33 replies to this topic

[Nesutizale]

I don't have the dates in my head anymore but was the overlapping of steam key sales and the epic deal about a month, maybe less?

[Grimm Shado]

IIRC Epic deal was finalized very late April, like April 26th or so. Community edition preorder ended 4/30.

[Nesutizale]

So people get upset about days of overlap? I could understand month but days...
I agree on the point that PGI should have made a mailing for all preorders to inform costumers of the change but rumbling about days of where it was wrong on the website is nitpicking.

Also Russ has said before that they where trying to talk to ALL stores so he didn't lied to us about that. I have the feeling people are just hateing Epic and projecting that on PGI because .... I don't know.

PGI has made some strange decissions over the years, promises where not keept but still I played and bought stuff for MWO and I had still fun with it where I dropped a lot of other games I had bought and never returned to but went back to play MWO after I was done with them. So even with all the stuff gone wrong PGI still did more right to keep me entertained.

[Koniving]

Random question; are we shoving these into the battletech thread on purpose or is a mod doing it?

The reason I ask is there's a lot of duplicate threads in the main general channel but it says they have no reply and link right back to the copy in battletech discussion..

So if they're being moved, someone's doing a sloppy job.

(Mod as in moderator to avoid confusion)

[Bombast]

Koniving, on 05 August 2019 - 12:11 PM, said:

Random question; are we shoving these into the battletech thread on purpose or is a mod doing it?

The reason I ask is there's a lot of duplicate threads in the main general channel but it says they have no reply and link right back to the copy in battletech discussion..

So if they're being moved, someone's doing a sloppy job.

The mods are doing it, and that's not sloppy, it's just how the forum works. The "Duplicate" in general is there to let people get directed to the new location so they can continue posting. The duplicate wont get "bumped" though, eventually disappearing, leaving the new location as the place to be.

They're moving everything here to be out of site, out of mind. People don't really come to this subforum, so they wont see the people being upset (In theory).

[Nesutizale]

General chat is for MWO topics only so they move the topics to Battletech, cause they haven't build in an MW5 section yet.

[Grimm Shado]

Moving the topics makes sense to me.
Subheader under general discussion says "For constructive general discussion of MechWarrior® Online™". MechWarrior 5 going Epic exclusive is not about MWO, so it goes to Battletech sub-forum. Moving the topcs keeps general discussion focused as the place for MWO conversations.
I already went to Battletech subforum a lot, before this kerfluffle, because I'm interested in MW5 and the MW5 main site has no forum yet.

[MischiefSC]

Nightbird, on 05 August 2019 - 08:36 AM, said:

Um unless, they pre-ordered the Steam version and didn't like the bait and switch to what you admit is an inferior client?

So unless there's features in Steam they're expecting to need to play MW5 and if MW5 was originally promised as being sold directly through PGI (so for example if it was just going to be like MWO and not a steam exclusive version) I'd say my original point still stands.

Given that I can download a game through Epic, then register the game into Steam and literally launch it through Steam though I'd say that point is... iffy.

Most the time the 'I ordered a Steam key' argument is really just a 'Hating Epic because... well, people hate Epic and hating Epic feels very righteous and cool' sort of argument.

Exclusives are bad and Epic sucks for pushing exclusives, especially for online-only games. The Epic client is fundamentally inferior than the Steam client - however for a single-player game you don't need it and can in fact add the game to your Steam games list.

I don't care if someone refunds or not and I've never told anyone 'don't refund'. However I have a lot of contempt for decisions made out of ignorance and that happens a lot on the interwebs. It was an insignificant amount of effort to fact-check stuff myself.

I will say though the argument of 'Steam took 15 years to get all these features! Epic is brand new and will take time!' is just as stupid. Okay, the Model T came out in 1908 but air conditioning wasn't a standard feature in most cars until the 40s at least, it stopped being a luxury feature in the 80s. That doesn't mean a new car manufacturer isn't expected to have AC standard in their cars because Ford took 70 years to make that standard. The features Steam has can be considered mostly standard for any comparable, competitive game launcher. Epic doesn't have those and has been working on the launcher itself for over 2 years. The Epic launcher has 0 reasons to use it. It provides 0 benefit to the consumer.

