40 replies to this topic

[Orodain]

After a year or so gone i come back to find the new skill tree and my dr told me it gave me stage 4 corneal cancer.

i was told in game the kids on these boards screamed for it. Why, WHY did you make this game even worse!?

[Athom83]

• The system we had was always placeholder and the community finally pushed PGI to make a permanent system.
  
• The system we had only pandered to people who gave their lives to MWO, as well as making it so you basically had to purchase mechs and mechbays YOU DIDN'T WANT in order to make the mech you did want to play the best it could be.
  
• It doesn't make the game worse, spending 5 seconds looking at it without playing with it doesn't make you a credible person on how the new system is.

[FupDup]

The new system is more tedious and also more expensive in the long run (b/c you can't swap modules between variants, every mech starts from scratch now) but it didn't ruin the game. It's just a little annoying. There are way bigger fish to fry.

[Curccu]

Orodain, on 22 February 2019 - 07:33 PM, said:

After a year or so gone i come back to find the new skill tree and my dr told me it gave me stage 4 corneal cancer.

i was told in game the kids on these boards screamed for it. Why, WHY did you make this game even worse!?

There are many guides on new player help section... if you want to understand how it works, you will get it pretty fast.

[Racerxintegra2k]

I enjoyed leveling a mech under the rule of 3. I didn't like having to buy 2 more of the same clan mechs to master one. The skill tree grind is horrible. If i had to start all over when the skill tree dropped i would have quit. The only thing that kept me around through skill tree was the massive amounts of skill points and GXP. I've just run out of that, and was trying to level a Thanatos good lord its terrible(the experience).

[LordNothing]

the good news is that you typically use the same nodes on every build. i figure about 10% variation from mech to mech.

offensive tree, ballistics go right, missiles go left, energy center
defensive tree, just go armor, go all in if machine gun piranhas/fleas or lb boats scare you
mobility tree, assaults and heavies go left, mediums and lights go right
jump jet tree, lol dont use em much
operations tree, hotter build unlock more
sensor tree, most mechs go left, ecm or stealth go all in
consumables tree, dont use them much since nerf

also since you can save and load skill tree configs now you can set up templates for various buids and fill out the rest. granted that only works if you have the xp/cbills you need to unlock them.

Edited by LordNothing, 23 February 2019 - 07:45 AM.

[KodiakGW]

The Skill Shubbery was requested by those who wanted to make it easier for them to make alt accounts. That is it. Just take a look at one person here who posted a defense of it. Only 18 games last season. Since April last year, no seasons over 100 games. If it is so great, why has that person not put in more games. Reason, too busy with their new alt accounts.

Really sad they haven’t figured that out yet.

Edit: But you know what, I don’t want them to change it. Having fun with my alt account. Maybe going to make another one with just a PIR.

Edited by KodiakGW, 23 February 2019 - 08:08 AM.

[ImperialKnight]

Orodain, on 22 February 2019 - 07:33 PM, said:

After a year or so gone i come back to find the new skill tree and my dr told me it gave me stage 4 corneal cancer.

i was told in game the kids on these boards screamed for it. Why, WHY did you make this game even worse!?

HAHAHAHAHAHhhahaa..... you think PGI gives a damn about what happens on these boards? That's cute. This is just where players come to rant after losing the "Who has more potatoes on their team" roulette 5 times in a row.

[MechaBattler]

People wanted a new skill system. What we got was not what anyone had in mind. Even over loud protests they pushed it through largely as is. But at least we got rid of needing 3 mechs to master.

Mostly it came about because PGI realized people were just swapping modules or not even bothering with them in some cases. That's where the whole "cheapskates" comment came from. They created it as a c-bill/timesink you couldn't get around. Gotta get people to spend money somehow. Or at least I'm sure that's what they were thinking. They still could have taken to heart some of the feedback they got.

