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Lite Pilot Tactics 101 Alarming Trend


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#21 Horseman

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Posted 03 January 2020 - 06:42 AM

View PostLordRush, on 02 January 2020 - 02:37 PM, said:

I am alarmed by the mentality of lite pilots thinking that they can take on an Assault or even a Heavy.
1. It's spelled "light".
2. They can, just not usually face to face.
... and then therer are ******** who run around in a splat KFX or splat ADR, play them like a medium and pull heavy mech levels of damage output.

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Losing the map due to 2 enemy lites capping and our four lites staying with the lance and engaging.
Not all lights have the mobility to act as cappers.

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Lite pilots are not equipping ECM or Narc or even Bap.
1. ECM is found on 13 out of 112 light mechs in the game. 23 if you cound frankenpodding Kit Fox and Cougar.
2. NARC is a sacrifice of 10% or more tonnage that depends on the rest of the team to bring compatible weapons. In quickplay that's hot garbage, sorry.
3. Unless you're playing lock-on missiles on the same mech, BAP/CAP is effectively dead tonnage. No sane light pilot is going to install it for smilar reasons as NARC.

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1: You are a Scout.
No. Combat lights are a thing. ************* Piranhas are a thing.

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2: Your job is to move ahead of the Lance in order to provide information to the group as a whole.
This information is vital , especially to LRM "Boats" as you must remember they are not only further away from you and cannot detect as fast , they depend upon the locks to be able TO fire from a distance. Maintaining that lock almost ensures a positive enemy kill. Maintaining your distance and FOV to the target is crucial. Use walls and shielding whenever possible in order to keep locked onto your target without getting shot at.
No. Lights are not spotters for bad REMF LRMtatos. A good LRM boat runs Artemis, its' own BAP and TAG to get its' own locks and kill targets more efficiently. Next.

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3: Conquest or Assault maps that require a team to Cap bases or resources are a Lites playground. You will rack up serious points for utilizing your mech the way it should be here.
... and Domination, early into the match.

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Cap at ANY advantage you have and you should never hesitate to do so.
Wrong. Sacrificing the mech for a few seconds of cap is an utterly stupid choice to make.

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4: Engage only when you have to.
Wrong. Combat lights again.

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a: Enemy Lites are in your backfield harassing the Boats.
The LRM boats should be staying with our team's main body. A LRM boat that parks itself two grids behind is already dead and just doesn't know it.

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But not by pretending that your lite mech is something it is not by disregarding these tips.
How about we stop pretending that the roles of a light mech in MWO have anything to do with those in lore?

Edited by Horseman, 05 January 2020 - 05:12 AM.


#22 Roland09

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Posted 03 January 2020 - 11:56 AM

Gentlebeings, you may consider that OP might be all-too-well aware that light mechs can (and do!) engage heavy and assault mechs with quite reasonable chances of success. He was playing heavy mechs almost exclusively last month. Maybe he got rekt by light mechs all the time, and now he would like to dissuade light mech pilots from engaging him by publishing this mis-guide?

The 'information' in the original post would then still be completely off, but for sneaky reasons.

#23 MOBAjobg

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Posted 03 January 2020 - 03:09 PM

From what I'd gathered, LordRush does not know how to play light mech class well at all so his guidelines can't be accepted.

Based on the Jarl's list, LordRush had never exceeded 25% percentile while piloting lights and there are a few seasons, doing a poorly 2% percentile.

Edited by MOBAjobg, 03 January 2020 - 03:29 PM.


#24 Void Angel

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Posted 04 January 2020 - 02:59 AM

I'm always skeptical of conspiracy theories about grandiose plans to deceive players with fake guides - "one should never attribute to malice what can adequately be explained by..."

#25 Clydewinder

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Posted 04 January 2020 - 06:48 AM

the job of lights is to exploit their wonky hitboxes and erratic hit registration to enjoy artificially enhanced survivability.

