25 replies to this topic

[panzer1b]

From my understanding, crits do do minor damage to structure (which is why structure buffs are higher as its less effective then armor which crits dont do squat againt).

Still, its 2 nodes, 2. That alone makes it worth even for the 2% more damage to an open component (or whatever the number is), especially since missiles are high number of impacts (so the crit chances go up like LBXs) and again, 2 nodes for one of the few skills that actually gives a minor boost to DMG. If it was locked behind lots of junk like before, then yeah, not worth wasting skills. But since it isnt then imo no reason not to.

[--Saint--]

RickySpanish, on 03 June 2022 - 06:51 PM, said:

No, they are probably the most useless nodes in the game. They multiply critical damage, as in you must crit first, and then that damage is multiplied. You can only crit components, so basically they only help against blowing up weapons/ammo etc once the target has no armour left. And that damage multiplier is what, 30%? Useless.

its 15%.
Did some maths to see how many missiles it takes to kill a component and it seems it depends on the missile system and what comp you´re aiming to kill. small comps that have for example 7.5 health, will take 7 LRM missiles with nodes vs 8 without the nodes.
But if you´re running ATMs, assuming short distance, you always need 3 hits (3x 3.45 with nodes and 3x3 wthout). An SRM system would require 4 x 2.3 or 4 x 2 for a comp kill. You don´t roll many attempts to crit for these systems so, going for comp kills with these, seems kind of pointless unless you´re running perhaps MGs to complement dmg and get you over the kill threshold.
A high health comp of say 12.5, would take (w/nodes) 11LRMs, 4ATM, 6SRM vs 13LRM, 5ATM, 7SRM (without nodes)
I would say its more a node designed to help kill of large components across the board, but its LRM boats who gain the most by economizing in small comp kills as well....

[caravann]

Auric Monkey, on 10 September 2022 - 09:17 AM, said:

its 15%.
Did some maths to see how many missiles it takes to kill a component and it seems it depends on the missile system and what comp you´re aiming to kill. small comps that have for example 7.5 health, will take 7 LRM missiles with nodes vs 8 without the nodes.
But if you´re running ATMs, assuming short distance, you always need 3 hits (3x 3.45 with nodes and 3x3 wthout). An SRM system would require 4 x 2.3 or 4 x 2 for a comp kill. You don´t roll many attempts to crit for these systems so, going for comp kills with these, seems kind of pointless unless you´re running perhaps MGs to complement dmg and get you over the kill threshold.
A high health comp of say 12.5, would take (w/nodes) 11LRMs, 4ATM, 6SRM vs 13LRM, 5ATM, 7SRM (without nodes)
I would say its more a node designed to help kill of large components across the board, but its LRM boats who gain the most by economizing in small comp kills as well....

main difference is 3 vs 7 missiles, not how many missiles are in one hardpoint. You compare it as if there's only 3 missiles and there's only 15-20 missiles - Add all missiles in the ammo bins in the calculation.

[martian]

RickySpanish, on 03 June 2022 - 06:51 PM, said:

No, they are probably the most useless nodes in the game. They multiply critical damage, as in you must crit first, and then that damage is multiplied. You can only crit components, so basically they only help against blowing up weapons/ammo etc once the target has no armour left. And that damage multiplier is what, 30%? Useless.

Honestly, I use them on my missile boats.

I do not bother with those nodes if my 'Mech has missiles only as a secondary weapon.

Weeny Machine, on 03 June 2022 - 09:39 PM, said:

I tested them and I feel no difference.

It could be a case of confirmation bias, but it seems to me that those nodes do help. For example, I have had a lot of fun with HSN-8P Hellspawn that PGI so generously gave me some time ago.

Weeny Machine, on 03 June 2022 - 09:39 PM, said:

Most likely a lot of people also use the crit reduction skill.

So can we say that those unlocked HE nodes are levelling the field to the original level?

[Maddermax]

Crit calculations page from MechDB are very helpful here:

https://mwo.nav-alph...i/critical-hits

They’ve been more and more my go to resource for obscure MWO knowledge, as they’re actually up to date, unlike most of the other wikis or old forum posts.

From their numbers, the nodes give an overall 1.4% bonus damage against structure. Whether that’s worth it for two points is debatable, but as it’s one of the few things that directly improve damage output, it’s probably ok.

Edited by Maddermax, 10 September 2022 - 02:12 PM.

[--Saint--]

caravann, on 10 September 2022 - 09:22 AM, said:

main difference is 3 vs 7 missiles, not how many missiles are in one hardpoint. You compare it as if there's only 3 missiles and there's only 15-20 missiles - Add all missiles in the ammo bins in the calculation.

My understanding is every time a missile hits, it rolls to see if it crits. Im calculating how many critting missiles it takes to kill a component. I think you´re talking about how many rolls you will be making per game?