37 replies to this topic

[ScrapIron Prime]

Vincefeld, on 02 May 2021 - 07:39 PM, said:

Bumping this because topic is very important. Game online going up right now and it should continue to do so.

This bugged arm aiming can discourage new players from game.

Pro-tip... post it in the suggestion forums. (Which I see you've done, good.)

Pro-tip... keep posting it (or bumping it, every time it scrolls off the first page). It took several years for the call for Bagpipe war horns to get enough attention to get them in the game. I can't imagine a coding change would take less.

Edited by ScrapIron Prime, 04 May 2021 - 10:50 AM.

[LordNothing]

ScrapIron Prime, on 04 May 2021 - 10:44 AM, said:

Pro-tip... post it in the suggestion forums. (Which I see you've done, good.)

Pro-tip... keep posting it (or bumping it, every time it scrolls off the first page). It took several years for the call for Bagpipe war horns to get enough attention to get them in the game. I can't imagine a coding change would take less.

yes, that way it can get ignored by pgi and be in the right place.

[ScrapIron Prime]

LordNothing, on 04 May 2021 - 01:35 PM, said:

yes, that way it can get ignored by pgi and be in the right place.

Basically, yeah.

[S 0 L E N Y A]

This is your issue?

One thing that isn't even actually broken in this mountain of lost tech spaghetti code of game..

This is what you noticed?

[Vincefeld]

S 0 L E N Y A, on 05 May 2021 - 01:55 PM, said:

This is your issue?

One thing that isn't even actually broken in this mountain of lost tech spaghetti code of game..

This is what you noticed?

If you think its working properly play mechwarrior 5 mercenaries. Game where PGI finally managed to make arms work

Theres no reason why i shoudnt be able to just point and click at stuff for installing weapons into low durability components far from cockpit(convergence hell) and mostly at belt level(making any ridge peeking clunky af)

Edited by Vincefeld, 06 May 2021 - 11:37 AM.

[Dormaus]

MW5 was my first game, and I had no issues converting over.

[Navid A1]

This is indeed a problem and has been brought up to PGI... but fixing it is something that requires PGI to dedicate engineering time. Something they are in short supply at the moment due to MW5 work load.


Here is the problem:














Here is how you solve it: (Similar to when you hold down free-look key, when torso reaches its limit)






There is also another problem in the game that affects Arm lock mechanics with regards to how camera and reticles react.
This too has been brought up to PGI.
It is summarized here:

Edited by Navid A1, 06 May 2021 - 04:19 PM.

[Navid A1]

D A T A, on 30 April 2021 - 06:41 AM, said:

Nah,people who use that are used to that, if you make arm mounts too accurate you turn MWO into Call of Duty

It's not about making arm mount too accurate.

It will make torso twisting better and faster with arm lock on, and it will make it so that you can see up and down when you are firing.

You in particular would love it given it would allow you to see what is hugging your legs.

Let's stop shutting down ideas before understanding what is being said

Edited by Navid A1, 06 May 2021 - 04:29 PM.

[Clint Steel]

I like the idea's Navid put up. I do worry that though it would make the game easier to play, it might not make it better though. Part of what differentiates this game from other FPS's is the "clunkiness."

As it is, I don't mind my arms being the auxiliary aiming reticle, until it hits the torso twist limit, then it should track to the arm-reticle, just so you can aim down and such.

[ScrapIron Prime]

Clint Steel, on 06 May 2021 - 04:47 PM, said:

As it is, I don't mind my arms being the auxiliary aiming reticle, until it hits the torso twist limit, then it should track to the arm-reticle, just so you can aim down and such.

Yes, it would be nice for a jumpy mech with arm weapons on top of a building to be able to aim DOWN at people. Or any mech on alpine peaks, really.

[Wildstreak]

There are other things I would expect MW5 players to complain about more.

[Vincefeld]

Clint Steel, on 06 May 2021 - 04:47 PM, said:

I like the idea's Navid put up. I do worry that though it would make the game easier to play, it might not make it better though. Part of what differentiates this game from other FPS's is the "clunkiness."

As it is, I don't mind my arms being the auxiliary aiming reticle, until it hits the torso twist limit, then it should track to the arm-reticle, just so you can aim down and such.

If game difficulty steers up from bad camera or clunky controls it failed as a game. Its not fun, there are other ways to make game challenging.
Theres no reason why people cant point at fast target and shoot if they installed weapons in arms. They are specially designed turrets to track targets that torso cant follow up.

Edit: Navid, very good post bro! It illustrates another problem with aiming reticle cannot be seen through gigantic map at bottom of screen.