#26 Vxheous

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Posted 04 January 2020 - 06:54 AM

View PostClydewinder, on 04 January 2020 - 06:48 AM, said:

the job of lights is to exploit their wonky hitboxes and erratic hit registration to enjoy artificially enhanced survivability.


Their hitboxes aren't wonky, they're just small, which makes really easy to spread damage apart from getting hit by PPFLD weapons like Gauss/ERPPC. If you've ever watched any Div A comp matches, you'll see light mechs getting rekted pretty easily if they aren't careful with their pathing/positioning.

#27 PhoenixFire55

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Posted 04 January 2020 - 09:21 AM

I really love threads where sub 1.0 W/L guy educates the rest of us on how this game is supposed to be played ...

Anyway, to emphasize a couple things ...

1. Scouting in this game is basically irrelevant, especially in QP, where its murderball on murderball.
2. Scouting is especially irrelevant for LRM boats, because 95% of those hide 1km behind their heavies and mediums, thus about 2-3km away from your light scouts and thus way out of range for anything.
3. Capping is a sure way to lose a match, maps are too small and a murderball with more mechs in it has plenty of time to kill and walk back to base.
4. Lights don't have the DPS of assaults and heavies and thus in order to be useful they have to engage early and keep engaging the entire match. Otherwise they are dead weight, because this game isn't about objectives. Playing for objectives is what loses you games nearly every single time.

#28 LordRush

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Posted 04 January 2020 - 12:15 PM

You know what? You are right I am a sub par player and stats don't lie. I cannot escape that,however it is also a reflection at a specific time and point. Up until reading some of the replies I had no idea what a Jarl stat was, so I decided to look at it.
What you are seeing is a total of 300 drops in 2 years. Quite frankly it's beans compared to the other 7 years of playing this game,which jarl has no account of for some reason.
With that said I have probably over 30,000 drops and does not merit the 300 registered. What is my overall? Who knows and quite frankly ...I don't care. For some reason, majority on here seem to think it is the end all when it is not.

I also would say that if ANY of you played this game at the beginning you would know that my op was full of merit. Granted, the game changed and evolved as so did the meta and so did players.
My point is, with every meta came a different way to play and you were forced to adjust,just like any other game. In the current state of the game, I can completely say that after reading what some of you constructively had to say, I agree with and will attempt to change my view point.
In some ways you can say I am still ingrained into a pattern of play that is "outdated" and I find it increasingly frustrating seeing what I found to work being crushed by the opposing minded. That is on me and again I will have to make adjustments on that.
It doesn't change the fact that my post was correct,just dated for an earlier time. That is my bad, and my ignorance showed.

I find it funny however that some of the crushing replies were also somewhat contradictory to each of your responses. I saw a number of post's that contradicted a statement from someone "who knows" with someone else who supposedly "knows". Maybe all of you should try to get on the same page as well.

I would also like to point out that this was geared towards the newer player who might not have the skill level or the confidence in running and gunning. Imho the entire "Team" mentality is lost on new players because they simply don't know what to do and are better suited staying with the group, that is until they gain the confidence to run and gun. I mean, if you are a competitive player with a new player aboard , would you really encourage this kind of play?
Personally, since this game is dying and players are less and less ,quick play is the only option for me. Hardly competitive play and there are a LOT of new players on each drop. I personally find it frustrating seeing lite pilots run and gun and get killed before any real engagement happens,and now you are down and the team suffers. Hence the op.

*note - "Lite" is a term that was used long ago on a game called Battletech:Solaris on AOL/Gamestorm. Don't jump on the bandwagon just to criticize when you obviously don't know yourself. I can at least admit I am wrong,you just look like a jack ***.

Edited by LordRush, 04 January 2020 - 12:18 PM.


#29 VigorousApathy

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Posted 04 January 2020 - 10:02 PM

View PostLordRush, on 04 January 2020 - 12:15 PM, said:

I mean, if you are a competitive player with a new player aboard , would you really encourage this kind of play?
Personally, since this game is dying and players are less and less ,quick play is the only option for me. Hardly competitive play and there are a LOT of new players on each drop. I personally find it frustrating seeing lite pilots run and gun and get killed before any real engagement happens,and now you are down and the team suffers. Hence the op.


