271 replies to this topic

[2DaT]

Side torso heat spike does not make any sense from scientific point of view.
Gameplay-wise it's annoying and discourages brawling and tanking for the team.
This mechanic is cancer and should be removed. Nobody likes it.

[FupDup]

Sorry to disappoint you, but in the most recent thread that Chris responded to he hinted that an increase to the penalty might be possible if people ask for it.

And I can guarantee you people are gonna ask for more, because there is a pretty significant presence on this forum that thinks firing one single ERPPC from 0% heat should make your mech move slow and have an RNG roll to die from an ammo explosion right there. Watch the replies to this thread.

Edited by FupDup, 17 March 2019 - 10:52 AM.

[K O Z A K]

Pretty much 100% of players I talked to about this (except like 2 ppl on these forums) think its dumb and was a bad change that made the game less enjoyable, but from the looks of it pgi in their infinite wisdom is keeping it

[WrathOfDeadguy]

In before the usual "git gud" apologists whose match survival rate nevertheless took a nose dive after the torso loss nerf (really, it's a remarkable coincidence. Jarl's list is a wonderful thing).

[VonBruinwald]

WrathOfDeadguy, on 17 March 2019 - 12:42 PM, said:

In before the usual "git gud" apologists whose match survival rate nevertheless took a nose dive after the torso loss nerf (really, it's a remarkable coincidence. Jarl's list is a wonderful thing).

Wrath touches the right spot. A lot of players got used to there being little/no penalty when they lost a ST with a cXL. Now that there's a penalty they're finding their stats dropping and looking to blame PGI rather than adapting.

Remember this simple phrase: If your side torso's gonna go, curb your heat before it blows.

I still see people trading alphas with perceived impunity even when their ST is stripped raw. Pop that torso and they blame PGI for their suicide even though they were the ones failing to monitor their mech's condition and were red lining the heat-scale recklessly.

Another pilot also came up with the following solution: Use your coolshot when your side torso's blown instead of using it to squeeze out another alpha.

Edited by VonBruinwald, 17 March 2019 - 01:32 PM.

[2DaT]

VonBruinwald, on 17 March 2019 - 01:32 PM, said:

Wrath touches the right spot. A lot of players got used to there being little/no penalty when they lost a ST with a cXL. Now that there's a penalty they're finding their stats dropping and looking to blame PGI rather than adapting.

Remember this simple phrase: If your side torso's gonna go, curb your heat before it blows.

I still see people trading alphas with perceived impunity even when their ST is stripped raw. Pop that torso and they blame PGI for their suicide even though they were the ones failing to monitor their mech's condition and were red lining the heat-scale recklessly.

Another pilot also came up with the following solution: Use your coolshot when your side torso's blown instead of using it to squeeze out another alpha.

There is no need for solution. This mechanic shouldn't exist in the first place.

[Tarl Cabot]

2DaT, on 17 March 2019 - 02:16 PM, said:

There is no need for solution. This mechanic shouldn't exist in the first place.

It is some of PGI flavor from the BT game itself, and it is space magic. An alternate take on it. Never mind there are several threads about this already. People are and will continue to adjust but for those who do not.. BOOOOM!!!

https://mwomercs.com...ost__p__6236477

Tarl Cabot, on 16 March 2019 - 10:59 AM, said:

Tis still Space Magic, with PGI using the BT Heat Scale and some of the Engine Crit as flavor since they have not introduced majority of the effects from that scale nor full range engine crit system. Nor did BT rules fully accounted for all the HS in the engines, included the slotted HS. It only had one (+5 heat) or 2 engine crits (+10 heat) and 3 crits (engine shuts down).

For MWO the Heat Bar is acting like the Heat Scale in BT. There is the base 30. Anything over 30 is additional temporary capacity, so for almost all players we have been riding above that base 30 for most of the drop. And at times a player may not be certain when a side torso/arm/leg might be lost, along with its associated equipment/components.

And for BT, the Heat phase comes after the Fire phase.

1. Initiative
2. Movement (ground)
3. Movement (aerospace)
4. Weapon Attack
5. Physical Attack
6. Heat
7. End

So, still space magic and PGI putting their own spin on it.

I am not one who believes that all of the BT scale be used, though I had countered that there should have been 2-3 thresholds that once cross the mechs speed/agility should have been affected, followed by one soft shutdown (override availability) and a hard shutdown, with the appropriate damage setup PGI has in place. Speed being affected right now only occurs is when a cXL/LFE loses a ST.

Edited by Tarl Cabot, 17 March 2019 - 02:31 PM.

[RickySpanish]

There's like. Totes. This one thing that's, like. Called a cool shot? Seems, like, it might help? Ya! Also git gud.

[Tarl Cabot]

And I do not see PGI reverting it back to where it was taking it off the bottom again. The next best thing would be to campaign to get the threshold lowered from that 40%, that 40% is calculated using all the HS in the engine, both integrated and slotted, then the number of HS removed is from the integrated ones, the ones providing the larger capacity amount.

https://mwomercs.com...-with-the-heat/

https://mwomercs.com...on-long-enough/

https://mwomercs.com...on-needs-to-go/

https://mwomercs.com...o-is-destroyed/

https://mwomercs.com...rso-heat-issue/

https://mwomercs.com...ty-insta-death/

https://mwomercs.com...rso-heat-spike/

https://mwomercs.com...ew-heat-system/

Original patch notes.

Edited by Tarl Cabot, 17 March 2019 - 05:33 PM.

[VonBruinwald]

Tarl Cabot, on 17 March 2019 - 02:51 PM, said:

And I do not see PGI reverting it back to where it was taking it off the bottom again.

