108 replies to this topic

[Armored Yokai]

While I am not pleased with the Epic exclusivity and the December delay, I do have an interest in what Russ hopes to accomplish.


In the EGSE FAQ
he says

• Partnering with Epic gave us the ability to delay our release to early December so that we could make the quality of game we desired as well as the financial footing to make sure MechWarrior 5: Mercenaries could be properly localized with a significant marketing effort.

I hope he plans to hire coders to improve the quality of gameplay and story. I really hope he isn't spending that money to only improve the quality of his life. This is the last chance for Mechwarrior to come out with a big bang.

[valrond]

I'm going to play devil's advocate here. I'm really mad, cause in my case, it's the 2nd time in a row that they have pissed a beloved niche franchise funded by backers (the other one being Shenmue, which I am a backer). But there is at least decency and honesty in PGI, here is why:
- They have said they have gone to the Epic sotre for the money. Not in those words, but more or less. They need more money to make a better game, so at least they are sincere there instead of the bs that Deep Silver tried to push on us saying it was the better store.
-They have offered full refunds, letting us keep all MWO stuff, no questions asked, for a bit over a month.

Now, games are expensive, very expensive, and making better games costs a lot of money, specially those with great graphics like MW5 is supposed to be. Also, MW5 runs on Unreal Engine, so they save money there too. If they are really using that money for a better game and not just to fill their pockets, then it isn't such a bad move, I can understand it, even if I hate it. So I'll hold my refund for a few days at least.

[Dr Hobo]

valrond, on 25 July 2019 - 01:43 PM, said:

I'm going to play devil's advocate here. I'm really mad, cause in my case, it's the 2nd time in a row that they have pissed a beloved niche franchise funded by backers (the other one being Shenmue, which I am a backer). But there is at least decency and honesty in PGI, here is why:
- They have said they have gone to the Epic sotre for the money. Not in those words, but more or less. They need more money to make a better game, so at least they are sincere there instead of the bs that Deep Silver tried to push on us saying it was the better store.
-They have offered full refunds, letting us keep all MWO stuff, no questions asked, for a bit over a month.

Now, games are expensive, very expensive, and making better games costs a lot of money, specially those with great graphics like MW5 is supposed to be. Also, MW5 runs on Unreal Engine, so they save money there too. If they are really using that money for a better game and not just to fill their pockets, then it isn't such a bad move, I can understand it, even if I hate it. So I'll hold my refund for a few days at least.

Normally I'd agree. But this is PGI we're talking about here.

They had many more routes to take,but they again,chose the quick,and the easy path.

It doesnt help that in the MWO communities they have burned bridges time and time again.

Hold no faith that MW5 will be good. It will be minimally viable just like MWO was.

[Thorqemada]

MWO is not making money anymore, development is expensive, MW5 is a big Project for PGI, they are one of the Raytracing Games NVidia mentioned available soon ™ (dont know if they still are), they probably bit more they can chew in time, so massive delays, Money gone, EPIC Fail happens...thats the whole Story, struggle to survive, there is nothing else...

[VonBruinwald]

Benefits of moving to Epic...

• More money for PGI to "develop the game".
  
• It increase competition in the market place. Competition is good for the consumer.

[MechaBattler]

Straight up cash money.
Unreal 4 royalties waved.
Greater exposure on Epic.
Possibly help with advertising?
And a bigger split of the revenue.

That's all a benefit to them. But as to how it translates to a better game? That's entirely up to PGI.

[Wing 0]

They wanted to be china's milk drinkers by going Tim Sweeny at Epic Fail Store. They stabbed a Community in the back. Now were stabbing PGI back for allowing epic's tortious interference.

[Dr Hobo]

MechaBattler, on 25 July 2019 - 02:25 PM, said:

Straight up cash money.
Unreal 4 royalties waved.
Greater exposure on Epic.
Possibly help with advertising?
And a bigger split of the revenue.

That's all a benefit to them. But as to how it translates to a better game? That's entirely up to PGI.

Greater exposure on Epic?

I dunno,their storefront barely works.