THAT is part of why the exclusives suck. Epic says 'Netflix and Hulu have exclusives too!' yes, they also provide a comparable experience and features. If Hulu paid more to get exclusive shows but then the Hulu interface was just a block of text, no lists or sorting or personalization, it didn't track where you paused or stopped watching at or anything - was just a bare bones text based list of shows you had to fight with to watch then yeah. It'd be a comparable example.

However most the people posting in these threads aren't talking about that sort of thing. They're arguing that Epic is a shill for TenCent, that the EGL is malware or close to it and that they only bought MW5 because it was being sold through Steam. Most of that is either flat out false or pretty iffy. However people get to make their own decisions, good or bad. I just don't think it's unreasonable to call people out on ******** though.

It's fair to hate Epic - just most people haven't even bothered to put the effort into figuring out why. They just hear that other people are doing it and so feel justified in some righteous outrage over something they don't understand and probably are not impacted by.

[Robinson Crusher]

Thanks for all the feedback guys. Much appreciated.

MischiefSC, on 06 August 2019 - 02:00 PM, said:

Given that I can download a game through Epic, then register the game into Steam and literally launch it through Steam though I'd say that point is... iffy.

This point seems interesting. Can I download the Epic launcher, register on Steam, and then remove the Epic launcher from my disk... or can I just remove the Epic launcher after downloading and have it still run? Sorry, but I'm a total newbie for this sort of thing. Most of my games are still on DVD or CD.

Yes, I'm old...

[Bombast]

Robinson Crusher, on 07 August 2019 - 12:10 AM, said:

This point seems interesting. Can I download the Epic launcher, register on Steam, and then remove the Epic launcher from my disk... or can I just remove the Epic launcher after downloading and have it still run? Sorry, but I'm a total newbie for this sort of thing. Most of my games are still on DVD or CD.

Yes, I'm old...

Russ says that the Epic Launcher wont be necessary for game boot. Take that for what you will.

As for completely deleting the Epic Launcher... that seems to largely depend on a) how the game manages multiplayer and how the game manages game updates.

[Nesutizale]

If its like its with most launchers you can often run the games without the launcher BUT you need it for updates and multiplayer. That is in one part a copy protection and, for example with lots of steam games an anti-cheater protection. Makeing sure that all players have an unaltered version running.

As said that is how its often is, dosn't mean that its the case for MW5 until we either get confirmation on it.
Russ only said he dosn't see a problem why it shouldn't run without the launcher. The MechCon Demo was also running without a launcher. Just an exe file you need to start and the current build is the same.
Still we have 3 month of development and a new publisher at hand that might want to make sure that exclusive means exclusive. So one should make sure to listen in to the next AMA, whenever that is or if there are new regarding that on the websites FAQ.

[Koniving]

Nesutizale, on 05 August 2019 - 11:39 AM, said:

So people get upset about days of overlap? I could understand month but days...

The deal was finalized on the 28th. (All the details, the legal mumble jumble, the contract, the review of the contract, the edits and negotiation of the contract, etc.)

It was first mentioned in a very passing comment in the first week of April.

And then most of us normal folk whom preordered whom didn't hear about the passing comment buried in an hour of "Um" and "Uh" and "feature" and "still working that idea out" "we might come to that idea" "No, you definitely won't see that because it doesn't fit within the universe." "We didn't rescale the mechs, we just scaled the world better." and "Will there be heroes? Well.. I think you'll like the answer, but I'm not gonna answer it just yet." Suddenly its August, a month before the game is supposed to release, "We're doing an Epic exclusive deal so all you people waiting for it on steam next month, you'll see it in a year!"

[LordNothing]

i think they need to stop letting russ micromanage the pr department. epic would have been an easier pill to swallow if pgi would have just said something like "the release platform has yet to be determined". im no fan of steam either, i have maybe 2 games on there. i dont like the way games are released at all in the post disc era. id rather they ship me a usb key with the game on it. but what you gonna do about it? nuke the internet?

Edited by LordNothing, 16 August 2019 - 12:56 PM.

[C E Dwyer]

Well I'm not refunding over a launcher I can delete once the games on my drives, and in a years time I can add to steam if I so desire