You are describing two separate issues. The second issue, lights dying first, is simply bad play.

The first issue, would someone encourage the type of play encouraged by previous posters? Yes i would. I would rather have a light pilot using me as a meatshield in order to get quick backshots on opponents. I would rather have a light pilot who is attempting to distract my targets so i can get free trades in. The point is to use your teammates. And in the current state of the game, I would always rather have an offensive light pilot than some ******* 600m away watching me die so he can tag for lurms.

Selfish play is actually beneficial in this game (No i dont mean Primo sit in back sandbagging selfish). If you watch really good players you will notice that they do 2 essential things;

1. They dont take return fire as often as possible. (unless NSR is the plan)
2. They take full advantage of teammates to put out max damage.

This includes lights.

#30 Vxheous

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Posted 04 January 2020 - 10:15 PM

Also, lights have been able to kill mechs from the very beginning, even in beta, especially pre HSR lights that could lag shield extremely well. I remember the days of Raven 3L streak spam, or Jenners that don't get hit regged.

#31 Void Angel

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Posted 04 January 2020 - 10:45 PM

View PostVxheous, on 04 January 2020 - 10:15 PM, said:

Also, lights have been able to kill mechs from the very beginning, even in beta, especially pre HSR lights that could lag shield extremely well. I remember the days of Raven 3L streak spam, or Jenners that don't get hit regged.


I remember laughing at a Penny Arcade guide to Mechwarrior Online that mentioned not shooting at "ghosts." I'm guessing they didn't run into too many Lights.

Oh hey, it's Still Here!

Edited by Void Angel, 04 January 2020 - 10:48 PM.


#32 PhoenixFire55

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Posted 04 January 2020 - 11:07 PM

View PostLordRush, on 04 January 2020 - 12:15 PM, said:

I also would say that if ANY of you played this game at the beginning you would know that my op was full of merit.

Kinda hard to not notice a shiny founder badge near the person that posted right above this very message you've made ... and similar founders badges on some other people posting in the thread. About as hard as not to notice your team getting decimated while you stand on a cap point doing exactly nothing I guess ...

#33 Horseman

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Posted 05 January 2020 - 04:31 AM

View PostLordRush, on 04 January 2020 - 12:15 PM, said:

What you are seeing is a total of 300 drops in 2 years.
Jarl's List scrapes data from PGI's official leaderboards, which track Quick Play matches and have been going since August 2016. If you've played 10 or more Quickplay matches in any of the months between then and now, that month would appear there.

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Quite frankly it's beans compared to the other 7 years of playing this game,which jarl has no account of for some reason.
Quite frankly, now you are implicitly claiming that you have been playing MWO in 2009 or 2010 when it hasn't entered closed beta until mid-2012.

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In some ways you can say I am still ingrained into a pattern of play that is "outdated" and I find it increasingly frustrating seeing what I found to work being crushed by the opposing minded. That is on me and again I will have to make adjustments on that.
Something to think of: properly played "medium lights" (Wolfhound, K9, KFX, Adder) and even some of the more fragile ones (PIR!!!) can bring as much damage output to a match as an assault mech if they're handled correctly.

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I would also like to point out that this was geared towards the newer player who might not have the skill level or the confidence in running and gunning.
Newer players generally should focus on heavy and medium mechs, which strike a less punishing balance between survival and mobility.

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Imho the entire "Team" mentality is lost on new players because they simply don't know what to do and are better suited staying with the group,
Given that they're typically getting matched either with similar newbies or eternal terribads, so is telling them to restrict themselves into a support role. Support can be a force multiplier, yes, but in QP there are times where there just isn't a force to be multiplied.

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I personally find it frustrating seeing lite pilots run and gun and get killed before any real engagement happens,and now you are down and the team suffers. Hence the op.
I think you'll agree that "don't rush in alone and unsupported", "don't facetank with a light" and "play your light as a strictly support mech" are three different things.

