448 replies to this topic

[YueFei]

OZHomerOZ, on 16 August 2019 - 12:52 PM, said:

Focus fire > armour sharing > Dieing

If a team mate gets narced on Polar, can you share armor?

Maybe focus fire the narcer is better?

Yes you can still armor share, interpose yourself between the incoming LRMs and the teammate that got NARC'd.

That's not hypothetical, I've done it before.

OZHomerOZ, on 16 August 2019 - 12:52 PM, said:

You can focus fire without calls as well
Shoot what your team mate shot

By the time you react to shoot at what your teammate shot at, the target could already be shielding and sliding back into cover. Not to mention that the target might be positioned in such a way that it denies you a shot unless you maneuver in a way that hideously exposes you to return focus fire.

Think about it this way: are you gonna expose yourself "wide" to multiple lanes, wait for a teammate to hit a target, and then hit that same target? Or are you gonna expose yourself "long", and hit whatever targets present themselves in your lane?

Focus-fire doesn't negate armor-sharing. If anything, it makes armor-sharing more important.

[General Solo]

YueFei, on 16 August 2019 - 06:13 PM, said:

Yes you can still armor share, interpose yourself between the incoming LRMs and the teammate that got NARC'd.

That's not hypothetical, I've done it before.

Well yes maybe you can, but is it wise? I still think shooting the narc dude is a much much better thing to do compared to jumping in front of a narced team mate being shot by a lance of Supernova A's
BTW Did u survive your valiant Armour sharing?
Edit: Were you sharing armour or ECM?

YueFei, on 16 August 2019 - 06:13 PM, said:

By the time you react to shoot at what your teammate shot at, the target could already be shielding and sliding back into cover.

Yeah but even if shielded (torso twisting I'm guessing you mean that), a hit still reduces their pool of available armour.
They can't shield all day eventually they going to run out of shield.

YueFei, on 16 August 2019 - 06:13 PM, said:

Not to mention that the target might be positioned in such a way that it denies you a shot unless you maneuver in a way that hideously exposes you to return focus fire.

Think about it this way: are you gonna expose yourself "wide" to multiple lanes, wait for a teammate to hit a target, and then hit that same target? Or are you gonna expose yourself "long", and hit whatever targets present themselves in your lane?

Focus-fire doesn't negate armor-sharing. If anything, it makes armor-sharing more important.

All true, but done correctly, exposing a minimum of your mech and since your adding your fire to a mech that another team mate just shot.
That same team mate has already provided you with a distraction needed for a good trade.

As for fast reflexes required, I find its more about practice and body memory. Doh may be I got fast reflexes for an old guy.

Edit: IMO, Focus fire is King, sharing armour has its place I agree, I just think Focus fire is more important is all.

Edit: Spellingz, there to their

Edited by OZHomerOZ, 16 August 2019 - 07:03 PM.

[Wil McCullough]

Mystere, on 16 August 2019 - 04:39 PM, said:

Sigh! It is there in plain sight on page 1.

Clear enough?

which has nothing to do with the op's original argument that armor pooling isn't important and other people's responses that it is. i am also still quite unclear why you went on to demand for statistical evidence on how armor pooling is more important than concentration of fire. such a weird reaction.

you're starting to resemble this vegan dude i know who used to randomly start sharing tofu recipes at a barbecue and then get mad when the topic of animal cruelty doesn't come up in conversation.

like, what are you even here for lol.

once again, let me ask you - are you trying to hijack the topic into discussing the merits of focus fire or something? or are you circling into a point you're trying to make?

[Mystere]

Wil McCullough, on 17 August 2019 - 08:26 AM, said:

which has nothing to do with the op's original argument that armor pooling isn't important and other people's responses that it is. i am also still quite unclear why you went on to demand for statistical evidence on how armor pooling is more important than concentration of fire. such a weird reaction.

you're starting to resemble this vegan dude i know who used to randomly start sharing tofu recipes at a barbecue and then get mad when the topic of animal cruelty doesn't come up in conversation.

like, what are you even here for lol.

once again, let me ask you - are you trying to hijack the topic into discussing the merits of focus fire or something? or are you circling into a point you're trying to make?

If after these words -- again -- you still do not get it, then there is no hope for you:

Quote

You win the game by doing whatever it takes to win. Period

Others already figured it out. You, on the other hand, got distracted, and like a puppy chasing its tail at that .. or a cat with catnip. Take your pick.

And, oh, I love meat, especially the grilled kind!

Finally, I am here for the comedy, among other things of course. It's surprisingly less sanitized that what you now see on TV. As such, I am staying, like it or not.

