47 replies to this topic

[MechB Kotare]

Can we finally get some more pinpoint balistic variations on clan side? For example changing all clan regular ACs (not just cAC5s) into one projectiled (slug) balistics?

Edit:
Especially considering the fact, that they are still highly inferior to cUACs

Edited by MechB Kotare, 15 August 2023 - 02:22 AM.

[LordNothing]

x-pulse is looking like they are going for rapid cycle, low damage. blazer looks like the is equivalent of the hll. the latter might give the is some of the stupid alphas that clanners can build up.

so far the only ballistics the cauldron are testing are hags, which seems like a cross between a gauss rifle, a rac, with burst fire like a cuac20 (at least the hag20, the 30 and 40 do 6 and 8 respectively). clans did kind of need a rac-a-like for is parity and this works in that role.

i wouldn't mind a pass on the 5 line ballistics. cac5 is a weapon i almost never use, and the same can be said about both lb5s and the is ac5 to a lesser degree (its still useful for being a ton lighter than the respective uac). they all require boating to be effective and are terrible as stand alone weapons. i think the ac5s can stand for some buffs to cd to improve it in stand alone use on lighter mechs, and then minor nerfs to its gh stats so this its only a minor overall buff for boaters. is lb5 is hard to boat, so just make it 0.5-1t lighter like its big brother. clan lb5 is just inferior, give it a bigger cd buff than the cac5.

[Mechwarrior2342356]

LordNothing, on 15 August 2023 - 04:55 AM, said:

x-pulse is looking like they are going for rapid cycle, low damage. blazer looks like the is equivalent of the hll. the latter might give the is some of the stupid alphas that clanners can build up.

so far the only ballistics the cauldron are testing are hags, which seems like a cross between a gauss rifle, a rac, with burst fire like a cuac20 (at least the hag20, the 30 and 40 do 6 and 8 respectively). clans did kind of need a rac-a-like for is parity and this works in that role.

i wouldn't mind a pass on the 5 line ballistics. cac5 is a weapon i almost never use, and the same can be said about both lb5s and the is ac5 to a lesser degree (its still useful for being a ton lighter than the respective uac). they all require boating to be effective and are terrible as stand alone weapons. i think the ac5s can stand for some buffs to cd to improve it in stand alone use on lighter mechs, and then minor nerfs to its gh stats so this its only a minor overall buff for boaters. is lb5 is hard to boat, so just make it 0.5-1t lighter like its big brother. clan lb5 is just inferior, give it a bigger cd buff than the cac5.

The Blazer is probably not a direct competitor to hlls but I am mildly concerned it may outmode standard LLs somewhat, waiting to see. Hard to gauge whether Xpulses offer substantially lower ttk than standard IS pulses against stationary dummy targets, but I kind of doubt they will be OP, waiting to see on that. HAGs are interesting and I kind of wonder how they will affect gameplay given how poorly regarded RACs have been.

Edited by the check engine light, 15 August 2023 - 06:37 AM.

[feeWAIVER]

Are you saying we're getting more weapons?
Clan needs more ppc choices imo.

[MechB Kotare]

LordNothing, on 15 August 2023 - 04:55 AM, said:

x-pulse is looking like they are going for rapid cycle, low damage. blazer looks like the is equivalent of the hll. the latter might give the is some of the stupid alphas that clanners can build up.

so far the only ballistics the cauldron are testing are hags, which seems like a cross between a gauss rifle, a rac, with burst fire like a cuac20 (at least the hag20, the 30 and 40 do 6 and 8 respectively). clans did kind of need a rac-a-like for is parity and this works in that role.

i wouldn't mind a pass on the 5 line ballistics. cac5 is a weapon i almost never use, and the same can be said about both lb5s and the is ac5 to a lesser degree (its still useful for being a ton lighter than the respective uac). they all require boating to be effective and are terrible as stand alone weapons. i think the ac5s can stand for some buffs to cd to improve it in stand alone use on lighter mechs, and then minor nerfs to its gh stats so this its only a minor overall buff for boaters. is lb5 is hard to boat, so just make it 0.5-1t lighter like its big brother. clan lb5 is just inferior, give it a bigger cd buff than the cac5.

Yeah, i also think that Binaries are gonna compete with cHLL high alpha builds. From what i've seen so far, Hags will be pretty useless at longer ranges, and their long bursts will make it easier to spread damage across the upper torso at short to medium range too.

I can't speak about lb5x, nor about any lbx at all, as i really don't like using them. I never have, and probably i never will, although i would totally be up for making them better.

Its cAC 20 and cAC10 i was refereing to though. I feel like they could easily get the same treatment the cAC5 got, when pgi made them one slug instead of burst fire. Formerly, it was unique for IS tech to be more pinpoint oriented, and for C to be high damage longer beam/ac burst oriented, but i feel PGI is trying to shift the balance of power with these new weapons. I'm totally fine with that, but i really would love to see regular clan ACs to be more ''pinpointy''.

feeWAIVER, on 15 August 2023 - 06:41 AM, said:

Are you saying we're getting more weapons?
Clan needs more ppc choices imo.

