22 replies to this topic

[Lazy Millennial]

I accidentally dumped an artillery strike on my team mates, and was kicked out due to my cadet status. Now here's the thing, PGI: Did anyone put *any* thought *whatsoever* into this feature?

1. The kick is immediate, with no warning.
2. The message that appears is completely nonsensical. The player is informed that team damage is disabled and that after you graduate from cadet, the punishment is "more severe".
3. More severe? What? More severe than IMMEDIATELY PUTTING YOUR TEAM AT A ONE 'MECH DISADVANTAGE?

Honestly, that last part is absolutely unbelievable! What total lack of understanding of the game produces a feature that first of all cancels the damage dealt, and then immediately screws over the entire team?

Holy hell, no wonder this game is dying when gameplay mechanics like that total and complete display of idiotic, poor sighted, heavy handed and just simply unbelievably stupid example make it in.

Seriously. DID ANYONE ACTUALLY THINK ABOUT THIS for one second? Ehr mah gherd. As a game developer all I can say is if I floated an idea that penalized an entire team for a new player's mistake like that I'd just be asked to leave and go back to front end development.

[Vxheous]

This is because of a problem with certain individuals creating new accounts and teamkilling.

[FRAGTAST1C]

There are many things that were implemented 'cause there were douche-nozzles in the game with alt accounts. For e.g., locking your mech out until a match is finished in instant action. Why? 'Cause some eejit was suiciding all the time and farming whatever, EVERYONE is considered to be doing that. Hence, you have to wait until the usual stealth cameo is complete after a stomp before you can deploy in that mech again.

[Lazy Millennial]

But suuurely you would cancel the team damage as is now the case, and then just apply the punishment after the round is over *just in case* it was accidental?

[justcallme A S H]

So just log into your main account.

I mean there is no way a fresh player understands Arty strikes, let alone equipping band using... So it's not like you're not on an Alt account and don't have one spare.

[Lazy Millennial]

justcallme A S H, on 23 January 2020 - 09:15 PM, said:

So just log into your main account.

I mean there is no way a fresh player understands Arty strikes, let alone equipping band using... So it's not like you're not on an Alt account and don't have one spare.

Apparently, I don't understand them well enough to not accidentally drop one at my feet. Ignoring that for a moment though, I would love to know what was going through the mind of the person who set this up. There are just so many more sensible solutions to this such as just off the top of my head, immediately cancelling the strike or friendly fire damage and issuing a big bold warning that you will be kicked the next time.

Edited by Lazy Millennial, 23 January 2020 - 10:40 PM.

[Vxheous]

Lazy Millennial, on 23 January 2020 - 10:20 PM, said:

Apparently, I don't understand them well enough to not accidentally drop one at my feet. Ignoring that for a moment though, I would love to know what was going through the mind of the person who set this up. There are just so many more sensible solutions to this such as just off the top of my head, immediately cancelling the strike or friendly fire damage and issuing a big bold warning that you will be kicked the next time.

You talk like an alt. Even know about triple ERPPC Veagle and pros/cons.

https://mwomercs.com...ost__p__6316661

[Horseman]

Lazy Millennial, on 23 January 2020 - 09:02 PM, said:

But suuurely you would cancel the team damage as is now the case, and then just apply the punishment after the round is over *just in case* it was accidental?

The punishment is applied that way for players who got past the cadet stage (but their team damage isn't nullified).
The way PGI applies it for cadets has to do with an organized group of teamkillers who have been an issue about two years ago - PGI's moderation could not keep up with banning their many, many alt accounts.

Edited by Horseman, 24 January 2020 - 04:10 AM.

[Aidan Crenshaw]

Horseman is right, there are two different safety measures at work here. Just take it and be more cautious with your strikes next time.

[Lazy Millennial]

Horseman, on 24 January 2020 - 02:40 AM, said:

The punishment is applied that way for players who got past the cadet stage (but their team damage isn't nullified).
The way PGI applies it for cadets has to do with an organized group of teamkillers who have been an issue about two years ago - PGI's moderation could not keep up with banning their many, many alt accounts.

Oooh, I had no idea. So you are saying that passed the cadet stage enough damage also auto kicks you, and presumably the slap on the wrists you get for minor infractions (15 seconds before you can play again I think?) becomes much more severe?

[Dimento Graven]

I've never been kicked, just put in post match time out.

Usually my team damage is due to my team thinking the red smoke is a power up and trying to run through it <sigh>.

Although, as Red Foreman says:

"Not every accident... is an accident."

So a few time outs, I did deserve.

That's something new, at least I hadn't heard of it before, I guess reserved for "new" accounts in cadet/just out of cadet phase?

[Lazy Millennial]

Dimento Graven, on 24 January 2020 - 05:54 AM, said:

I've never been kicked, just put in post match time out.

Usually my team damage is due to my team thinking the red smoke is a power up and trying to run through it &lt;sigh&gt;.

Although, as Red Foreman says:

&quot;Not every accident... is an accident.&quot;

So a few time outs, I did deserve.

That's something new, at least I hadn't heard of it before, I guess reserved for &quot;new&quot; accounts in cadet/just out of cadet phase?

Yeah that's what confused me so greatly - I have actually once (and I apologised most profusely), team killed a player in a Locust with an arty. I didn't get kicked, although I had a several minute soft ban after the match. So to go from that, to immediate kick in cadet mode from the very first hit from the arty (I did warn the team, who did move backward, but typing is slow and so are Assaults) was extremely surprising. Especially since it was implied that the game prevented the damage - no harm no foul, right? From the perspective of a new player such a draconian action would be very off putting. You can even attempt to rejoin the game, but the moment you would actually drop into the match again has you returned to the Mechlab. So from that I deduced that the "more severe" punishment implied by the message I received after I was kicked had I not been a cadet seemed to be quite untrue, in my opinion there is nothing more harmful to the whole team than immediate expulsion from the match. There definitely should be a warning the first time you would trigger such action from the game.

