77 replies to this topic

[Kynesis]

You won't get support for that kind of talk here OP. The player base has been convinced that feeding solo players as fodder to groups is the only way to keep the game alive and also the best way of playing.

[VeeOt Dragon]

KingCobra, on 14 July 2023 - 10:45 AM, said:

For poor baby Jesus sake everyone needs to stop beating this dead horse topic most players just want to play battles and yes i accept the fact I personally will play anyone from tier 1 to tier5 win or lose. PGI need to do away with tiers altogether its causing more problems than its worth keeping.

And PGI just make 2 drop ques solo play with no groups and a 8v8 or 12v12 group only que keep faction play and events if they want and call it good.

P,S and get rid of the MM as well just group up the players needed for a battle and drop and play its as simple as that. .

so in other words you want to prevent even further new players from coming and staying. the Tier system keeps matches fun. there is a reason i don't play Faction and haven't for YEARS. part of that is the no MM. there is nothing more frustrating than going into match after match against people who spend half the day every day playing the game (or those that use various work arounds, cheats, and makros). i might play every now and again when there is an event that i like or something. other than that i rarely play MWO anymore. i also prefer fun builds over whatever boring cookie cutter "meta" is floating around.

the Tier system in theory with enough players makes sure that you go against roughly equally skilled players. be that new players, those with handicaps (i have hand tremors myself) or just casuals that love the universe and want to play more Lore builds, as well as your overly competitive try hards.

what you propose would kill the game quicker than anything else. "oh lets turn QP into Faction without dropdecks". FP a mode that has been almost dead for YEARS. group ques were pretty much dead before soup que and almost no one played Solaris., hence why Solaris got the Ax and group/comp que were rolled into QP instead of the other way around. if you want no MM go play FP.

the reason these kinds of threads open up from time to time is because it is still an Issue. if there wasn't a problem you would only see one once in a blue moon.

[KingCobra]

the check engine light, on 15 July 2023 - 08:13 AM, said:

"Stop caring about stuff I don't care about"

...No? Thrashing a bunch of T4/5 is profoundly unsatisfying for me.

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Please give everyone a break here mixing of tier1-5 has been going on for 7-8 years now the mm has never worked right and plus when you drop in battles where does it say what tier everyone is? It does not so who cares now anyway? you have been all tier mixed for a long time now and no one really care a rats asssssss about it.

I know i don't i would rather have faster drop times and for your info if if we get 1-5 players every 3 months that stays with MWO great but most don't stay anyway because MWO is not yet a twitch FPS they can exploit easy.

[Kotis77]

KingCobra, on 15 July 2023 - 08:27 AM, said:

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Please give everyone a break here mixing of tier1-5 has been going on for 7-8 years now the mm has never worked right and plus when you drop in battles where does it say what tier everyone is? It does not so who cares now anyway? you have been all tier mixed for a long time now and no one really care a rats asssssss about it.

I know i don't i would rather have faster drop times and for your info if if we get 1-5 players every 3 months that stays with MWO great but most don't stay anyway because MWO is not yet a twitch FPS they can exploit easy.

You might like it without matchmaker and usually some hardcore fans of franchise/IP fanboys dont really care how the matches are, but i think most of players and new players want to see somekind of balance if they wanna spend more time on the game. So thats why this game isnt that fun for most of players.

Advertising stupidly unbalanced game is waste of money. People usually looks at steam reviews/twitch streamers before jumping into a game.

Edited by Kotis77, 15 July 2023 - 10:38 AM.

[VeeOt Dragon]

well that and you see less and less variety of mechs and builds the higher you climb in Tier, gets boring after a while when all you see are like perhaps 6 different mech chassis over and over with the same 1 or 2builds.

[Kynesis]

Nine-Ball, on 15 July 2023 - 12:32 PM, said:

You worry about too many things outside your control.

