163 replies to this topic

[Widowmaker1981]

Im not really sure if its possible to balance LRMs well. I certainly agree that, as it stands in the matches im in, they suck. I dont use them and it has nothing to do with them being cheesy.

With the current arc, missile speed, etc, as soon as any reasonably competent player notices much LRM fire from the enemy team they will just position themselves with an eye to making sure there is suitable vertical cover nearby, which is trivial on the vast majority of maps, and LRMs become useless against competent players as a result.

The problem is, LRMs are capable of indirect fire and homing - therefore it must be possible for the player on the receiving end to do something to save themselves - its just not OK to have a weapon system capable of destroying you from outside your LOS with no recourse whatsoever, no one finds that fun gameplay.

I cant immediately think of a better alternative than the missiles having an angled descent, so any sufficiently tall vertical cover is a shield, but whatever counterplay you enable, the problem remains the same - the effectiveness of the weapon is inversely proportional to average player skill and, because of that, buffs that make it viable in T1 gameplay will make it destructively overpowered for lower tier gameplay.

Edited by Widowmaker1981, 29 May 2023 - 07:06 AM.

[Weeny Machine]

Nine-Ball, on 29 May 2023 - 06:54 AM, said:

I suggest getting down from your high horse as the lack of air is detrimental to your thinking.

If you hadn't noticed I merely responded to his bringing up Jarls; if I have to explain myself further then you've been on that high horse for too long.

Some may see displaying your Tiers as being a pompous braggart, others may see it as a badge earned for grinding through the tiers to reach Tier 1 -- it is both and neither at the same time since it is relatively impossible to know for certain who is displaying their Tier for whatever reason.

As for me, yeah its a badge since this is like the third time I've did the Tier 3 to Tier 1 grind, each time was subtly different from the last due to the changes to weapon and heat shenanigans along with the introduction of more mechs.

Only this time, I did the grind with my iconic Battlemaster so please excuse me for being a bit prideful of it.

Any intelligent person smiles about being in T1 is a "badge".

Just take a meta mech, preferably a heavy laser vomitter or, if you can play them, an assault. Your damage will most like earn you a spot up.

Others who play mediums and lights have often a harder time to get the scores because in both, super good and super bad games they will most likely do less damage than a heavy or assault. I had games in which my team were rolling enemies so fast that I basically fired every chance I got and ended up with measly 250 damage

[CFC Conky]

foamyesque, on 29 May 2023 - 03:15 AM, said:

…

Neither radar dep. nor TR should exist as skills. Mech quirks, yes, but not skills.

Just spitballing here but perhaps the quirk should apply to the weapon itself. Give LRM launchers a TR quirk that doesn’t stack for multiple launchers but which can be amplified with skills.

Good hunting,
CFC Conky

[pbiggz]

Gilgamesh Hoi, on 29 May 2023 - 02:19 AM, said:

You would do well to refrain from fabricating quotes, its not only questionable behavior that I wouldn't allow my children to get away with but it also reflects much more poorly on you than the people you are trying to slander. It would appear this is what you do rather than form a cognizant response to a post you disagree with.

You can do better, you can be better than this type of lying and obfuscating. Try to not let it happen again.

You went out of your way to make a thread about how you hate the cauldron because they balanced the game in a way you didnt like.

That isn't helpful. Nobody else is going to do the work and you aren't remotely qualified. This is pure grievance garbage, you're just grumpy because you cant run your favourite jank build without getting rocked.

foamyesque, on 26 May 2023 - 01:26 PM, said:

This is rich, coming from the guy who used "The people who are actually good at the game" as an argument elsewhen.

Get over yourself.

Im capable of introspection. I am also fully aware im mediocre at the game. I dont have a high tier because i don't play that much, but when I lose, its usually because I ****** up, and im willing to admit that. I don't make a habit of making a post every time i die calling for the thing that killed me to be removed from the game and the designer that balanced to be fired.

