29 replies to this topic

[Andrewlik]

Clickbait title.

We see such threads here alot lately, and to be fair there is a kernel of truth behind the complaints.
Light mechs are very strong in very specific circumstances, but player skill and team cohesion can prevent such circumstances from occuring as well as mitigating the effects of such a light mech chasing you around. Due to the nature of the 12 v 12 "skirmish" format, such circumstances are rare, which make the times a piranha does successfully cut you off from the team and shred you to pieces all the more jarring, and those are the times we remember.
Though I'm far from a perfect player (as well as far from a perfect light pilot myself), I'm willing to teach anyone who is struggling with light mechs (both as or against them) what I know.
Like legit, I'm on PGI's discord as well as Everything Battletechs and r/battletech's server, same username, the screaming owl pfp. @me and we'll work out a time to hop in a call together

I even have a Jenner IIC streak-boat as an anti-piranha light mech specifically if you want to see some carnage

Edited by Andrewlik, 05 March 2022 - 07:30 PM.

[Weeny Machine]

Let's be honest here, we talk about a handful light chassis not the whole light mech class.

The thing is with those 20t mechs is, it is not only about the skill of the pilot but also the enemy. If the enemy has a good aim and is able to hit, then the little mech comes apart very quickly.

On the other hand if your aim is bad, these mechs are extremely frustrating to play against.


However, there are more things to consider:

1. Loadout
Some people increase the problem by mounting only laser weapons which spray a lot when the 20t is swerving like hell. Yes, these little point-and-click weapons also have a drawback!

LRM Boats...sorry, your 4 small laser backup weapons won't keep a light away if you are alone

2. Attitude
It is a mech vs mech game...every player has only "1 life" and as such every player should be dangerous. That means just because you succeeded to click "assault" in your mech bay tap, you are not entitled to auto-win vs. every other class bar assault mechs


3. Counter meassures
Seismic - you usually see when someone wants to jump you, also good against stealth mechs
UAV - when you get jumped, pop a UAV, your fellow LRM boats are happy about a free dorito to hit
Streaks - if all fails, use that noobtube
Walls - park your bum in front of a wall. When the light attacks, he cannot circle you nor shoot your back


Too bad that points 1-3 are simply ignored by many of "lights op !!11"

Andrewlik, on 05 March 2022 - 07:29 PM, said:

I even have a Jenner IIC streak-boat as an anti-piranha light mech specifically if you want to see some carnage

That's uncool

Edited by Weeny Machine, 06 March 2022 - 01:57 AM.

[Blood Rose]

Good try OP, but this thread has been done before. There are a small subset of people whom refuse to learn in any way. Still, 10/10 for trying.

[Meep Meep]

Even if a few select lights with specific loadouts are a bit powerful in some players hands you don't tend to see them playing in them much because they don't generate as much psr as a well driven heavier mech. There are some exceptions like DATA who likes to record his mg light mech carnage runs as 'proof' they are op but doesn't seem to get the point that the performance levels he can get out of those specific mechs can't be replicated by most other players on a consistent basis. So while the mech is 'op' in this hands its just another xp and credit piñata driven by someone average.

[Duke Falcon]

You still blame those little, innocent lights?
Shame on you!

The real problem is:
Better players than me are OP! Nerf them!

Again, sarcasm-train hit you...

[martian]

Weeny Machine, on 06 March 2022 - 01:55 AM, said:

1. Loadout
2. Attitude
3. Counter meassures
....
Too bad that points 1-3 are simply ignored by many of "lights op !!11"

I would add the point number 4.

It says "Do not wander around the map alone unless you are really sure that you can defend yourself against enemy light 'Mech(s)!"

[Curccu]

martian, on 07 March 2022 - 02:27 AM, said:

I would add the point number 4.

It says "Do not wander around the map alone unless you are really sure that you can defend yourself against enemy light 'Mech(s)!"

I would remove light word from that.

[PocketYoda]

Blackjack Arrow makes for a decent Light killer.. and at the least sends them off with their tail between their legs.

[ScrapIron Prime]

Nomad Tech, on 07 March 2022 - 04:52 AM, said:

Blackjack Arrow makes for a decent Light killer.. and at the least sends them off with their tail between their legs.

Heck, my old Marauder 3R (2PPC, 2AC/5, 2ERSL) is a great light killer. Even two lights jumping me... provided I'm fresh when it happens. But damaged, or jumped by a whole wolf pack... no. And people have to realize that.

[LordNothing]

its all about knowing your enemy. thats why i tell bad assault pilots who create "lights op" threads to play lights. because they clearly do not understand why they are losing. knowing what the light can do and what its limitations are is essential knowledge when you got one up the back end of your annihilator.

[Aidan Crenshaw]

Know thyne enemy...

[Beastbear]

LordNothing, on 07 March 2022 - 09:11 AM, said:

its all about knowing your enemy. thats why i tell bad assault pilots who create "lights op" threads to play lights. because they clearly do not understand why they are losing. knowing what the light can do and what its limitations are is essential knowledge when you got one up the back end of your annihilator.