Edited by Horseman, 05 January 2020 - 09:24 AM.


#34 Capt Deadpool

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Posted 10 January 2020 - 10:16 PM

OP at least had good intentions, even if he was unaware of all the things he was unaware of.

My suggestions for newer light pilots is to start with something tanky like maybe a wolfhound, watch YouTube vids of some of the better light pilots in the game to understand how to move and engage, and practice aiming: if you want to play builds with very limited firepower, you need to have better aim to remain effective.

#35 Void Angel

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Posted 11 January 2020 - 01:08 AM

The problem isn't his intentions; it's the critical weakness of his advice coupled to a total unwillingness to learn. The road to Hell is paved with good intentions.

#36 Vxheous

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Posted 11 January 2020 - 01:48 AM

View PostCapt Deadpool, on 10 January 2020 - 10:16 PM, said:

OP at least had good intentions, even if he was unaware of all the things he was unaware of.

My suggestions for newer light pilots is to start with something tanky like maybe a wolfhound, watch YouTube vids of some of the better light pilots in the game to understand how to move and engage, and practice aiming: if you want to play builds with very limited firepower, you need to have better aim to remain effective.


Classic example: https://en.wikipedia...93Kruger_effect

#37 Void Angel

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Posted 11 January 2020 - 02:05 AM

Maybe; the Dunning-Kruger study actually only measured high-performance applicants - the relationship at lower levels of proficiency may have more to do with cognitive approaches to tasks than the perspicacity to perceive skill. Then again, there may be a relationship between that approach and the acquisition of skill...

Anyway, there's a paper in there somewhere, and I can think of a lot of players I've met over the years whom I'd love to donate to science. =)

#38 Capt Deadpool

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Posted 11 January 2020 - 10:12 AM

Very true the road to hell is paved with good intentions, and it is also paved with bad intentions lol. Not defending the OP, only pitying him.

And I think we can all agree online gaming is absolutely rife with the Dunning-Kruger effect! "better than me you are a hacker or have no life, worse than me you are a potato" is the clarion call of those trapped within their egos.

Self-awareness is a rare trait amongst this silly **** (lol censor) sapien species (even, as we see, when we have a stats site the one only has to look at their stats to see if they should be arguing with anyone at all, instead of listening). There are a great deal of evolutionary reasons for this if you are interested in anthropology, all very fascinating.

Internet anonymity brings the DK effect out even more than in real life, as well; if a guy is playing bball and everyone around him is dunking and dropping dimes and hitting threes while he can barely dribble, the same person who might start a thread on the internet would never grab a podium and start lecturing new players at the playground.

With apologies to OP, who had already been piled on enough. Just make sure you learned from this thread or else the experience was useless for you. .

Edited by Capt Deadpool, 11 January 2020 - 10:30 AM.


#39 CFC Conky

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Posted 11 January 2020 - 10:37 AM

@OP,

They way I read your post, you are describing your preferred play style in light mechs rather than providing a comprehensive guide.

I'm not a very good player, with lights being my worst class. My performance in them is very inconsistent, with damage numbers running from 0-400ish. In my opinion, light mechs are opportunists. Kill, cap, scout, they can and should do it all if the opportunity presents itself.

To paraphrase the Dos Equis guy, I don't always drive light mechs but when I do, I try to be flexible.

Good hunting,
CFC Conky

#40 Horseman

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Posted 11 January 2020 - 11:10 AM

View PostCFC Conky, on 11 January 2020 - 10:37 AM, said:

I'm not a very good player, with lights being my worst class. My performance in them is very inconsistent, with damage numbers running from 0-400ish. In my opinion, light mechs are opportunists. Kill, cap, scout, they can and should do it all if the opportunity presents itself.

To paraphrase the Dos Equis guy, I don't always drive light mechs but when I do, I try to be flexible.

"Seize the advantage, any advantage" is the name of the game for any mech class. It's just the question of which ones your mech can make use of the best.





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