A select few, very loud individuals here would rather post than get better; any time something kills them its because they are facing evil cheaters who exploited to get good. Celebrating your own refusal to learn and condemning people who, even if they play infrequently, actually try to improve, is a very weird look, and I don't know why you are carrying water for it.

Nine-Ball, on 29 May 2023 - 06:54 AM, said:

I suggest getting down from your high horse as the lack of air is detrimental to your thinking.

If you hadn't noticed I merely responded to his bringing up Jarls; if I have to explain myself further then you've been on that high horse for too long.

Some may see displaying your Tiers as being a pompous braggart, others may see it as a badge earned for grinding through the tiers to reach Tier 1 -- it is both and neither at the same time since it is relatively impossible to know for certain who is displaying their Tier for whatever reason.

As for me, yeah its a badge since this is like the third time I've did the Tier 3 to Tier 1 grind, each time was subtly different from the last due to the changes to weapon and heat shenanigans along with the introduction of more mechs.

Only this time, I did the grind with my iconic Battlemaster so please excuse me for being a bit prideful of it.

Now this, this is rich, coming from the guy who tried to shut me up by flaunting his stats.

Vellron2005, on 28 May 2023 - 10:21 AM, said:

Here's a few cold hard facts:

1) Since the Cauldron took over, the game has become heavily geared towards sniping.
2) Maps and meta have shifted towards sniping.
3) New maps are mostly sniper oriented.
4) New mechs, especially new Legendary mechs are made to be a sniper's wet dream.
5) The few maps that were LRM friendly have been ruined and turned into sniper maps.
6) Faction Play is still a cheater/comp player cesspool.
7) The balance is not good. And the continual rebalancing for rebalancing's sake is bad.

So basically.. Yeah, I agree with OP.. The Cauldron needs to get it's act together or withdraw.

This is why you lunatics need to stop making these threads. You are consistently telling on yourselves. Nobody is denying that your play experience could be better, but when you make these lists you just admit you don't understand why you lose, or what it is you actually want. You make demands for **** you don't understand and utter sweeping condemnation against things that aren't actually hurting you.

Edited by pbiggz, 29 May 2023 - 07:24 AM.

[pbiggz]

Nine-Ball, on 29 May 2023 - 07:24 AM, said:

I think you're confusing me with the other guy who was so offended at your stupidity he decided to remark on your Jarls.

Did you put your tier 1 badge on your resume? It seems to be like 80% of your personality after all.

[Weeny Machine]

pbiggz, on 29 May 2023 - 07:20 AM, said:

You went out of your way to make a thread about how you hate the cauldron because they balanced the game in a way you didnt like.

I'm not aware of what he has written, so I cannot comment on that. However, let's make one thing clear: everyone has the right to express criticism about the game, as long as it is done in a respectful manner. There are positive aspects, such as making old mech variants fun to play again, but there are also negative aspects, like the repetitive meta - because it is dominated by sniping and laser vomit. Last but not least, if they cauldron cannot handle criticism they shouldn't do balancing but it is of course appreciated

Edited by Weeny Machine, 29 May 2023 - 07:35 AM.

[pbiggz]

Weeny Machine, on 29 May 2023 - 07:26 AM, said:

I don't know what what he has written so I cannot comment on that but let's put one thing straight: each and everyone has the right to criticize the cauldron. There are good things - like the many now really playable mech variants, and bad things - like the monotonous meta. No one forces them to do the balancing but it is of course appreciated

Being allowed to say something isn't the same as being allowed to say *anything*. These threads are actively misleading and based on a foundation of conspiracy.

Cauldron balance has been the most responsive in the lifetime of the game; these guys are actually testing and making changes methodically rather than just nerfing what kills them like paul did. Im old enough to remember that. Are you?

And you, weeny, of all people, hide behind that "fair criticism" shield more than most, because about 80% of your posts are contentless airing of grievances because, again, the cauldron balanced the game in a way you didnt like, and you're mad about it because you can't run your jank builds.