[Wing 0]

Dr Hobo, on 25 July 2019 - 02:31 PM, said:

Greater exposure on Epic?

I dunno,their storefront barely works.

Greater exposure my ***. Steam has better exposure than Epic Fail Store.

[VonBruinwald]

Wing 0, on 25 July 2019 - 02:30 PM, said:

They stabbed a Community in the back. Now were stabbing PGI back for allowing epic's tortious interference.

How exactly are you stabbing them back? If you cancel your pre-order all you're really doing is turning your back on them.

[Marauder3D]

Wing 0, on 25 July 2019 - 02:30 PM, said:

Now were stabbing PGI back for allowing epic's tortious interference.

You're giving me law school flashbacks. Also, hyberbole much?

[Ilfi]

Epic bribes off another game to trick people into their half-baked marketplace, and will be footing the bill on all the refunds. Piggy does the bare minimum to ship a minimally viable product (again), and once the year is up they drop support for both games and make off like bandits. This is not a new strategy.

[Nightbird]

The only benefit EPIC exclusivity brings is that Russ's wallet just got a lot heavier

P.S. don't use the EPIC launcher, it's spyware and will send your private info overseas

[Wing 0]

VonBruinwald, on 25 July 2019 - 02:34 PM, said:

How exactly are you stabbing them back? If you cancel your pre-order all you're really doing is turning your back on them.

You dont seem to understand. They turned their backs on us when they signed that deal with Epic Fail Store. Most people pre-ordered the game assuming back in the previous FAQs that we would have a "choice". I mentioned concerns about the fiasco that Tim Sweeny and Epic Fail Store was having back in April and nobody understood at that time.

https://mwomercs.com...89#entry6245489


You look at what happened to those poor sods who kick started for Shenmue 3 to go on steam and they got stabbed in the back.



Did you really think that many of us wanted something like this for Mw5? HELL NO. PGI knew they were crossing a line they shouldn't have crossed and they turned their backs on us. so Ya. PGI has abandoned this community and customers. do your research and you will understand as to why there is hate for Tim Sweeny and the Epic Fail Store.

[VonBruinwald]

Nightbird, on 25 July 2019 - 02:47 PM, said:

P.S. don't use the EPIC launcher, it's spyware and will send your private info overseas

You know steam does the exact same thing. Overseas is subjective to where their data harvesters are located.

Wing 0, on 25 July 2019 - 02:49 PM, said:

You dont seem to understand. They turned their backs on us when they signed that deal with Epic Fail Store. Most people pre-ordered the game assuming back in the previous FAQs that we would have a "choice". I mentioned concerns about the fiasco that Tim Sweeny and Epic Fail Store was having back in April and nobody understood at that time.

https://mwomercs.com...89#entry6245489


You look at what happened to those poor sods who kick started for Shenmue 3 to go on steam and they got stabbed in the back.

Did you really think that many of us wanted something like this for Mw5? HELL NO. PGI knew they were crossing a line they shouldn't have crossed and they turned their backs on us. so Ya. PGI has abandoned this community and customers. do your research and you will understand as to why there is hate for Tim Sweeny and the Epic Fail Store.

I get the hate, don't mistake me. I was asking how you're "stabbing them back", the cost of the pre-orders are covered. Stabbing them back implies you're actively doing something that will negatively affect them.

[Humpday]

Apologize for the ignorance, but whats the big deal with the whole Epic game exclusivity thing these days? Not just MWO, even Boarderlands 3 folks are making a stink.

Whats the tldr about it? I mean, its just another steam clone, and store front no? Real question btw.

EDIT: if anything its good for PGI since Epic games reportedly lets the developers keep more share of earning. Everyone wins, other than us, we just have to install a new launcher, but...meh, whatever.

Edited by Humpday, 25 July 2019 - 03:22 PM.

[Y E O N N E]

VonBruinwald, on 25 July 2019 - 02:23 PM, said:

Benefits of moving to Epic...

• More money for PGI to "develop the game".
  
• It increase competition in the market place. Competition is good for the consumer.

