the mech like an oversized Centurian.





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