I love my jank builds as much as anyone, if not more; I don't pretend im entitled to run them, or that i wont get laquered if I get stuck out in the open with a weird heavy brawler. That **** is on me, not the cauldron, and im not starting another 3 ******* threads every time blue lasers get me when i ****** up and got out of position. That's more than I can say for most of you.

Nine-Ball, on 29 May 2023 - 07:32 AM, said:

No, I regale them with the story of the time I singled-handedly stopped half a dozen mechs from pushing into mid on Minining Collective by literally walking infront of them, firing a salvo and then eating 28% worth of damage to my armor, still surviving and helping my team win handily.

And then I segue into the several other dozen times I die early because I'm out of position or get lazy with my torso twisting.

I'll let you in on a little secret: Tier's only take into account individual skill and not one's ability to be a good or willing teammate.

Im glad you had fun, but its even better than that. Tier is a play time reward; if you win more than you lose, you are going up. I ****** around in the mechlab too much to go up because running the same comp builds was boring to me, and now that i have an actual job, I don't have a lot of time to play.

Edited by pbiggz, 29 May 2023 - 07:36 AM.

[Weeny Machine]

pbiggz, on 29 May 2023 - 07:35 AM, said:

And you, weeny, of all people, hide behind that "fair criticism" shield more than most, because about 80% of your posts are contentless airing of grievances because, again, the cauldron balanced the game in a way you didnt like, and you're mad about it because you can't run your jank builds.

It is concerning when you believe you can dictate to people what they should write. If, on top of that, you get agitated and refuse any form of disagreement when others don't share your opinion, then the behavior becomes very alarming on a psychological level. And that is a professional opinion.
What I mean? Look below: here you try to construct a merry story to somehow accuse me of something or justify in a twisted way what you think is right. Anyway, I won't discuss anything anymore with a person who clearly needs help. Welcome to my ignore list.

pbiggz, on 29 May 2023 - 07:35 AM, said:

I love my jank builds as much as anyone, if not more; I don't pretend im entitled to run them, or that i wont get laquered if I get stuck out in the open with a weird heavy brawler. That **** is on me, not the cauldron, and im not starting another 3 ******* threads every time blue lasers get me when i ****** up and got out of position. That's more than I can say for most of you.

Edited by Weeny Machine, 29 May 2023 - 09:22 AM.

[pbiggz]

Weeny Machine, on 29 May 2023 - 09:11 AM, said:

It is concerning when you believe you can dictate to people what they should write. If, on top of that, you get agitated and refuse any form of disagreement when others don't share your opinion, then the behavior becomes very alarming on a psychological level. And that is a professional opinion.
What I mean? Look below: here you try to construct a merry story to somehow accuse me of something or justify in a twisted way what you think is right. Anyway, I won't discuss anything anymore with a person who clearly needs help. Welcome to my ignore list.

Nobody is telling you what to write. They are telling you not to lie while you're writing. If you cant get that through your head that's your problem.

[Gas Guzzler]

Curccu, on 24 May 2023 - 04:56 AM, said:

Well looks like someone fd up quirks because in MechDB there is no weapon quirks for UM-R80
um-r80 3xLPPC
um-r80 1xHPPC

But even with Patch quirks (10% heat, 15% CD) HPPC will not out DPS 3xLPPC build it has almost same max DPS as LPPCs sustained DPS.

The Benefit of running 1 HPPC over 3 LPPC is that you then have 4 hardpoints for small lasers.

That said, the 2xSNPPC build is better.

[evil kerensky]

you know whats really hilarious? the entire reason the cauldron is in power is because they bitched the loudest about how chris was balancing the game.

now the cauldrons defenders say no one is allowed to complain about balance. i guess they are scared of being chris'd.
the only way to make it clear to pgi that the cauldron isnt good for the game is to not buy any of the new mechs until something is done about it. thats how change happened before, thats the only way it seems itll happen again.

its a real shame, because the cauldron could easily solve this problem, but they cant see past their own playstyles. so unfortunately, thats what its come too.

