14 replies to this topic

[simon1812]

Can some one explain how they work? What they do affect? Whta they dont? Which weapons benefit from it? Which weapons dont? Which equipment actually work well with them? Its like I red the page at the WMO wiki and still left with more questions than answers.

[Ekson Valdez]

This thread has been moved to General Discussion

[D V Devnull]

simon1812, on 11 November 2022 - 09:59 AM, said:

Can some one explain how they work? What they do affect? Whta they dont? Which weapons benefit from it? Which weapons dont? Which equipment actually work well with them? Its like I red the page at the WMO wiki and still left with more questions than answers.

Hello there, 'simon1812'... So, it looks like you're puzzled about the Targeting Computer equipment which you can load into your Mech for battle. They affect the following, with greater effects depending on how big a Targeting Computer (Clans & I.S. get "Mark 1 through Mark 7" while the I.S. has a "Mark 8" to work with) which you pick, and in the manner described with each...

• Visual Zoom Levels — Advanced & Standard Zooms get a boost on top of what they normally provide, allowing you to see things further away as a larger image
  
• Sensor Range — Adds to how far away that your Mech can be from Enemy Mechs while still providing the ability to target them... ECM can still diminish Sensor Range capability but still has to fight against the entire total, so the more you have, the better off you are... Also of note, when you have more Sensor Range to utilize, then things like LRMs/ATMs/Streaks can manage to Lock-On faster for firing at your target.
  
• Targeting Time — How long it takes to get that "Paper Doll" which you see in the top-right corner during battles, thereby enabling you to understand what the Enemy has on-board much quicker
  
• Beam Range — This one is basically for ALL Laser Weapons (unfortunately excluding TAG because nobody could be nice and include it) and helps re-focus the Laser Beam to reach further downfield and do more damage
  
• Projectile Speed — This one is for Ballistic Weapons (excluding Gauss and LBX stuff) along with PPC Weapons as well... It boosts the firing systems on those to enhance how fast that weaponry can travel to hit a target
  
• Critical Chance — Once you have broken through the Enemy Mech's armoring, these amounts enable you to have a better chance of causing Critical Hits on up to 3 items at a time... Of course, the more items that you're trying to knock out at once, the harder it becomes in order to do so because these would become horribly overpowered otherwise

...and I will note that all of the above is NEVER reflected in most of the various statistical information provided (give or take the Sensor Range because that one might still get included in the Mech Stats pane information... but I'm not sure about that as I type this, so please do not consider my words here in parentheses about displayed Sensor Range Information in the Mech Stats Pane as something you can bank on...) as you're configuring the Mech because this item can also be destroyed in battle, which then causes you to lose the effects it provides until your next Match on the battlefields. Hopefully this information so far helps reduce your confusion by a bit.


Here's also a blunt listing of weapons that do work directly (or semi-directly) with a Targeting Computer which happens to be equipped...

• Autocannons (the Standard kind which do not have any words attached) — Clan & I.S. — Any size... 2/5/10/20
  
• Ultra Autocannons (those double-tappers which can Jam on you) — Clan & I.S. — Any size... 2/5/10/20
  
• Rotary Autocannons (still needs time to spin up for firing) — I.S. Only (unfortunately) — Any size... 2/5
  
• PPCs — Clans get ERPPC only to use — I.S. gets ALL types & sizes... ER/Heavy/Standard/Light/Snub-Nose
  
• Lasers — Clan & I.S. — ALL kinds... Standard/ER/Pulse/Heavy — All sizes... Large/Medium/Small/Micro
  
• Lock-On Missiles — Clan & I.S. — ALL kinds... LRMs/ATMs/Streaks — All Sizes... 2/3/4/5/6/9/10/12/15/20 — This particular one only happens because of Sensor Range alterations, and losing a Targeting Computer during battle causes these bonuses to drop out until the next Match you play

...and then a straight-up listing of what never directly receives the Targeting Computer's help at all...