The benefit of competition is that it lowers prices. EGS existing has had zero effect on the price of games to you, the consumer. What it has done is silo games into one platform or another, which is anti-competitive. To salt this wound, EGS as a service is completely deficient compared to literally every other service including Steam, Origin, and uPlay.

Electronic distribution services are not game consoles.

[Khobai]

steam takes 30% which is completely outrageous. and PGI would still have to give 5% to epic for unreal engine royalties on top of the 30% to steam. for a total of 35%.

epic takes 12% and waives the 5% royalty they would normally charge.

35% vs 12%... its a no brainer which PGI would choose. what sane company would give up 23% of their profit margin?

if you wanna blame anyone blame steam for ripping game developers off. or blame yourself for thinking MW5 was ever going to be a good game in the first place or that PGI wouldnt lie when they have a history of lying repeatedly lololol.

Y E O N N E, on 25 July 2019 - 03:32 PM, said:

The benefit of competition is that it lowers prices. EGS existing has had zero effect on the price of games to you, the consumer.

The problem is steam not EGS. Steam is the one charging the outrageously high fees that everyone agrees are completely excessive for the service provided by Valve. Steams outrageous fees are what set the baseline price of games so high.

and EGS is absolutely competition for steam. The same way that netflix is competition for amazon or hulu because of their exclusive shows that you can only watch on those streaming services.

competition has become more than just whoever has the lowest prices. for distribution services, competition has become a war to monopolize intellectual properties through exclusivity contracts. Although I definitely think a strong case could be made that exclusivity contracts are monopolies and violate trade laws by not allowing fair competition.

Edited by Khobai, 25 July 2019 - 04:15 PM.

[MischiefSC]

GOD ******* DAMN IT.

I have tried, 3 times, to give Epic the benefit of the doubt. My wife and I have both gotten games there.

One of which my wife has never actually gotten to work. The week it took to get back and give her the activation code to get the game working still hasn't translated into her getting the game working.

I've tried to do 2 games there as well. Both were extremely problematic.

I DO NOT WANT TO REFUND MW5. I WANT TO GIVE PGI MY MONEY.

However I'm just not sure how to deal with this circumstance. EGS is a bad product. There's no other way to juggle or alter that conclusion. I have close to 100 friends I speak to in Discord across a variety of games and literally nobody I know, at any point, likes EGS or has good things to say about it. A couple say 'It's not that bad, at least it worked for me'.

Will chew this over. I get PGI wanting, needing the money. I get all the circumstances around it. Maybe I need to refund and come back in a year, but if I do I want to be clear - no way I'm paying full price.

I bought the biggest package. Whatever complaints I've had with PGI I absolutely can NOT say that MWO didn't entertain me for thousands and thousands of hours and that there's a lot of great stuff about the game I enjoy.

EGS though has been a bad experience for me and my wife, and all of my friends who've used it. I don't know how else to put this - it's not a knee-jerk reaction or response to stuff people are saying, I mean that I've used EGS and have a 0% success rate with it just installing and launching games without a ton of work and a 60% success rate with it even launching the game at any point at all. Support has been bad, clearly overworked. The people I know who've used it have had comparable experiences.

Ugh. Just... crappy news. The reality is that if I have to go through refunding the MW5 package I have 0 expectation of getting it at Steam release. Maybe a humble bundle sale or the like. That's effectively saying that I'm just moving away from the game as something I'm going to play and investing my time and money elsewhere.

God damn it PGI. Why do you keep making it so hard for me to invest in you as a fan and a consumer?

[Y E O N N E]

Khobai, on 25 July 2019 - 03:32 PM, said:

uh steam takes 30% which is completely outrageous

epic takes 12% and takes their 5% royalties for using unreal engine out of the 12%.

its a no brainer which PGI would choose.

if you wanna blame anyone blame steam for ripping game developers off.

Steam actually provides a whole host of services which Epic does not.

As a consumer, EGS gives me nothing. I see no reason to ever buy anything from EGS, helped along by the fact that most games today are terrible anyway and there's plenty of terrible games to try outside of EGS.