[evil kerensky]

inb4 the "you just want to run bad builds." ya, the builds i used to enjoy running are bad by modern meta. they didnt used to be, they used to be very meta, but cauldron saw to that. now-a-days i can run a 2hll,4erml, 2 gauss deathstrike when i drop. or i run a 5erll direwolf, or a dacka moonwalker. theyre all good options for the meta, but they are boring AF. theres 3 options with this game. win and be bored, lose and have fun, or play go halo where i can win and have fun doing so.

spoiler warning, none of the 3 options the cauldron are giving me makes me want to spend money on this game.

Edited by evil kerensky, 29 May 2023 - 11:46 AM.

[Teenage Mutant Ninja Urbie]

Nine-Ball, on 29 May 2023 - 01:39 PM, said:

Why would I take a meta mech? I'm doing reliably fine in my Battlemaster-3M.

The thing about Assaults is they're the ones to be focused down first aside from heavies, mediums and lights being out of position. 99.99% of Assaults out there are so slow that if the team decides to up and leave them during Nascar they won't be able to keep up and are generally left to the fast mech wolves. They'll be lucky to do 200 damage at that point.

Fast heavies and mediums on the other hand have the capacity to be fast enough they don't have to worry about being left behind as they can easily reposition themselves. They can and quite often flank the enemy and hit them before they can respond in kind.

However no other class is ""required"" to share their armor and lead the push like an Assault. Both of these in equal measure often mean Assaults can't just crap out damage without worry-- not when the entire enemy team is wary of your Assault chasis and damage potential.

Regardless, damage output is just one part of the equation to getting a good enough match score. I've had matches where I've done mid-300s damage and still managed mid-300 match score due to things like scouting the enemy (targeting them at beginning of the match for the bonus) and popping a UAV for scouting and countering ECMs.

you make it sound as if assaults are the worst perfoming class of mechs in the game;
the opposite, in pure numbers, is true.

..just so this doesn't turn into one of those "my bigmech needs buffs, because X"-threads

[pbiggz]

evil kerensky, on 29 May 2023 - 11:41 AM, said:

you know whats really hilarious? the entire reason the cauldron is in power is because they bitched the loudest about how chris was balancing the game.

They are where they are because they volunteered to do unpaid design work, and the generally demonstrated enough of a deep understanding of the game that PGI felt like they were handing the reigns over to people who weren't complete idiots. The same cannot be said for guys, because, as I have said before, when you lose a match, you never ask why, you just post another dumb thread because losing can never be your own fault.

evil kerensky, on 29 May 2023 - 11:41 AM, said:

now the cauldrons defenders say no one is allowed to complain about balance. i guess they are scared of being chris'd.
the only way to make it clear to pgi that the cauldron isnt good for the game is to not buy any of the new mechs until something is done about it. thats how change happened before, thats the only way it seems itll happen again.

Chris's balance wasn't great but it was far from the worst; Paul Inouye butched the balance on this game for like a decade, so if you think people are annoyed by chris you haven't been listening to what anyone's saying, but that tracks i guess since all you're doing is this dumb grievance trolling.

And for the record, nobody is saying you aren't allowed to criticize, they are saying you aren't allowed to fabricate a conspiracy narrative and use that as a club to beat down your opponents in debate; in other words, you can't ******* lie, and if you do, you can't expect not to be called out on it.

evil kerensky, on 29 May 2023 - 11:41 AM, said:

its a real shame, because the cauldron could easily solve this problem, but they cant see past their own playstyles. so unfortunately, thats what its come too.

For the record I think the cauldron changes are mostly too conservative; I would have loved to see a return of some giga-quirks because it made different mechs and variants feel unique in a way that hasn't really returned for the most part. I love legendary/exotic weapons in RPGs and shooters like wow or destiny or path of exile; where you can center a build around something wacky, and I think wacky quirks would breathe new life into this game.