Unfortunately i don't think clans have any other PPC types in lore except for cERPPCs. I might be mistaken though. I'd love to have cHVYPPC..

Edited by MechB Kotare, 15 August 2023 - 06:53 AM.

[Mechwarrior2342356]

My main concern with Xpulse is they are a DPS weapon but hitscan and unconstrained by ammo. Small XPulse on that FS9 looked basically vastly superior to an MG battery. Med Xpulse seemed kind of... meh? Large Xpulse could possibly end up outmoding RAC. I wonder how those will affect current weapons. Blazers looked insane on an Assault, the RFL struggled with them. Those on something like Stone Crusher or a Stalker are positively terrifying. HAG spread at range is pretty severe looking.

This is sort of looking like "lasers uber alles screw ballistic plebs" if I get a bit unvarnished here, but I will wait and see.

Edited by the check engine light, 15 August 2023 - 07:08 AM.

[Duke Falcon]

No need for dread right now about the new weapons.

X-pulse is hotter than normal pulse. Niche weapon for larger IS ligths like the Wolfhound or Firestarter what can boost&boat enough SHS\DHS to deal with the extra heat generation.

Blazers? 9 tons, 4 crits, generate 200% of a large laser but provide only 150% damage. Like two LLs by terms of space and heat but only 1.5 LL by term of damage. Nice trade-off, niche weapon again. Maybe good for fast mediums, dunno, boating them would by idiotic considering the bad stats...

HAG? Nice, literally clan RAC just without the continual fire. The spread is a bit annoying but as an anti-light or anti-medium for CQC it could rock.

Overall, we receive a load of niche weapons what would be really viable on certain builds, rare builds. The community would be content about up to X-mas then we would forgot and dump them (except HAGs as they now looks like)...

So, I also think some cry-mob cheer-leaders would start to complain about these new weapons soon and with a few patches they would be twisted and wicked, better never ever introduced at the first place... You know, the usual...

[Samziel]

Duke Falcon, on 15 August 2023 - 07:27 AM, said:

Blazers? 9 tons, 4 crits, generate 200% of a large laser but provide only 150% damage. Like two LLs by terms of space and heat but only 1.5 LL by term of damage. Nice trade-off, niche weapon again. Maybe good for fast mediums, dunno, boating them would by idiotic considering the bad stats...

Where do you get the 150% damage from?

Blazers deal 18 damage and cause 13 heat. Thats exactly 2 large lasers on both values for one less tonnage. Also with slightly longer cooldown and duration.

Edit

I see these would be correct with tabletop values. They don't apply here. IS LL is 9 damage 6,5 heat and blazers are gonna be what I said. See here:

https://www.reddit.c...the_dev_stream/

Edited by Samziel, 15 August 2023 - 07:51 AM.

[ImaginaryFireball]

I feel like IS laser vomits still won't be on parity with the Clans simply because you can't fit as many double heat sinks.

[Meep Meep]

Of the three systems blazers seem like the one that will get the most use given the current alpha vomit meta.

HAG is going to be platform and role dependent same as xpulse.

Might need another round of quirk adjustments so we get a few 'specialized' variants for the new systems to coincide with the weapons release.

[SafeScanner]

i am trying to work out the X lasers are they a sidegrade over regular pulse

Hags look scary

(XSPL) 0.85 x 5 = 4.25 vs 4 (SPL)
(XMPL) 1.2 x 5 = 6 vs 6 (MPL)
(XLPL) 1.85 x 6 = 11.1 vs 11 (LPL)

Edited by SafeScanner, 16 August 2023 - 12:16 AM.

[crazytimes]

SafeScanner, on 15 August 2023 - 02:03 PM, said:

i am trying to work out the X lasers are they a sidegrade over regular pulse

Hags look scary

Laser machine guns. Normal pulse great for pinpoint peaking, these are for facetime. Expect to see paired with MG or RAC.

[KursedVixen]

MechB Kotare, on 15 August 2023 - 02:14 AM, said:

Can we finally get some more pinpoint balistic variations on clan side? For example changing all clan regular ACs (not just cAC5s) into one projectiled (slug) balistics? though yes i do with the Cuac 5 fired one bullet...
Edit:
Especially considering the fact, that they are still highly inferior to cUACs

C-ac5 fires one slug does 5 damage yeah it's a littl bigger but has more range..also i wish that now the Is has their heavy guass the clan ERPPC would do 15 damage instead of 10+5 splash. i mean it already does it's TT Heat for what nothing it's just a slightly modded long range snub ppc at this point. D'oh that's what i get for skimming.

Samziel, on 15 August 2023 - 07:45 AM, said:

Where do you get the 150% damage from?