[Angel of Annihilation]

Athom83, on 22 February 2019 - 07:42 PM, said:

• The system we had was always placeholder and the community finally pushed PGI to make a permanent system.
  
• The system we had only pandered to people who gave their lives to MWO, as well as making it so you basically had to purchase mechs and mechbays YOU DIDN'T WANT in order to make the mech you did want to play the best it could be.
  
• It doesn't make the game worse, spending 5 seconds looking at it without playing with it doesn't make you a credible person on how the new system is.

Yet somehow now with the new skill system in place, I still typically buy 2-4 variants of each chassis and mech bays to go along with it, only now it takes me 3x as long to skill each one up to a competitive level while costing me an additional 4.1 million C-bills per variant. Overall for me anyway, the new system is three times as long and twice as costly and this is what PGI calls improvement....hmm...odd.

[Valdarion Silarius]

I think the skill tree was an overall positive change for MW:O. I was frustrated when it was announced back in the day, but overall when I learned how it helps under performing mechs then I learned to appreciate it more and now I actually like it. The only thing I would still change in the system is the consumption of c-bills when unlocking skill points. It should only consume GXP or general XP earned with that mech. The c-bill cost when unlocking skills shouldn't be there since it's an incentive for more grind.

Edited by Arnold The Governator, 23 February 2019 - 09:16 AM.

[Angel of Annihilation]

Arnold The Governator, on 23 February 2019 - 09:14 AM, said:

I think the skill tree was an overall positive change for MW:O. I was frustrated when it was announced back in the day, but overall when I learned how it helps under performing mechs then I learned to appreciate it more and now I actually like it. The only thing I would still change in the system is the consumption of c-bills when unlocking skill points. It should only consume GXP and/or general XP earned with that mech. The c-bill cost when unlocking skills shouldn't be there.

I agree, though I also think 800 XP per skill point is a bit steep as well. I mean I average about 1600 XP a match but that still means I have to play 45 matches on a single mech to unlock 91 point and more if I want to experiment with different skill builds. So for the current Warhammer IIC variants I have, which is 5 of them, I would have to play over 225 matches to skill them all out. This would also costs me 20.5 million C-bills without any experimentation, maybe 30 million if I wanted to try out different skill builds.

Under the old system I had zero cost to skills and generally speaking it took me about 20 matches to unlock everything on a variant except the master level which only game me an one extra module slot which was no bit deal so roughly 100 matches total. Then my only cost above and beyond what I currently spent would have been for two modules which I would have swapped between dozens of mechs make their overall cost negligible in the long run.

So from my perspective, not only should the C-bill cost be dropped from the skill tree but the XP per node requirement should be cut in half to around 400 XP per skill point. Right now we have somewhat of a miserable grind going on.

[Valdarion Silarius]

Angel of Annihilation, on 23 February 2019 - 09:25 AM, said:

So from my perspective, not only should the C-bill cost be dropped from the skill tree but the XP per node requirement should be cut in half to around 400 XP per skill point. Right now we have somewhat of a miserable grind going on.

Yeah true. I've never been a fan of grind in any video game that forces people to spend an absurd amount of time to grind to achieve something. I don't mind grind as long as I'm enjoying what I'm playing, but the novelty of fun does wear thin after so much repetition. At least it's not like Path of Exile (God I'm never going back to that game) or Vermintide 2 (blown way too much time on a garbage RNG system just for cosmetics).

Edited by Arnold The Governator, 23 February 2019 - 09:37 AM.

[Variant1]

Athom83, on 22 February 2019 - 07:42 PM, said:

• The system we had was always placeholder and the community finally pushed PGI to make a permanent system.
  
• The system we had only pandered to people who gave their lives to MWO, as well as making it so you basically had to purchase mechs and mechbays YOU DIDN'T WANT in order to make the mech you did want to play the best it could be.
  
• It doesn't make the game worse, spending 5 seconds looking at it without playing with it doesn't make you a credible person on how the new system is.