That's a criticism.

"They are all snipers and cheaters and I hate them so they should go away and all those weapons should be banned" is not a criticism, and your right to say these things does not protect yourself from being called to account when you do say them.

This anti-sniper sentiment has simmered basically since the cauldron took over, and its for no other reason than that you guys got used to there being basically no snipers for as long as lowrey was running the game (which coincided with its lowest player counts). Short range weapons had very high DPS, and long range weapons didn't have enough throughput to even stop slow brawlers from closing, so MPLAS was literally the king, and everything else was more or less trash.

Once the cauldron took over we went from snipers being critically under-represented to, simply, being represented; sniping isn't the king of the meta, midrange is, but there are snipers present.

That's a pretty good outcome, but god forbid you have to change your game at all. Nay, you are entitled by god to pilot your king crab until the end of time and any effort to make you think about things like positioning, or updating your loadouts, is a targetted attempt to ruin the game for you personally, because that's what this is to you, a conspiracy against you personally.

The fact that you called chris by name is remarkably telling, because it indicates exactly what kind of meta you want, and the fact that it evolved past that is your single guiding star; the only reason you post is to recapture that meta because you think you're entitled to it.

I've watched this thing happen over the last two years. Its not remotely surprising, and the game you are playing here is remarkably mediocre. Stop expecting to lie and get away with it.

Edited by pbiggz, 29 May 2023 - 03:06 PM.

[Gilgamesh Hoi]

pbiggz, on 29 May 2023 - 07:20 AM, said:

You went out of your way to make a thread about how you hate the cauldron because they balanced the game in a way you didnt like.

That isn't helpful. Nobody else is going to do the work and you aren't remotely qualified. This is pure grievance garbage, you're just grumpy because you cant run your favourite jank build without getting rocked..

I see you couldn't address much less apologize for fabricating my quote content, and have instead tried to pivot. Lets stick to the facts:

- I made a post
- You didn't like my post
- Instead of addressing my post you quoted the link but changed the words, inserting your own words as a form of attack
- Changing my words was slander, and dishonest
- You have complained about dishonesty, i.e. lies
- Your intentional changes to words without citing that you were doing so WAS A MATERIAL LIE
- I called you out, giving you the opportunity to correct it
- You chose to ignore it, attempting to deflect which is LYING in intention.

So here we are, setting aside whether you and I disagree on the Cauldron lets focus on the active issue. You profess to deeply dislike lying and would have us believe that you are fighting to stops lies, yet you have lied about my posts, and dishonestly slandered me by changing the content of my posts wholesale.

I would like you to prove how much you dislike lying by correcting your post in which you changed my words, and apologizing to me. Maybe then the rest of us can take your professed dislike of lying seriously, or is it all a pose and you are happy to lie and slander when it suits you.

We await your actions and response, they will define you for the foreseeable future. Will you be a guy who made a mistake in the heat of the moment and owned up to it? or will you be a hypocrite who slanders and lies to score points, not worthy of debate or consideration?

GH

Edited by Gilgamesh Hoi, 29 May 2023 - 03:28 PM.

[pbiggz]

Gilgamesh Hoi, on 22 May 2023 - 05:33 PM, said:

Time for a balance pass on the cauldron.

Clearly they meant well in the beginning but it was too much power and the corrosive effect of that power has meant the deal has ceased to benefit the community at large, who pay the bills. I really appreciated the intentions and initial efforts, but it is time for the Cauldron to be removed from the equation and PGI to look for other viable mechanisms.

You dont like snipers and you equate the cauldron with the rise of sniping.

Gilgamesh Hoi, on 22 May 2023 - 05:33 PM, said:

The most delicate way I can frame this is that the Cauldron has lost perspective and this is warping the game to their tastes rather than the games best iteration. The less charitable take is that many within the Cauldron act, play and post as though they are more committed to reveling in the power and influence they have then an outcome that is a playing field for all.

