35 replies to this topic

[Kenknee]

So I'm still pretty crappy at this game, just started playing last December, and haven't done so for about 6 weeks but recently got into it again. I really gotta wonder why everyone doesn't gear up with more UAVs, ESPECIALLY mechs using LRMs.

There is no reason everyone shouldn't take at least one, they don't even take up any room or weight. I tried being helpful by getting a NARC now and then, but just didn't seem worth the weight and hoping that I had some LRM boats showing up in the match. But with a few skill points I have 2, the last long and scan pretty far, well over the area of an entire grid square. If everyone had them you could spend practically the whole match knowing where they other guys are. Yea, sometimes they'll shoot it down early, but if you pop it during a brawl, no one seems to hardly ever do so, and that's why I bring two. They shoot the second one down even less than they do the first.

Particularly good in Solar City, Canyon, etc, any map with corners and cover, and the best part is its really useful even if you don't have LRM boats, but great if you do. Yet after I die, and I get to watch my team blaze away, no one seems to have stocked even one. Are people just cheap?

Same thing with AMS, it's one ton for the gear and 1100 shots of ammo and negligible heat. Why not get one? If everyone had one LRMs, ATMs, both things that come up a lot, can be largely ignored. I feel its so obvious that I must be missing something, which I'm sure you'll all tell me about

Edited by Kenknee, 13 May 2019 - 10:43 AM.

[MechaBattler]

UAVs are generally good thing to have in almost all cases. What's not to like about knowing about the enemy's positions without exposing yourself? Maybe people are just being cheap. Understandable I suppose. It can get pretty grindy if you're new.

AMS I always think to myself. "I'll just stay out of the rain..."

Edited by MechaBattler, 13 May 2019 - 10:46 AM.

[VonBruinwald]

Because UAV's don't cause damage/kills.... Gotta pad those stats.

Also, because UAV's reveal the enemies position to team mates. Focused fire means the enemy die faster which reduces your personal damage/kills.

Edited by VonBruinwald, 13 May 2019 - 11:00 AM.

[RickySpanish]

I think most people don't want to pay the cost - both c-bill and SP. If you drop three consumables in a match you are down 120k c-bills which is a bit of an investment for some, especially if you lose. If you have a c-bill boosted 'Mech though and use consumables effectively, you're going to be making bank.

AMS has enjoyed a resurgeance in popularity for now, but traditionally it was excluded since avoiding missiles used to be trivially easy.

Edited by RickySpanish, 13 May 2019 - 11:09 AM.

[Phoenix 72]

Well, I can only speak for myself... I started playing about a year before the OP and I did not use consumables for the first 9 to 12 months or so. I originally used them, but found I did not win enough to actually make progress cash wise... I broke even usually, but got nowhere saving up for new Mechs... Which is why I stopped using consumables until "recently".

I have the money to buy any Mech I choose and outfit it and do not see anything I am interested in, so might as well use consumables. I value Artillery over UAVs usually, not because I love to pad my stats, but because using a UAV will only pay off if your team actually does anything with the information. I only do quickplay and the quality of my teammates... varies..

So my UAVs were quite often quite useless, while Artillery always hurts. Having said that, I try to bring 2 Artillery and 1 UAV most of the time, if I can spare the skillpoints.

As far as AMS goes, I have been an advocate of AMS for well over a year. I bring it on the majority of my Mechs. It's like a passive shield for my teammates... Here, too, due to the varying quality of teammates in quickplay I have shot down well over 1500 enemy missiles and the team still died to missile fire. Here, too, I stopped gimping my own performance to improve the surviveability of my team, because if you are unlucky in team composition, it does not really do anything.

For lurm heavy days I tend to bring my Crab 27, which I feel is a good compromise between personal firepower, surviveability and team utility.

[LordNothing]

with the consumable nerfs i have made the judgement call that its better to place nodes in places that give me an advantage for the whole match rather than just once. the first one is sometimes ok, whats a single node worth anyway? not much. you still get one freebie which usually goes to a cool shot, or for a colder mech an arty/airstrike. uavs are nice to have on assault mechs in the event of squirrel. on scouty mechs it does usually go to uav, but scouting never pays so its a rare thing. i might unlock more consumable tree when its an fp build.

as for ams. some mechs are better off without it. they dont really do that much against a large missile barrage. it takes mass concentration of multiple ams units to provide meaningful suppression. staying with the team only helps up to the point where they are in eachothers way and thats usually at the edge of the ams range anyway. its easier to stay low, stay in cover and maintain awareness of enemy sightlines.

[Marquis De Lafayette]

Many of the players using LRM’s actually wouldn’t benefit from carrying their own UAV’s. They are too far back from the enemy for the UAV they launch to help get a lock. So, it would likely be viewed as a waste of c-bills..... Not saying they are right, but it is what it is.