Y E O N N E, on 08 August 2019 - 07:19 PM, said:

What you are hoping to achieve, here, is to see if you can sucker somebody into sinking a disproportionate amount of time ...

Guess what? I just realized that, intentionally or not, it happened anyway.

Edited by Mystere, 17 August 2019 - 01:22 PM.

[Prototelis]

Y'all arguing with someone that doesn't play the game; who when they did play was bad at it anyways.

Edited by Prototelis, 17 August 2019 - 02:18 PM.

[Tiantara]

- Most useless thing - sharing armor of mech which bring over 78damage power and loose components and weapon only for small mech with 8-20 firepower survive a 2 seconds longer and bring whole 40 points of damage. Same not-smart tactic as "nascaaar" where all mech with high alpha die without support and protection and all fast and weaponless mech just run over the map as they want. Even more great way to "win" - leave behind longrange pinpoint mech behind without protection or forcing them to take close combat. Close. Combat. For longrange mech with slow cooldown. Very smart indeed. Share your armor they said, in same time making 100 damage for whole game. Yeap... I prefer use comfortable range and take my average 600-890dmg. What? Play as brawler? Ok... but when I cut trough enemy on my beloved Atlas, Kodiak, Corsair or any other 100-90t mech, please come along and shoot enemies. Not stay behind or even worse - shoot in my back.
- And I don't even mentioned weak points of every mech, which everyone need to know:
1. XL engine, one side of torso down, mech down.
2. C-XL engine, one side of torso down, mech become slower and hotter.
3. Asymmetric weapon build, one side of torso down, mech loose 3\4 of weapon and ammo.
4. Arm Ammo pack. Arm ripped - mech died because blow of ammo from it = 70% chance to kill side torso or even engine.
5. Leg Ammo - same as arm and in same time slower mech.
6. If you sharp shooter - head. Headshot kill any mech no matter how many weapons or amore it have.

Sharing armor in that condition? Insane.

Edited by Tiantara, 17 August 2019 - 10:07 PM.

[Y E O N N E]

You are, factually, not averaging 600-890 damage. Not even close. Not unless you are also negating all of it with massive team damage every game.

[Prototelis]

Tiantara, on 17 August 2019 - 10:02 PM, said:

take my average 600-890dmg.

lul

[Tiantara]

Y E O N N E, on 17 August 2019 - 10:07 PM, said:

You are, factually, not averaging 600-890 damage. Not even close. Not unless you are also negating all of it with massive team damage every game.

- Why so? Proper weapon, proper tactic. I don't want share my armor for nothing, when I can deliver damage, and team in same time - not.

[Y E O N N E]

Because an average lifetime match score of 189 means you are not coming anywhere close to doing 600+ damage every match. You would be at least in the 300s range if you were.

[Tiantara]

Spoiler

- It can be less but... when play go good - why not. Aha, when team steam rolled by enemy I don't get high score. If team prefer loose - I don't get it ether. If team use same strategy no matter how changes situation in battlefield - I get less points also. It depend on luck more than on skill. But if all go nice - all nice.

Edited by Tiantara, 17 August 2019 - 10:27 PM.

[Prototelis]

Grats on that one good match.

[Tiantara]

Prototelis, on 17 August 2019 - 10:26 PM, said:

Grats on that one good match.

- Thanks. But that not only one. If team try deliver damage - it wins. If team share armor of mech with bigger damage power of all team - it have defeat. That all. If on HPG team go with count like 4 : 7 and not moving to basement - it have defeat also. If mech go down - team wins by damaging enemy who go down sometimes with open back. If team uses longrange and give it 1-2 mech for protection - it wins. If trough longrange mech to close combat only for armor sharing - all dies.
It depends. Depends on mech I use (some mech just have not enough weapon to bring great damage), depends on builds (some risky but I love them), depends on team (smart, event oriented, or greenpilots), depends on maps (some just nice for any mech, some worst for specific builds. Like - open for brawler, hot for hot builds and so on).

[Horseman]

OmniFail, on 08 August 2019 - 10:20 PM, said:

Yes you win by getting good trades because this facilitates the destroy enemy mechs win condition. Sharing armor is not a win condition and doing it dose not drive wins. Only fulfilling win conditions drives wins.

OmniFail, on 08 August 2019 - 11:20 PM, said:

I am not trying to justify or defend hiding. Go find the part of my first post that infers that I am. If by trolling you mean that I am trying to falsify that armor use drives wins, then yes sir I am.

In your scenario the assaults’ teammates are focusing fire and trying to fulfill the destroy enemy mechs win condition. They are driving wins. The enemy mechs are focusing fire on the friendly assault. They are trying to fulfill the destroy enemy mech win condition. They too, are driving wins.