[Dimento Graven]

Lazy Millennial, on 24 January 2020 - 06:14 AM, said:

...
There definitely should be a warning the first time you would trigger such action from the game.

Yeah, I agree there's a LOT of what PGI has done over the years that could have been done, and should be done, an f-ton better.

But there's a lot of 'half-assery' embedded in the game that leadership allowed due to out right laziness.

[Horseman]

Lazy Millennial, on 24 January 2020 - 05:13 AM, said:

Oooh, I had no idea. So you are saying that passed the cadet stage enough damage also auto kicks you, and presumably the slap on the wrists you get for minor infractions (15 seconds before you can play again I think?) becomes much more severe?

No, past the cadet stage the damage doesn't auto-kick you. That was done to curb that TKer gang.
The "slap on the wrist" is an escalating penalty system based on how much damage / TKs you've incurred within a four hour time frame - the penalties can scale up to 20 minutes.

https://mwomercs.com...-1458-15mar2016

Quote

Team Kill/Team Damage Penalty System
The automated penalty system releasing in this patch is intended to penalize players who consistently engage in play behavior that results in Team Kills and/or excessive amounts of Team Damage.
The following actions will trigger this penalty system:
1 Team Kill = 1 Penalty strike
x amount of Team Damage = 1 Penalty strike
The damage threshold required for receiving a Penalty strike for Team Damage will not be made public at this time.
Multiple Penalty strikes can be received in a single match.[indent]
• Example: During Match 1, 'Player A' racks up an amount of Team Damage that doubles the Penalty threshold for Team Damage. They also perpetrate 1 Team Kill. As a result of these three actions, 'Player A' will be hit with a 5 minute delay for their next matchmaking search.
• Example: During Match 1, 'Player B' racks up an amount of Team Damage that triples the Penalty threshold for Team Damage. They also perpetrate 2 Team Kills. As a result of these five actions, 'Player B' will be hit with a 20 minute delay for their next matchmaking search. After waiting 20 minutes 'Player B' drops into Match 2 and perpetrates just 1 Team Kill; they do not hit the penalty threshold for Team Damage. As they are already at the Fifth Penalty strike from their previous match, and the four-hour Penalty reset has not yet occurred, they are hit with another 20 minute delay to their next matchmaking search.[/indent]
The breakdown of the current penalty levels follow the same structure as the existing Disconnect Penalty system:
• First Penalty: 10 second delay for next matchmaking search.
• Second Penalty: 2 minute delay for next matchmaking search.
• Third Penalty: 5 minute delay for next matchmaking search.
• Fourth Penalty: 10 minute delay for next matchmaking search.
• Fifth Penalty: 20 minute delay for next matchmaking search.
Each subsequent penalty beyond the Fifth will also enforce a 20 minute penalty.
Penalty levels reset every 4 hours.

Edited by Horseman, 24 January 2020 - 06:49 AM.

[Mawai]

There are folks who like to TK. They create alts hop on and try to kill folks. By having stricter rules for cadets it means that folks who want to do this have to play through all the cadet games before they have another account to TK with, they can't just hop on and go to it. For many, this means they don't bother since they don't get the instant "gratification" of being a TK.

So, you accidentally dropped an arty on your team and the game kicks you because you were a cadet. You learn to avoid attacking team mates and be more careful next time.

However, if you were someone who wanted to TK you find out that it doesn't work as a cadet so you have to play however many cadet games before it might be worthwhile to TK, probably a couple of hours or more, decide its not worth the time (if the goal is TK) and move onto another game where it is easier.

So, honestly, I would say the feature is working as intended. In addition, if the player really is a cadet learning how to play, then I would honestly say that they have only just embarked on the learning curve and their contribution to the team (if they even know what to do) will be fairly modest so it probably isn't as big a penalty to the rest of the team as one might expect.

[Prototelis]

If you drop smoke close enough for a teammate to run into it, it is 100% your fault when they do.

Dats greedy smoke. We all do it. Just own up to it.

Edited by Prototelis, 24 January 2020 - 11:33 AM.

[Lazy Millennial]

Prototelis, on 24 January 2020 - 11:33 AM, said:

If you drop smoke close enough for a teammate to run into it, it is 100% your fault when they do.

Dats greedy smoke. We all do it. Just own up to it.

Actually I was twisting from damage waiting for my ppcs to recharge. I thought I was activating a cool shot which was totally going to win the exchange.

[Prototelis]

Solution;

I moved my coolshot button to a keyboard key adjacent to WASD, and my strike buttons are both on my mouse on the forward thumb buttons.

[Marquis De Lafayette]

We all make mistakes and will have a bad team damage match on occasion...most of us learn to make less as we learn the game......

Team damage occurring from hitting the wrong button is the rarity, but it happens. Team damage from someone trying to drop an arty strike on the last 2 enemies (as your team swarms them) in the final 30 secs of a 10-2 stomp is entirely avoidable.....that kind of thing (as well as bad aim, firing through friendlies, etc) is where most team damage occurs. Then you have the intentional teamkillers which have been mentioned above. The team damage system isn’t prefect, but it’s probably better now than it’s ever been.

[_Magno_]

What is the problem?

If you truely made a mistake, why are you complaining about a very limited time out?
How is the AI of the game supposed to know if you fat-fingered an artey strike vs intentional?

It can't. In fact, the programmers probably, and should, program it that a friendly laying down an arty within lance formation range is presumed to be doing it intentionally.

Standarize your consumables.
All "coolshots" are 1 button.
All arties are 4 and 5.

Solutions are simple.
Addressing your grievance is not simple.