Blazers deal 18 damage and cause 13 heat. Thats exactly 2 large lasers on both values for one less tonnage. Also with slightly longer cooldown and duration.

feeWAIVER, on 15 August 2023 - 06:41 AM, said:

Are you saying we're getting more weapons?
Clan needs more ppc choices imo.

like what clan doesn't really have any other ppc what we need is the TT CERPPC that does 15 damage for the 14.5 heat it already does like in TT



T

Edit

I see these would be correct with tabletop values. They don't apply here. IS LL is 9 damage 6,5 heat and blazers are gonna be what I said. See here:

https://www.reddit.c...the_dev_stream/

all IS tech is colder than tabletop in this game take the ERPPC for example both ERPPCS clan and IS do 14.5 heat the only diffrenc is the clan one is lighter and smaller and does 15 instead of 10 damage.

Alsoe blazer is 4 slots

Duke Falcon, on 15 August 2023 - 07:27 AM, said:

No need for dread right now about the new weapons.

X-pulse is hotter than normal pulse. Niche weapon for larger IS ligths like the Wolfhound or Firestarter what can boost&boat enough SHS\DHS to deal with the extra heat generation.

Blazers? 9 tons, 4 crits, generate 200% of a large laser but provide only 150% damage. Like two LLs by terms of space and heat but only 1.5 LL by term of damage. Nice trade-off, niche weapon again. Maybe good for fast mediums, dunno, boating them would by idiotic considering the bad stats...

HAG? Nice, literally clan RAC just without the continual fire. The spread is a bit annoying but as an anti-light or anti-medium for CQC it could rock.

Overall, we receive a load of niche weapons what would be really viable on certain builds, rare builds. The community would be content about up to X-mas then we would forgot and dump them (except HAGs as they now looks like)...

So, I also think some cry-mob cheer-leaders would start to complain about these new weapons soon and with a few patches they would be twisted and wicked, better never ever introduced at the first place... You know, the usual...

the spread isn't that bad tbh if you whatch the demo video you can see a guy sniping th catapult on the training grounds tourmaline from near the atlas spawn.


he only problem i see is that i think Hag's are slightly too hot and X-pulse are too cold, but i'm willing to wait and see..

Edited by KursedVixen, 15 August 2023 - 03:28 PM.

[KursedVixen]

feeWAIVER, on 15 August 2023 - 06:41 AM, said:

Are you saying we're getting more weapons?
Clan needs more ppc choices imo.

like what clan doesn't really have any other ppc what we need is the TT CERPPC that does 15 damage for the 14.5 heat it already does like in TT

[JediPanther]

Yawn. Let me know when the new supply of arrow vs,thunder, and inferno missiles arrives. Need to go give my catpls a bath and few laps around canyon network working on my jump jet judo.

[Curccu]

Duke Falcon, on 15 August 2023 - 07:27 AM, said:

No need for dread right now about the new weapons.

X-pulse is hotter than normal pulse. Niche weapon for larger IS ligths like the Wolfhound or Firestarter what can boost&boat enough SHS\DHS to deal with the extra heat generation.

Unless I'm as bad in math as you are SXPL is 6% hotter than SPL and M/LXPL are actually both cooler than their normal pulse variants (damage per heat).

Duke Falcon, on 15 August 2023 - 07:27 AM, said:

Blazers? 9 tons, 4 crits, generate 200% of a large laser but provide only 150% damage. Like two LLs by terms of space and heat but only 1.5 LL by term of damage. Nice trade-off, niche weapon again. Maybe good for fast mediums, dunno, boating them would by idiotic considering the bad stats...

Your math or reading comprehension is off again quite badly.

[Hauptmann Keg Steiner]

Curccu, on 16 August 2023 - 11:37 AM, said:

Unless I'm as bad in math as you are SXPL is 6% hotter than SPL and M/LXPL are actually both cooler than their normal pulse variants (damage per heat).

M/LXPL get slightly (like 1.6 vs 1.57) better DPH and decently better DPS, at the cost of much worse heat per second (HPS) and more facestaring. Don't know yet if the tradeoff's gonna be worth it.

Edited by Hauptmann Keg Steiner, 16 August 2023 - 12:39 PM.

[Mechwarrior2342356]

Something occurred to me - the interaction between TC and lasers might actually make XPLs better MGs than MGs. The heat buildup becomes less of an issue with a playstyle besides "stare like an idiot and hope he falls over before you explode".

[SafeScanner]

the check engine light, on 16 August 2023 - 12:44 PM, said:

Something occurred to me - the interaction between TC and lasers might actually make XPLs better MGs than MGs. The heat buildup becomes less of an issue with a playstyle besides "stare like an idiot and hope he falls over before you explode".

i think mg crit damage might outweight it (depending on the type of mg ) but we shall see

Edited by SafeScanner, 16 August 2023 - 02:15 PM.

[KursedVixen]

I personally think the hags are too hot and the x-pulse are too cold ,but I'm willing to wait and see. My biggest gripe right now is that small x-pulse has 0 ghost heat.


i also think the binary laser is too cold as well but, agian we'll see.

Edited by KursedVixen, 16 August 2023 - 03:18 PM.