The assault is using his armor. He is not driving wins. He is dying, because the enemy is focusing him down. Your team has lost valuable firepower. Your team will not be as effective at destroying enemy mechs. Your teams’ chances of winning are diminished.

So insightful yet so unable to grasp the blindingly obvious.
Firepower drives wins, yes. Do one-shot wonders who die after shooting twice drive wins? NO.
Keeping as much of your team's firepower on the field - and ****ing up the enemy - for as long as possible drives wins.
From there it's an obvious conclusion that losing mechs unnecessarily gives the enemy team an advantage in firepower and drives losses.
When do you lose mechs unnecessarily? If you let the enemy focus them.
What does sharing armor achieve? It makes harder for the enemy to focus individual mechs on your side.
You keep your ****ing firepower on the field for longer.

OmniFail, on 09 August 2019 - 10:08 AM, said:

I have not said anything that supports sacrificing mechs.

You have, by claiming that sharing armor and rotating damaged mechs to the back doesn't drive wins. I have the quotes above in this post.

[Horseman]

Tiantara, on 17 August 2019 - 10:23 PM, said:

- It can be less but... when play go good - why not. Aha, when team steam rolled by enemy I don't get high score. If team prefer loose - I don't get it ether. If team use same strategy no matter how changes situation in battlefield - I get less points also. It depend on luck more than on skill. But if all go nice - all nice.

You are the one who made the claim that you score 600+ damage on average. Your public stats do not bear it out.
https://leaderboard.....php?u=Tiantara
Multiply your average lifetime score by 2. Due to how the scoring system works, your average damage will be below that.

Edited by Horseman, 17 August 2019 - 10:46 PM.

[Tiantara]

Horseman, on 17 August 2019 - 10:46 PM, said:

You are the one who made the claim that you score 600+ damage on average. Your public stats do not bear it out.
https://leaderboard.....php?u=Tiantara
Multiply your average lifetime score by 2. Due to how the scoring system works, your average damage will be below that.

- It's count all gamemodes? And where earlier years? And yes, when all depends on me - it's average. When nothing depends on me - not. Like using mech on map which not good for that mech or playing with builds or weak mech just for fun. Public stats don't count many things. If I play only on mech which best for me - average damage will go up to 600+ (like when event come and I need high score and high damage) If I play for fun on mech on which I not good - score go down. Or on new bought mech which I don't know.

[TheArisen]

Tiantara, on 17 August 2019 - 11:00 PM, said:

- It's count all gamemodes? And where earlier years? And yes, when all depends on me - it's average. When nothing depends on me - not. Like using mech on map which not good for that mech or playing with builds or weak mech just for fun. Public stats don't count many things. If I play only on mech which best for me - average damage will go up to 600+ (like when event come and I need high score and high damage) If I play for fun on mech on which I not good - score go down. Or on new bought mech which I don't know.

Look, to be frank, you need to re-evaluate yourself and ask some other players here how to win, etc. All of your excuses are applicable to everyone else and yet they win more games, average more dmg, etc. There are some pretty decent players here so asking them for tips can be quite beneficial.

[Tiantara]

TheArisen, on 17 August 2019 - 11:08 PM, said:

Look, to be frank, you need to re-evaluate yourself and ask some other players here how to win, etc. All of your excuses are applicable to everyone else and yet they win more games, average more dmg, etc. There are some pretty decent players here so asking them for tips can be quite beneficial.

- Hm, why? I'm comfortable in my tier2, I love play with mech with non-meta builds mostly for fun not for hardcore. When need - I choose my powered mech and grind my damage score (damage score, not match score). My prefers - heavy and assault. Why push to way where game become work and give no happiness?
Not to mentioned that most of tips based on group play, not random team where half of the tips won't work.

Edited by Tiantara, 17 August 2019 - 11:17 PM.

[Feral Clown]

TheArisen, on 17 August 2019 - 11:08 PM, said:

Look, to be frank, you need to re-evaluate yourself and ask some other players here how to win, etc. All of your excuses are applicable to everyone else and yet they win more games, average more dmg, etc. There are some pretty decent players here so asking them for tips can be quite beneficial.

Actually I think he should start with learning what the word average means.

[Tiantara]

Feral Clown, on 17 August 2019 - 11:15 PM, said:

Actually I think he should start with learning what the word average means.

- It means - usually when you get normal game and was not killed in head from the start, or get alpha in you back from team, or not getting blocked by teammate under fire, and not walk unde LRM shower, and take your part of action in right place in right time... right? In all that condition - its average. In all other - I got what I got.