Just focus on what you can do, improve and you'll eventually reach Tier 1 and realize nothing has changed beyond the slightly longer wait times to find a match.

Why is reaching Tier 1 relevant to this discussion? If someone finds something problematic or unfair why should they ignore it?
Ignoring problems doesn't help anyone. Voicing concerns (in any aspect of life) should be a perfectly reasonable thing to do, and among the best paths to identifying & fixing things.

I'd also note that Tier 1 is significantly different to other tiers, it dictates a kind of gameplay that some people find so unpleasant that they deliberately tank their PSR or run multiple accounts... or just leave the game.

[Saved By The Bell]

How about shut up mm for one week? And get data for analyze.

[East Indy]

The best thing you can do for yourself might be stepping away and seeing if you miss the game.

I was in the same situation, constantly on the wrong side of the MM. Took a break. It's been 2 years and I don't miss the merry-go-round.

[Saved By The Bell]

the check engine light, on 16 July 2023 - 06:24 AM, said:

They have a no-MM mode in EQ. Cut the ****, we know what YOU really want.

I am not able to play anyway for some time, lol.

[TW-Luna]

I mean.. does it matter if your team wins or loses if you did well? Win, Lose? It doesn't really matter in this game,

It's easy nowadays to get plenty of CBills and event quests (for the most part) don't need you to win.

Yes we've all been on the bad side of matchmaker (game last night with 0 assaults vs 4), especially with such a small community. But if you're killing it on damage, you just roll with it into the next game.

[SafeScanner]

"Damned if you do, Damned if you don't"

i can appreciate the attempt not to shame the people in your match

Its just one of those matchs and one of those days shrug it off and carry on

[An6ryMan69]

This subject keeps coming up because it needs to.

The matchmaker is the biggest problem the game has, period.

The argument that we need to have a brutally useless matchmaker because we have low player numbers is WRONG.

It is the brutal matchmaker that is causing the game to hemorrhage players.

I used to play regularly with my son, who has completely given up on this game, due to groups and elite players being dropped against weak players.

Myself, I had MWO seasons where I spent time in the top 10 list for total wins, due to the obscene number of matches I played; now I play very little other than showing up to grind out event rewards (if at all) in the hopes that one day I might care again about goodies in the game.

There NEEDS to be a separation between weak-avergage-strong players and solo's and groups. Period.

This is currently game where a premade group of "Ace of Spades" titled players can jump on a lone solo cadet FFS... and guys sit around and defend it, while wondering about our dwindling player base!

Wake up people....

Edited by An6ryMan69, 19 July 2023 - 06:56 AM.

[Curccu]

An6ryMan69, on 17 July 2023 - 11:32 AM, said:

This is currently game where a premade group of "Ace of Spades" titled players can jump on a lone solo cadet FFS... and guys sit around and defend it, while wondering about our dwindling player base!

But ace of spades is easiest to get at T5 because loads of potatoes?

[An6ryMan69]

Ha, Ha!

Technically, but it's not that easy....and it wouldn't be easy at all if it was a full potatoes vs potatoes match.

Like, matched-potatoes, LOL!

[crazytimes]

An6ryMan69, on 17 July 2023 - 11:32 AM, said:

This It is the brutal matchmaker that is causing the game to hemorrhage players.

I used to play regularly with my son, who has completely given up on this game, due to groups and elite players being dropped against weak players.

There NEEDS to be a separation between weak-avergage-strong players and solo's and groups. Period.

It's posts like this that inspired me to finally make an alt recently. I am a very low quality tier 1 player... But my alt absolutely ROFLstomped it's way to 3, and will be at 2 in a few more matches. Anyone who thinks matchmaking for the lower tiers is bad simply does not have actual perspective.

Yes, Tier 3 gets some tier 1 players, but not that many. Most of the groups in tier 5 and 4 matches are absolute potatoes- and putting 4 potatoes in bad builds together does not constitute a winning combination. It might look scary seeing the same clan tag on 4 people- but that is it.