1. All PGI had to do was remove the arbitrary 3 chassis. Infact would have been better to remove it since they were straight up weapon buffs that the new skill tree makes even more of a problem.
2. see 1
3. It does, its basicaly more min maxing. Ruins balance along with quirks by making weapons stray from their base values going against mechwarrior principles of fixed ranges and consistency of weapons.

FupDup, on 22 February 2019 - 07:45 PM, said:

The new system is more tedious and also more expensive in the long run (b/c you can't swap modules between variants, every mech starts from scratch now) but it didn't ruin the game. It's just a little annoying. There are way bigger fish to fry.

IT does ruin the game, it takes the problems that quirks introduces and compounds the problem. It caters even more to min maxing since the nodes are just straight up weapon buffs and the other nodes are either pointless or too weak to invest.

[Koniving]

Orodain, on 22 February 2019 - 07:33 PM, said:

After a year or so gone i come back to find the new skill tree and my dr told me it gave me stage 4 corneal cancer.

i was told in game the kids on these boards screamed for it. Why, WHY did you make this game even worse!?

It was among the **** promised to us by the developers from before the game even started, which we never actually got until they finally bothered.

https://mwomercs.com...le-warfare-cont
And comically if you go to page 6 of the comments, people are complaining that there isn't enough defense in the defense tree, and not enough choices...blah blah blah...
https://mwomercs.com...e-warfare-cont/

This is before the game even had a beta for us to play.

https://mwomercs.com...-3-role-warfare

Sad thing is...this **** was well thought out.

....What we got...not so much.

Still, its better than the old tree. The old tree was just an arbitrary level up system, that basically punished you for having a new mech.

[Lances107]

The old system with modules was too costly. Having to change those things in and out was what 2 mill per if I remember correctly. The good end is you could get what you needed, such things as seismic sensors. The new skill is not perfect but it is not the worse either. Having to waste points on nodes that lessen fall damage, even when you dont have jjs seems silly to me. Getting seismic is costly point wise. Not to mention they completely screwed over operations with the changes they made to engines heat wise. The cool shots got nerfed into oblivion. To me these days its a pretty standard road of have toos. Most of the time you can not deviate from that road or risk major problems in the field. Like I said both systems had there ups and there downs. /shrug.

[Kalimaster]

To the OP. Talk to Russ about your doctor bill. He might be able to prescribe some old time table top mini's for you if that would help, or perhaps you might like dice to go with pen and paper.

[TheArisen]

Angel of Annihilation, on 23 February 2019 - 09:25 AM, said:

I agree, though I also think 800 XP per skill point is a bit steep as well. I mean I average about 1600 XP a match but that still means I have to play 45 matches on a single mech to unlock 91 point and more if I want to experiment with different skill builds. So for the current Warhammer IIC variants I have, which is 5 of them, I would have to play over 225 matches to skill them all out. This would also costs me 20.5 million C-bills without any experimentation, maybe 30 million if I wanted to try out different skill builds.

Under the old system I had zero cost to skills and generally speaking it took me about 20 matches to unlock everything on a variant except the master level which only game me an one extra module slot which was no bit deal so roughly 100 matches total. Then my only cost above and beyond what I currently spent would have been for two modules which I would have swapped between dozens of mechs make their overall cost negligible in the long run.

So from my perspective, not only should the C-bill cost be dropped from the skill tree but the XP per node requirement should be cut in half to around 400 XP per skill point. Right now we have somewhat of a miserable grind going on.

Yeah I agree with this, the costs to level are a bit much but aside from that the overall system is decent

[Gas Guzzler]

Orodain, on 22 February 2019 - 07:33 PM, said:

Whose going to pay my hospital bills

Who's*

[InfinityBall]

Gas Guzzler, on 23 February 2019 - 02:07 PM, said:

Who's*

Half the board thinks "alot" is a word, and you're taking a stand on that?