You think the cauldron are conspiring to make snipers the top of the meta. You offer no proof, only sideways glances and inferences to preserve plausible deniability when someone calls you on it.

Gilgamesh Hoi, on 22 May 2023 - 05:33 PM, said:

I'd also mention that PGI has cleverly used the power and connections to manipulate the Cauldron into being an insulation against accountability for the company, and a instant army of forum bullies who shout down and tear into anyone not buying into the groupthink. Frankly... that was a brilliant move by PGI.

Fresh slate needed.

You paint the cauldron as a conspiratorial body, communicating with PGI via backchannels and secret messages and thus call into question their integrity, specifically to debase the cauldron and make their changes illegitimate in the eyes of those who dont know better.

Gilgamesh Hoi, on 29 May 2023 - 03:27 PM, said:

- I made a post

It was full of lies.

Gilgamesh Hoi, on 29 May 2023 - 03:27 PM, said:

- You didn't like my post

Because you were lying.

Gilgamesh Hoi, on 29 May 2023 - 03:27 PM, said:

- Instead of addressing my post you quoted the link but changed the words, inserting your own words as a form of attack

Because entertaining your lies isn't worth most of our time.

Gilgamesh Hoi, on 29 May 2023 - 03:27 PM, said:

- Changing my words was slander, and dishonest

My god do you need to clutch some pearls?

Gilgamesh Hoi, on 29 May 2023 - 03:27 PM, said:

- You have complained about dishonesty, i.e. lies
- Your intentional changes to words without citing that you were doing so WAS A MATERIAL LIE

I told everyone what you were really saying. You just didn't like being called out.

Gilgamesh Hoi, on 29 May 2023 - 03:27 PM, said:

- I called you out, giving you the opportunity to correct it
- You chose to ignore it, attempting to deflect which is LYING in intention.

You dont get to clutch your pearls and pretend you're being attacked when you made this thread with the intention to attack.

Gilgamesh Hoi, on 29 May 2023 - 03:27 PM, said:

I would like you to prove how much you dislike lying by correcting your post in which you changed my words, and apologizing to me. Maybe then the rest of us can take your professed dislike of lying seriously, or is it all a pose and you are happy to lie and slander when it suits you.
GH

An apology is neither called for nor deserved. You are the one who made **** up. You got called. Now you're trying to put that on me. Im pretty sure thats chapter one of Machiavelli.

You lied and you want me to apologize to you for it, lmfao.

PS: Its only slander if it isn't true. Its pretty manifestly obvious that it is.

Edited by pbiggz, 29 May 2023 - 05:09 PM.

[foamyesque]

Weeny Machine, on 29 May 2023 - 06:04 AM, said:

Sure, it is a part of the problem. But before that, you even have to get a lock. And with x layers of ECM, lock on time (which is really f* because you get usually a huge alpha to the face and picked on by the myriad of snipers) and just when you get a lock the target waddles back into cover and maybe a small part of your lrms only hit

Then comes the probkem wirh radar derp

That's fair, but the widespread ECM impacts everyone, not just LRM machines, so adjusting how ECM works beyond how long the lockon time is on an ECM-shielded mech could have unintended consequences elsewhere. But the only reason to care about radar dep. is targent retention, and the only reason to take target retention is lockon weaponry, and in particular LRMs.

[Heavy Money]

Vellron2005, on 28 May 2023 - 10:21 AM, said:

Here's a few cold hard facts:

1) Since the Cauldron took over, the game has become heavily geared towards sniping.
2) Maps and meta have shifted towards sniping.
3) New maps are mostly sniper oriented.
4) New mechs, especially new Legendary mechs are made to be a sniper's wet dream.
5) The few maps that were LRM friendly have been ruined and turned into sniper maps.
6) Faction Play is still a cheater/comp player cesspool.
7) The balance is not good. And the continual rebalancing for rebalancing's sake is bad.

So basically.. Yeah, I agree with OP.. The Cauldron needs to get it's act together or withdraw.