It doesn't even have to go that far. knowing what your mech can do, dont be afraid to spend some sp in the mobility tree for torso speed and twist if it's an issue, and for the love of god stop tunnel visioning on your target when you get whacked from somewhere your not expecting it (especially in the back)

Most good backstabbers will be through cookie cutter back armor in 1-3 shots, if you're going to stay on target after the 1st one there better be a damn good reason coz chances are it's going to cost you pieces of your mech

Edit: not personal, lord. Observations from spectating, and getting it easy as the backstabber.

Edited by Beastbear, 07 March 2022 - 09:28 PM.

[LordNothing]

Beastbear, on 07 March 2022 - 09:25 PM, said:

It doesn't even have to go that far. knowing what your mech can do, dont be afraid to spend some sp in the mobility tree for torso speed and twist if it's an issue, and for the love of god stop tunnel visioning on your target when you get whacked from somewhere your not expecting it (especially in the back)

Most good backstabbers will be through cookie cutter back armor in 1-3 shots, if you're going to stay on target after the 1st one there better be a damn good reason coz chances are it's going to cost you pieces of your mech

Edit: not personal, lord. Observations from spectating, and getting it easy as the backstabber.

i play a good mix of all classes and i think it makes me a better player. ive been on every possible side of the light vs squirrel engagement. every squirrel is just one clean shot away from death, an assault takes a few even with excessive armor striping.

[Steel Claws]

I wouldn't be upset if a jam mechanic was thrown onto machine guns.

[martian]

Steel Claws, on 12 March 2022 - 10:53 PM, said:

I wouldn't be upset if a jam mechanic was thrown onto machine guns.

So on top Machine Guns ...

• having a very short range
  
• requiring a lot of ammo
  
• requiring a long face time in the vicinity of enemy

... you would also let these MGs jam?

This would not be a big problem for assault, heavy and medium 'Mechs, since usually they are not armed with MGs anyway.

However, there are many light 'Mechs that need working MGs to create some sort of meaningful loadout. With another hurdle in their way, I guess that many light 'Mechs pilots would stop using them.

[CreativeAnarchy]

Steel Claws, on 12 March 2022 - 10:53 PM, said:

I wouldn't be upset if a jam mechanic was thrown onto machine guns.

That would render all machine guns useless. No one would willingly load a short range weapon that takes slot/tonnage for ammo and requiring quite a bit of face time to even put on damage, they only do about 1-1.5 per second. Even assaults with weird builds would not use them. Ballistics like machine guns are not a poke and hide weapon.

Lights are fine. People just need to up their game.

[Steel Claws]

martian, on 12 March 2022 - 11:25 PM, said:

So on top Machine Guns ...

• having a very short range
  
• requiring a lot of ammo
  
• requiring a long face time in the vicinity of enemy

... you would also let these MGs jam?




This would not be a big problem for assault, heavy and medium 'Mechs, since usually they are not armed with MGs anyway.

However, there are many light 'Mechs that need working MGs to create some sort of meaningful loadout. With another hurdle in their way, I guess that many light 'Mechs pilots would stop using them.

Have you ever watched Data and Bowsers video on just how over the top lights are with machine guns? Even knowing he was coming and taking the best builds he could - Bowser only stopped him once out of about 20 tries and typically dies in about 6 seconds. It does NOT take a lot of face time.
https://youtu.be/baH0MqiFiTc

Edited by Steel Claws, 13 March 2022 - 03:03 PM.

[CreativeAnarchy]

Steel Claws, on 13 March 2022 - 02:53 PM, said:

Have you ever watched Data and Bowsers video on just how over the top lights are with machine guns? Even knowing he was coming and taking the best builds he could - Bowser only stopped him once out of about 20 tries and typically dies in about 6 seconds. It does NOT take a lot of face time.
https://youtu.be/baH0MqiFiTc

Yes it did take face time. He had to keep on shooting them with a constant stream to do their damage, unlike the lasers he was using which popped their full damage in a second. MGs are not a peek and poke weapon, they are a damage over time weapon because you are only going to do .75 to 1.5(depending on the gun) damage per second.

This is also a team game, mechs are not balanced on 1v1. If I'm going to 1v1 someone, I'll come in something equivalent.

Edited by CreativeAnarchy, 13 March 2022 - 04:37 PM.

[Blood Rose]

Steel Claws, on 13 March 2022 - 02:53 PM, said:

Have you ever watched Data and Bowsers video on just how over the top lights are with machine guns? Even knowing he was coming and taking the best builds he could - Bowser only stopped him once out of about 20 tries and typically dies in about 6 seconds. It does NOT take a lot of face time.
https://youtu.be/baH0MqiFiTc

>Extremely good player in a counter meta Light
>1v1
>Enemy is exclusively a meta assault
>On its own with no escorting units or teammates
>"Oh my how could this happen, how could the Assault lose, Lights are so OP"
HMMMMMMM I WONDER WHY
Also, note how beaten up the Light is after each brawl. Sure, Data gets the kill in the end but he is in no shape to pull off another trick like that.

[Meep Meep]

Steel Claws, on 13 March 2022 - 02:53 PM, said:

Have you ever watched Data and Bowsers video on just how over the top lights are with machine guns? Even knowing he was coming and taking the best builds he could - Bowser only stopped him once out of about 20 tries and typically dies in about 6 seconds. It does NOT take a lot of face time.
https://youtu.be/baH0MqiFiTc

Data is a high skill player who can make near any mech perform. If the lights he is running are really op then fire up your favorite video recorder and show us your footage of you personally wrecking face in them.