• TAG (seems they only help beams that directly incur damage) — Clan Light & Standard — I.S. Standard
  
• LB-X Autocannons (the Shotgun versions) — Clan & I.S. — Any size... 2/5/10/20
  
• Gauss Rifles — Clan Standard — ALL I.S. sizes... Light/Standard/Heavy
  
• Flamers (makes your Enemy so hot they shut down) — Clan & I.S.
  
• Machine Guns — Clan & I.S. — Any size... Light/Standard/Heavy
  
• Standard SRMs (as in, not the Streak stuff) — Clan & I.S. — Any size... 2/4/6
  
• MRMs — I.S. Only (unfortunately) — Any size... 10/20/30/40
  
• NARC — Clan & I.S.

...so that you have a clean list for considering how to handle things.


As a final note, if you're only in need of longer Visual Zoom Level assistance for aiming, then...

• Non-Rotary smallest Autocannons (all of which are a "2"-type size)
  
• Gauss Rifles (with the "Heavy" kind being of lesser consideration)
  
• ER PPCs (with other kinds being of lesser consideration)
  
• ER Large Lasers (with other kinds being of lesser consideration)
  
• Standard TAG (simply can not help the Light TAG at all)
  
• NARC (Well, this is an odd one, right?)

...can at least benefit from that. But please do not consider such extra effects like these as something to bank upon either, because you still have to wait for travel and/or burn time on any of those weapons. I believe the NARC is also affected by AMS defeating it too, which means you can have a perfect shot without it attaching and going into Beacon Mode for your Team to use.


With that, perhaps I should now scoot. Hopefully this provides you with a reasonably comprehensive, concise, and understandable listing-style guide (including some unusual exceptions) of how stuff works with and/or around a Targeting Computer which you chose to equip. Good Luck with designing your Mechs!!!

~D. V. "trying their absolute best to explain the Targeting Computer and how it can be implemented" Devnull

[Vorpal Puppy]

The 1-slot, 1 ton TC1 seems to be the best bang for your buck. If I have more slots or more tons left over, I usually find the build is not optimal. There may be a few outliers to that - i think I have heard of big TCs in the small laser Charger, as well as in certain faction play specific builds on ERLL quirked mechs.

[Saved By The Bell]

Rotary Autocannons?

Edited by Saved By The Bell, 17 November 2022 - 08:21 PM.

[MechMaster059]

I've come close to using the TC I a couple of times but always end up taking it off.

Targeting Computers are garbage and should never be used.

[Curccu]

MechMaster059, on 18 November 2022 - 12:00 AM, said:

I've come close to using the TC I a couple of times but always end up taking it off.

Targeting Computers are garbage and should never be used.

5% velocity and/or 4% extra range for 1 ton&slot isn't good?
Being able to shoot enemy further away than it can shoot back isn't beneficial?

So I would say your opinion of TCs isn't very well thought out.

[RockmachinE]

Curccu, on 18 November 2022 - 02:46 AM, said:

5% velocity and/or 4% extra range for 1 ton&slot isn't good?
Being able to shoot enemy further away than it can shoot back isn't beneficial?

So I would say your opinion of TCs isn't very well thought out.

And don't forget target info. Its crucial to find weak spots. TCs are totally worth it.

[Meep Meep]

For ranged builds were you have a spare slot and ton you can't really find a use for then the TC1 is ace. But normally you will want more ammo or another weapon or some other item instead. Bigger tc can get some use in the dedicated wall snipers.

[D V Devnull]

Saved By The Bell, on 17 November 2022 - 08:21 PM, said:

Rotary Autocannons?

Yes, even those. Targeting Computers specify that they affect any Autocannon which happens to not be an LB-X shotgun design. Take a look at one sometime!

~D. V. "Unless something is really weird, then RACs are included in what TCs alter." Devnull

[MechMaster059]

Louis Brofist, on 22 November 2022 - 04:44 PM, said:

And don't forget target info. Its crucial to find weak spots. TCs are totally worth it.

LOL.

There are skill points that can be used to speed up targeting for no build cost. Targeting is already fairly fast at close range.

Don't lead a new player astray like this.

[RockmachinE]

MechMaster059, on 25 November 2022 - 05:01 PM, said:

Targeting is already fairly fast at close range.