[Ken Harkin]

UAV for a LRM mech is not viable as you are going to find yourself < 180 meters.

For my LRM mechs I have BAP, TC, and sometimes Targeting Laser.

As far as AMS, many of my mechs have it and many more do not. Using terrain is the best method of protecting yourself from missiles.

[JediPanther]

I don't need them really. Only during events I'll go ams shield with a light like the tri-ams fox for easy c-bills. At most I need 1 uav and even then I forget to either use it or auto-fill it. Most players can easily dodge lrms. It use to be such slow velocity on them I could just watch them come at my mech and just side step them watching them hit the ground.

In my lights lrms are pretty much a non issue. The funny part about that is the majority of my lights do not have radar deprivation or ecm/stealth. Guess learning lights before ecm was in game made me pretty dam good at dodging them. On the lrm boat side all of my missile cats use 1 uav minimal with auto fill turned on along with max sensor tree minus the ecm nodes. They all have some type of back up weapon as well as I play them very close with the team.

I watch molten metal and see he really like the uavs and cool shots like an addict while i'm going "Nooo! you can use the points so much better with x tree for that build! WHy????"

If you want to rack up c-bills faster don't burn them on the uavs and such. Narc-ing during events with a fast mech is another easy mode money maker. i've got one locust set up for only narc-ing and a tag laser. It has nothing for weapons. Pure rng with teams for that one but when I have six other bugs I wanted to mix them up with each one having a specific build type-function.

[JediPanther]

Marquis De Lafayette, on 13 May 2019 - 12:29 PM, said:

Many of the players using LRM’s actually wouldn’t benefit from carrying their own UAV’s. They are too far back from the enemy for the UAV they launch to help get a lock. So, it would likely be viewed as a waste of c-bills..... Not saying they are right, but it is what it is.

I agree with only half of this. Those in the far back are usually too far away that a uav from them is wasted both their c-bills and little to zero use to their team mates grid(s) away. I find uavs to be extremely useful on my own lrm boats as I tend to be 300m or so from the closest ally at worst of times. The second line active lrm boaters who do try and get their own los locks are the ones able to make bank off uavs.

They make great distress signals when a mech is being wolf packed as well as a huge here-they-are sign on the mini map. Pugs that must see red boxes become trigger happy when you get 3-4 enemy mechs under ecm and spam team/lance chat with things like "uav up bombs away." I advocate narc over tag use as narc doesn't require you to "stare down" an enemy.

[Flyby215]

All my mechs carry two UAVs, with UAV range skill point.

UAV's can get a bit pricey for people grinding away for C-bills. I have more than enough, so I don't mind popping my UAVs anytime anywhere. Driving an assault this past weekend, if I started to get a whiff of something fishy, I would put up a UAV defensively to make sure no light was trying to sneak up behind me. Managed to bust a few sneaky buggers that way and mucked up their plans to shoot me in the back

Many of my mechs are now carrying AMS. I really like my Corsair 7A with quad AMS. It brings a huge smile to my face to watch those LRM20s get gobbled up.

[Pain G0D]

Consumables cost cbills . I normally save UAVs for events that want you to pop one . I keep my mechs cool enough to not need a cool shot . Most of the time your air strike and arty don't hit so , that's a waste .

LRM,s are a slow bleed , your chances of dying by lurm is very low . 2 laser AMS, can lock your mech down with heat . Don't get me wrong I don't mind boating AMS . It's fun but that's for playing around . My butt kicking mechs usually don't have the space .

Mounting AMS probably means I don't have a good build for a mech or I find a mech boring .

[AEgg]

Consumables eat cbills, thus, I've never used them and never will.

As for AMS, generally speaking, because LRMs are so heavily boated, if you're getting hit by LRMs and can't get under cover, you're dead whether you have AMS or not.

[FLG 01]

Simple: Strikes and Cool Shots. I don't like them being so strong, but not liking it does not change the fact. Especially in QP when you cannot always rely on your team understanding the data provided by the UAV, much less reacting to it properly, raw damage output is often simpler and more useful.

As for AMS, it is a bit situational. I often use one or more but I would not consider them a must have item.

[CycKath]

If I'm grinding 'Mechs I'll always include UAV because even if team mates don't use it well it helps with XP gain

[LordNothing]

CycKath, on 13 May 2019 - 04:36 PM, said:

If I'm grinding 'Mechs I'll always include UAV because even if team mates don't use it well it helps with XP gain

if im grinding im going to pack strikes because damage == xp.

[justcallme A S H]

Ok so why don't people equip UAVs and AMS?

Easy... (And in no particular order).

• Hard cover stops missiles. No need for AMS if LRMs can't hit you in the first place.
  
• UAVs on a Med/Hvy/Assault usually a waste.
  