The game was heavily dominated by sniping before the Cauldron. cERPPC boating and poptarting were the top. Now both sniping and other things are valid. The medium to long ranges have filled out a lot. There are more types of sniping that are viable, like LGR+ERPPC combo, but the overall dominance of snipers has decreased. And the counters to snipers have increased. There's a lot more options for fast skirmishers or harassers to shut down snipers. But people often don't do this.

There is a rock/paper/scissors counter system going on in this game. If a lot of people play only Rock and not enough play Scissors, then Paper is going to get a lot of work done. This does not mean Paper is inherently overpowered, or that it needs to be nerfed.

You see people just refuse to play to counter snipers all the time. A single sniper will be watching a lane, and 5 people will get stuck hiding from them when even just 2 of them could countersnipe them just fine. But they don't. And then those 5 people slowly lose, or poke 1 by 1 and get farmed, and then they whine on the forums about snipers. And the Cauldron is right to not undermine the game's roles by responding to it with more nerfs.

The game does not need to be balanced around people playing it wrong, or it will be a broken mess when it is played correctly.

Edited by Heavy Money, 29 May 2023 - 07:59 PM.

[Curccu]

foamyesque, on 29 May 2023 - 06:49 PM, said:

That's fair, but the widespread ECM impacts everyone, not just LRM machines, so adjusting how ECM works beyond how long the lockon time is on an ECM-shielded mech could have unintended consequences elsewhere. But the only reason to care about radar dep. is targent retention, and the only reason to take target retention is lockon weaponry, and in particular LRMs.

It does impact everyone but it impacts lock on so much harder than anything else, basically can disable your weapons vs can hinder perception and others don't get loadout/paperdoll info that fast.

[Runecarver]

Heavy Money, on 29 May 2023 - 07:56 PM, said:

The game was heavily dominated by sniping before the Cauldron. cERPPC boating and poptarting were the top. Now both sniping and other things are valid. The medium to long ranges have filled out a lot. There are more types of sniping that are viable, like LGR+ERPPC combo, but the overall dominance of snipers has decreased. And the counters to snipers have increased. There's a lot more options for fast skirmishers or harassers to shut down snipers. But people often don't do this.

There is a rock/paper/scissors counter system going on in this game. If a lot of people play only Rock and not enough play Scissors, then Paper is going to get a lot of work done. This does not mean Paper is inherently overpowered, or that it needs to be nerfed.

You see people just refuse to play to counter snipers all the time. A single sniper will be watching a lane, and 5 people will get stuck hiding from them when even just 2 of them could countersnipe them just fine. But they don't. And then those 5 people slowly lose, or poke 1 by 1 and get farmed, and then they whine on the forums about snipers. And the Cauldron is right to not undermine the game's roles by responding to it with more nerfs.

Those are some skewed views of the past just a few years ago.

Before the cauldron, when PGI's own internal developers were still at the helm, snipers were strong but they were nowhere near as strong or as prevalent as they are currently. Even poptarting was more toned back before the cauldron decided to mess with everything. Not to mention maps weren't so heavily favouring said playstyles, so queues had more mid to short range variety.

Because you see, PGI at least had the bare minimum incentive to try and keep the game overall enjoyable for everyone. Sure, some weapons languished in being weaker than other options, but overall the game was much healthier in terms of weapon variety. Now we have an entire class of weapons that aren't usable because of how strong pin point weapons have become.

And the answer to snipers being far too strong and prevalent to the point they dominate map control is not "just bring your own strong snipers hurr durr." Thats a beyond idiotic statement considering how the game is designed and how the matchmaker works.

Heavy Money, on 29 May 2023 - 07:56 PM, said:

The game does not need to be balanced around people playing it wrong, or it will be a broken mess when it is played correctly.

Oh the acidic irony in this statement after the bumbling that has been done by the cauldron.

Edited by Runecarver, 29 May 2023 - 11:10 PM.