You must be a slow a*s player if you perceive target info being fast. The 1 tonne for all the benefits of a TC is totally worth it for a lot of builds.

Don't lead new players astray like this.

[MechMaster059]

Louis Brofist, on 25 November 2022 - 05:06 PM, said:

... The 1 tonne for all the benefits of a TC is totally worth it for a lot of builds.

It's good that you indirectly acknowledge that TC's 2-8 are garbage that should never be used.

The only TC worth discussing at all is the TC 1. The target gain time boost of IS/Clan TC 1 is 17.5% / 22.5% respectively. The equivalent of 2 / 3 skill points into Target Gathering Info skills. The TC 1 gives a nice little +4% beam range as well. This is the potential opportunity cost of mounting a TC 1 in order of importance:

- 1 heat sink
- more armor
- more ammo
- 1 medium laser
- 2 clan machine guns
- 1 AMS
- a bigger engine
- 1 slot for IS Light Ferro / Ferro armor

The idea that you're going to pick a TC over this other stuff is just silly. The TC's need to have their weights cut in 1/2 at the very least and their slot requirements cut in 1/2 rounded up. (We all know advanced rework I proposed with input from Meep Meep is WAY beyond what PGI is capable of so I offer these simple suggestions instead.)

[Saved By The Bell]

I am using TC1 in almost all mechs. And sometimes TC2-3.

[Curccu]

MechMaster059, on 25 November 2022 - 05:29 PM, said:

It's good that you indirectly acknowledge that TC's 2-8 are garbage that should never be used.

Only in your mind... again large TCs are very good extreme range sniper builds.
And some mid number TCs are pretty good on ppc poptarts for extra velocity 5% for each ton isn't bad for heavy/assault mech.

MechMaster059, on 25 November 2022 - 05:29 PM, said:

The only TC worth discussing at all is the TC 1. The target gain time boost of IS/Clan TC 1 is 17.5% / 22.5% respectively. The equivalent of 2 / 3 skill points into Target Gathering Info skills. The TC 1 gives a nice little +4% beam range as well. This is the potential opportunity cost of mounting a TC 1 in order of importance:
- 1 heat sink

You kind forgot velocity, missed shot costs a lot of heat.
And lights and mediums sure you usually run out of tons before slots but heavies assaults again slots are usually issue for extra DHS. Not very many good SHS builds in the game.

MechMaster059, on 25 November 2022 - 05:29 PM, said:

- more armor

Usually people run maxed out armor on relevant part of the mechs.

MechMaster059, on 25 November 2022 - 05:29 PM, said:

- more ammo

extra extra ammo that you use every 20th game or so as last survivor?
or some extremely ammo tight mech?

MechMaster059, on 25 November 2022 - 05:29 PM, said:

- 1 medium laser

I wouldn't add extra medium laser to any build whats the point of one medium laser?

MechMaster059, on 25 November 2022 - 05:29 PM, said:

- 2 clan machine guns

4 really but I guess you calculated half ton of ammo there.. pretty much same as that ML, nope wouldn't take it... also this takes 3 slots.

MechMaster059, on 25 November 2022 - 05:29 PM, said:

- 1 AMS

For build that benefits TC... hell yeah I'd take it over AMS, plenty of hard cover around for most maps.

MechMaster059, on 25 November 2022 - 05:29 PM, said:

- a bigger engine

depends on mech, fo some assault that extra that extra 0,8kph isn't game changer either.

MechMaster059, on 25 November 2022 - 05:29 PM, said:

- 1 slot for IS Light Ferro / Ferro armor

free that 1 slot(and 1ton) to get ferro but don't have enough slots to add anything to build with that new extra tonnage as you are out of slots?

MechMaster059, on 25 November 2022 - 05:29 PM, said:

The idea that you're going to pick a TC over this other stuff is just silly. The TC's need to have their weights cut in 1/2 at the very least and their slot requirements cut in 1/2 rounded up. (We all know advanced rework I proposed with input from Meep Meep is WAY beyond what PGI is capable of so I offer these simple suggestions instead.)

No it's not silly, it's situational.