• UAV on a light, if you are a scout light, can be helpful
  
• UAVs can actually cause more issues than they solve - Often UAV goes up, Blue team see's the enemies are NASCAR(ie. Dumb Rotation) and then your OWN team starts the rotate to chase the straggler rather than turn around / firing line / easy win game
  
• Quick Play maps play out the same way - most games. Why do you need a UAV is you know when/where the enemies are going to be?
  
• Further to above point - If you see a Hvy on minimap you can bet Assaults and other Heavy mechs are within 200m of it - again no need for a UAV to tell you this (just common sense).
  
• UAVs put up by a Heavy/Assault actually gives away your position. I am consatantly keeping an eye-on-the-sky. If I see a UAV up and I know where the light mechs are - I now know the bulk of the enemies are near/around the UAV.
  
• Strikes. You can drop Strikes in UAVs. Thus if enemies have a UAV about the bulk of them (friendly or foe), you can drop strike on it and put your team at a huge tactical advantage based on armour.
  
• The Big One - Consumables cost cbills. Levelling mechs now costs cbills and funding is definately an issue for many players. Quickest way to hurt your cbills? Consumables.

Now I'm not saying UAVs are bad. They are just limited in usefulness in a lot of games. Added to the fact a lot of light pilots do not understand HOW to play lights and do not put UAVs in strategically important places on maps. They just throw one up any old spot that does more to hinder a team than help it.

So yeah UAVs on anything other than a fast light / medium (Fast being over 95km/h)... Is a lot of the time not useful enough to be equipped.

[FRAGTAST1C]

I carry UAVs and Coolshots on mechs with a brawling loadout (Kraken with AC20 + MRM 60; Orion IIC A (C) with LBX20 + 4 SRM6+A; Dire Wolf with 2 UAC10s + UAC20 + LBX20, etc.,) and on scout mechs like Javelin, Cipher and Paralyser. On everything else like Dakka or Laser Vomit, I carry Arty-Strikes and Coolshots. Why so? 'Cause I want to know whether it's ok to push into the enemy or not when Brawling and when being at around 400m+ distance, I'd rather keep shooting and maintaining that distance to the enemies.

AMS on the other hand I use on most mechs that I have.

[Flyby215]

justcallme A S H, on 13 May 2019 - 04:43 PM, said:

• UAVs can actually cause more issues than they solve - Often UAV goes up, Blue team see's the enemies are NASCAR(ie. Dumb Rotation) and then your OWN team starts the rotate to chase the straggler rather than turn around / firing line / easy win game
  
• Quick Play maps play out the same way - most games. Why do you need a UAV is you know when/where the enemies are going to be?
  
• Further to above point - If you see a Hvy on minimap you can bet Assaults and other Heavy mechs are within 200m of it - again no need for a UAV to tell you this (just common sense).
  
• UAVs put up by a Heavy/Assault actually gives away your position. I am consatantly keeping an eye-on-the-sky. If I see a UAV up and I know where the light mechs are - I now know the bulk of the enemies are near/around the UAV.
  
• Strikes. You can drop Strikes in UAVs. Thus if enemies have a UAV about the bulk of them (friendly or foe), you can drop strike on it and put your team at a huge tactical advantage based on armour.

Point 1: Now that's mastermind level thinking right there. I just figure the more mechs people see on their minimap the more situational awareness is improved. Never even thought about how there might be better ways to manipulate PUGs
2-3. Agreed.
4. This is probably why I get beat up so badly squaring off against top level players but then get high scores myself when no one else is around
5. I've never been able to get this to work! Is there a trick to landing a strike on the UAV? I thought if I just line up on it like I'm going to hit with a laser or something but it doesn't drop on the UAV...

[Marquis De Lafayette]

JediPanther, on 13 May 2019 - 01:39 PM, said:

I agree with only half of this. Those in the far back are usually too far away that a uav from them is wasted both their c-bills and little to zero use to their team mates grid(s) away. I find uavs to be extremely useful on my own lrm boats as I tend to be 300m or so from the closest ally at worst of times. The second line active lrm boaters who do try and get their own los locks are the ones able to make bank off uavs.

They make great distress signals when a mech is being wolf packed as well as a huge here-they-are sign on the mini map. Pugs that must see red boxes become trigger happy when you get 3-4 enemy mechs under ecm and spam team/lance chat with things like &quot;uav up bombs away.&quot; I advocate narc over tag use as narc doesn't require you to &quot;stare down&quot; an enemy.

I said “many” because those who use lrms to their best (which I am not really a fan of lrms for the most part) do so from near the front and I would expect those guys to bring uav’s and make good use of them. So we don’t disagree after all....lol

Edited by Marquis De Lafayette, 13 May 2019 - 09:18 PM.