Edited by Vincefeld, 07 May 2021 - 09:52 AM.

[Clint Steel]

Vincefeld, on 07 May 2021 - 09:51 AM, said:

If game difficulty steers up from bad camera or clunky controls it failed as a game. Its not fun, there are other ways to make game challenging.
Theres no reason why people cant point at fast target and shoot if they installed weapons in arms. They are specially designed turrets to track targets that torso cant follow up.

But it is fun. Maybe not a fun aspect for you, but I enjoy it.

Note: I know i'm a minority as I prefer shooter games on consoles (requires gamepad use), where twitch reflex isn't so keyed up and animations rule movement speeds (looks better this way too)
I also come from back when you played Mechwarrior games with just a joystick and throttle. There is something to that clunkiness that adds to the game for me. I even play MWO with joystick because of this, though I aim with a mouse, just so I can be competitive.

[Vincefeld]

Clint Steel, on 07 May 2021 - 10:02 AM, said:

But it is fun. Maybe not a fun aspect for you, but I enjoy it.

Note: I know i'm a minority as I prefer shooter games on consoles (requires gamepad use), where twitch reflex isn't so keyed up and animations rule movement speeds (looks better this way too)
I also come from back when you played Mechwarrior games with just a joystick and throttle. There is something to that clunkiness that adds to the game for me. I even play MWO with joystick because of this, though I aim with a mouse, just so I can be competitive.

Hey even with more accurate arms people will continue using torso hardpoints because of their hight, durability of said side torsos and arm shielding.

Reason why i play MWO is mostly because mechs are slower and bigger targets than soldiers in FPS. That and im a long time fan of mechs. Due to how slow mechs turn and accelerate/stop MWO wont become twitch shooter if targeting was improved.
If anything it will only even ground in brawls between people with mouse/controller, fast connection/high fps and opposite.

Its a agile mech and not a clunky sluggish tank. Mechs arms designed to be faster than tank turret to aim at fast targets upclose.

Edited by Vincefeld, 07 May 2021 - 10:47 AM.

[Der Geisterbaer]

Clint Steel said:

I also come from back when you played Mechwarrior games with just a joystick and throttle.

~damn~ Thank you for reminding me that MWO still has neither a true analog joystick option for the torso nor digital torso pitch/yaw options via key-presses that would allow me to at least program a joystick script to replicate a decent enough analog torso movement ... ~sad face~

[Vincefeld]

topic kinda sank little bit, bumping in hopes it gets more attention.
Problem is more serious than some balance issues or bolt ons. Yes its not as obvious from 1st look.

[Wildstreak]

Vincefeld, on 06 May 2021 - 09:56 AM, said:

If you think its working properly play mechwarrior 5 mercenaries. Game where PGI finally managed to make arms work

Theres no reason why i shoudnt be able to just point and click at stuff for installing weapons into low durability components far from cockpit(convergence hell) and mostly at belt level(making any ridge peeking clunky af)

Ah yes, MW5 the game where:
- You cannot change engine size thus stuck at stock speeds.
- Paths that go nowhere begging why are they in the game.
- Invisible walls for no reason.

Heck, I saw one review video where the reviewer went on the left path of a fork and saw it was a dead end. He kept going and hit an invisible wall before reaching the end!

There are problems with MW5 some being fixed others too late.
I will grant some features in MW5 ask why they are not in MWO or no effort at a MWO2.

- Destroyable buildings, this could actually fix 1+ modes.
- Alternate AC and LRM types.
- Vehicles and Infantry.

Possibly others. Point is the HUD is not that high on the list.

[Moldur]

It's been like that since release. I guess I never thought of it as outside the mechanics of the game.

If your mouse sensitivity is too high, it is very hard to aim with a locked torso. Reducing your mouse sensitivity (to what some may initially consider to be an uncomfortable amount) will make make aiming with locked torso significantly easier and more precise. Loss of performance is a nonfactor, since your torso turn speed, not your mouse, is still setting the mechanical limit for your movement.

MWO is a game where there is a fight between you and your controls instead of solely between you and what's outside the cockpit if that makes sense. I feel this falls in the same category as firing group pairing and armament. Assuming you're the perfect pilot at actually controlling everything going on in your mech, yeah you could theoretically perfectly sync a bunch of different weapons, weird firing groups, going to locked and unlocked torso aim as appropriate, etc. Instead, I acknowledge my limitations, lack of skill, lack of time to master everything in a video game, etc. and have to simplify things.

Edited by Moldur, 11 May 2021 - 12:34 PM.