There's lots of bracket builds, really undergunned builds, or really under heat managed builds in the mid tiers as well. Often piloted by people who have played a lot and the will blame absolutely anything for dying- except themselves for stripping CT armour to fit more LRM ammo on their direwolf.

The MM seperation between tiers is a lot more than you think. The inability of people to accept personal responsibility for their own builds and skill is also a lot more.

[RickySpanish]

Anyone who says the Match Maker is somehow making the situation worse, or flat out doesn't work, has never dropped into Event Queue. In Quick Play I easily strike a balance between wins and losses, to the point where I find the game enjoyable enough to play despite my ever dwindling free time. Event Queue on the other hand is alright for a laugh, but if you so much as sneeze at the enemy eight of them die immediately. It's two different worlds. The Match Maker struggles and could be improved, but it DOES help.

[TheCaptainJZ]

The relationship of the Matchmaker with player count is cyclical. It's a little like the chicken and the egg. If we had more players, the MM would naturally be able to do a better job, back to, say, 2015 performance. But without more players, it's questionable whether any changes to MM will truly make a difference. There's just a lot of variables working against it.
1. No two player mechs are the same (compare that with a FPS)
2. Players do not hold just one or two weapons at a time.
3. No respawn, so limited life.
4. Mechs take variable amounts of damage before destruction.
5. Mech speeds are different. Mech maneuverability is different.
6. Maps are not always balanced.
7. Most players still playing have been for years. Experience gap can be substantial against a new player.
8. MM is trying to put 24 people into one match, but there may be only 500 online at a time--and they're not all going to be queued up at once. If they were, that's only about 20 full matches. But in reality, it might be closer to 20% of that at a time (total theoretical guess backed by no data whatsoever). If so, it might only have 4 matches-worth to make. I'm taking this as an extreme low.

[VeeOt Dragon]

exactly, though groups are a factor (its much more common for the more skilled players to be part of groups/units than new players if we are being honest here, there are exceptions of course). but population is a larger one. without enough people in all tiers the MM is sometimes forced to put t1s with t5s. back in the day when if first started playing (or rather first got to t3) the matches were balanced enough. you rarely got a real stomp. now days it seems its every other match is a stomp one way or another. now there are likely more factors to this including power creep but low population and groups in QP seem to be the bigger contributors.

there are a few things i think would help but as has been said the low player numbers mean those flood gates would just be opened back up anyway (on though would be to count all groups as the tier of the highest player in said group. this would keep people from artificially pulling their tier down by grouping with lower tier players. as a say t5 if you want to group with t1s be ready for tougher matches)

as for alt accounts i wish there was a way they could ban those or prevent them. i rarely see a say t3 player (even a long time t3 like myself) on the forums talk about making an alt (unless it is an alt account itself). its always t1s. it always stinks of seal clubbing to me and hurts the new player experience. (would you like to play a game where when you first start some player on either your team or the other kills over half the other team themselves. if its on your team you barely got to do anything if on the other well probably the same with the added negative of losing as well). now and again you get someone who does an alt for a reason other than easy kills and damage numbers but its rare.

[Kotis77]

stop givin matchmaker a free pass because of player numbers. when soup was added player count supposedly were all time low. still at least for me games did feel better. all they did was allow groups to quickplay? the chaos started and matches were all over the places. pgi/cauldron added more stuff and tweaked everything and more chaos came.

all im trying to get is before soup when things did change it did take months to chaos to clam down and almost everyone understanded how qp worked again. with soup we never got there. seems like pgi doesnt want to fix matchmaker. it has been 6-7 months when they started to talk about doing investigation to matchmaker it hasnt been finished yet. so how much time it will take make fixes and things to calm down again.

Is it better to just remove groups in qp for sake of the game or just wait if they got some medicine to fix match quality?

[Kotis77]

or how about trying old soloque for week or two? or can it be tried on event que?