If they made isXL's the the heat from the top and cXL/LFE take the heat from the bottom it would be acceptable. Until then, leave it at the top, it's still better than insta-death.

[Angel of Annihilation]

Tarl Cabot, on 17 March 2019 - 02:24 PM, said:

It is some of PGI flavor from the BT game itself, and it is space magic. An alternate take on it. Never mind there are several threads about this already. People are and will continue to adjust but for those who do not.. BOOOOM!!!

https://mwomercs.com...ost__p__6236477



I am not one who believes that all of the BT scale be used, though I had countered that there should have been 2-3 thresholds that once cross the mechs speed/agility should have been affected, followed by one soft shutdown (override availability) and a hard shutdown, with the appropriate damage setup PGI has in place. Speed being affected right now only occurs is when a cXL/LFE loses a ST.

The thing about the battletech heat scale is that your heat sinks immediately sinked their heat value every turn so for a mech with 15 DHS, you could sink 30 heat each and every turn without fail. This means you could fire 2 PPCs as fast as your could fire then over and over and over without ever having any heating penalties. One of my favorite battletech builds was a Quad LPL Warhawk that could move and fire all 4 LPLs continuously without ever worrying about heat.

I guess my point is that heat is much more of a factor in MWO than it ever was in Battletech so I am not sure we need more penalties in MWO.

As far as the Side Torso loss heat spike, I absolutely hate it with a passion however, I have to be honest and say that it does balance the different engine types. With the heat spike, you pop the side torso on a XL equipped Clan mech and it means death 80-90% of the time, especially with the amount of spike heat and heat in general that Clan Weapons generate. LFEs are in the same boat except, IS weapons tend to run a bit cooler so the instant death to ST loss is reduced to maybe 60-70% of the time which is still better than an IS XL but enough that running an XL has actually become an option again. It also is extreme enough that it makes running a standard engine very appealing as well.

HOWEVER.....It's not a fun mechanic, not in the least. PGI should have went the other way with it and just gave the IS XLs that massive penalty and heat spike which would have still left IS XLs with a pretty huge disadvantage but would have at least remove the 100% instant kill mechanic from IS XLs. That change would have resulted in the same engine balance but instead of making the game less fun, would have actually been a buff and made the game more fun. Unfortunately PGI doesn't do that though, they apparently just want to make the game worse and worse, at least that tends to be how every change goes. In fact I can't remember one set of patch notes ever where I haven't felt pissed off, frustrated or even remotely felt positive about them after reading.

[Tarl Cabot]

VonBruinwald, on 17 March 2019 - 03:02 PM, said:

If they made isXL's the the heat from the top and cXL/LFE take the heat from the bottom it would be acceptable. Until then, leave it at the top, it's still better than insta-death.

I do not see PGI breaking it up completely that way. And that is why I also advocate lowering the percentages for the cXL and LFE. If PGI had originally set it up to take from the top when they introduced the 20% heat penalty in 2015 I do not believe they would have upped it to 40% in 2017.

[HammerMaster]

For the billionth time.
STOP RIDING YOUR HEAT.
You got by without BT style penalties and now you expect no penalties.
The entitlement stinks here.

[xX PUG Xx]

Hmmmmm..... with the risk of repeating myself, DOES PGI ACTUALLY PLAY THEIR OWN GAME???

I'm getting tired of being trolled by the developers: the one thing I have always enjoyed is brawling and yet another thing has been added to make that a really bad situation to get into. So why did I come back and try to get into this game again? I am beginning to really wonder.

[VonBruinwald]

xX PUG Xx, on 17 March 2019 - 03:12 PM, said:

the one thing I have always enjoyed is brawling and yet another thing has been added to make that a really bad situation to get into.

You could always take a STD engine, since the mobility desync they're a lot more viable for brawling, all it takes is a little more planning on when to engage as you have a lower top speed which isn't such a big deal once you get within brawling distance.

Edited by VonBruinwald, 17 March 2019 - 03:27 PM.

[John Bronco]

HammerMaster, on 17 March 2019 - 03:08 PM, said:

For the billionth time.
STOP RIDING YOUR HEAT.
You got by without BT style penalties and now you expect no penalties.
The entitlement stinks here.

This isn't BT, chump.

[Prototelis]

Hi, my survival rate has gone up since this change and I think its stupid.

[2DaT]

Сlan brawlers are a joke now (not implying that they were a big threat before). PGI likes to nerf playstyles instead of particular equipment.

Edited by 2DaT, 17 March 2019 - 03:56 PM.

[HammerMaster]

BlaizerP, on 17 March 2019 - 03:29 PM, said:

This isn't BT, chump.

I'm the chump yet this crew is blowing themselves up.
Game base on BT. IS BT.
https://www.amazon.com/Battletech-Game-of-Armored-Combat/dp/B07MCYLBCR/ref=pd_lpo_vtph_bs_img_1/144-1191118-5979639?_encoding=UTF8&psc=1&refRID=YKZ23TEQSRZZ7JK5TW1F
Get a set. Have a go.
Feel the originality.

Edited by HammerMaster, 17 March 2019 - 04:55 PM.

[Wil McCullough]

HammerMaster, on 17 March 2019 - 04:52 PM, said:

I'm the chump yet this crew is blowing themselves up.
Game base on BT. IS BT.
https://www.amazon.com/Battletech-Game-of-Armored-Combat/dp/B07MCYLBCR/ref=pd_lpo_vtph_bs_img_1/144-1191118-5979639?_encoding=UTF8&psc=1&refRID=YKZ23TEQSRZZ7JK5TW1F
Get a set. Have a go.
Feel the originality.

Game's name is mechwarrior online. It's a mechwarrior game first, bt game second. If you want bt, go play bt. Hbs is that way >>>