15 replies to this topic

[Wild Kadabra]

Melee! A commonly discussed theme and a seemingly incompatible feature in MWO, but in a certain way it is already in game. Now don't get too excited what I am proposing here is not some good old fashioned rock'em sock'em robots, mechs duking it out in glorious fist fights is not likely a thing that we can ever seen in MWO (though i would love to be proven wrong). There is however another thing that mechs do and that is kicking!

We have all been in those early stages of the game where everybody is clustered together and bumping against one another and suddenly your mech takes that tiny bit of leg damage (if you are a light mech pilot you probably know the awful stress every 0.000000001% of leg armor loss causes!). My proposal goes along the lines of causing that damage to be increased based on chassis tonnage when hitting an enemy mech. This damage increase would not happen when bumping against a friendly mech however (that would be utter chaos, madness and carnage in Quick Matches!). Now this damage upon bumping would have a 3 second cooldown before your mech "kicks" again.

What do you guys think, is this something you would like to see? What limitations or problems do you think this would bring?! Bring your thoughts and ideas!

[Kodiak Jorgensson]

This could be interesting depending how it is implemented, would help with those situations where you have no weapons left and have to rely on the pittiful collision damage to try finish off the enemy, at the very least it could make DFA a possible attack something alot of people have wanted since beta.

[BlackDeathLegion]

It will NEVER happen, PGI lacks the ability to make this happen. Plain and simple!

Gather some friends and play some TT battletech for Melee glory!

[Mister Bob Dobalina]

My proposal for melee in MWO from quite a while ago and for the Hatchetman:

Error-ID 1OT, on 18 March 2017 - 03:31 AM, said:

Esteemed Ladies and Gentlemen.

I am here before you to make the case for the HCT-3F Hatchetman to be introduced into the MWO Universe.

The Hatchetman was, at its roll out in 3023, the first new Inner Sphere Mech design in a century. It featured revolutionary design choices, even after Clan standards: A melee weapon and a full cockpit ejection system. All in all, it was a very well rounded medium platform even capable engaging air units thanks to his targeting system.

During the years, the Hatchetman has seen many iterations in variants equipped with new weapon systems (e.g. Rotary ACs, MRMs etc.) or ECM versions (HTC-6D). Aside legendary engagements like the destruction of the Falcon Guard by Kai Allard Liao, the Hatchetman and his trademark iconic design had clearly left its mark.

It is clear, that the introduction of a Mech like the Hatchetman would be precedence for the addition of melee weapons in the first place. Nevertheless, it would be a significant addition to the variability of Mech choices. It would pave the way for formidable designs like the Axeman or the Hatamoto-Chi, to name a few at least.

Be aware that I do not propose this lightly as I know of the inherent problematic that has always been tied into direct kinetic engagement. Therefore, I have been thinking about how to introduce a hatchet / axe / sword into, and based on, the existing array of weaponry.


Consider this:

Let us treat the melee weapon like “just another weapon system” with a certain set of

• range (x meters)
  
• damage type (pinpoint, spread, ..)
  
• cooldown period (x seconds)
  
• charge up time (e.g. Gauss)

So here is my proposal shown after the example of the HCT-3F Hatchetman. The hatchet stands in for any other melee weapon in that case (Axe, Sword, Club, etc.)

• The hatchet takes 3 tons of weight and takes 3 slots.
  
• The hatchet forces lower arm and hand actuator and the required slot.
  
• No other weapon can be added to a weapon group as soon as the hatchet is added to it. In reverse, the hatchet cannot be added to a non-empty weapon group.
  
• The hatchet has a charge-up time and a trigger window comparable to a Gauss weapon.
  
• The hatchet has a long recharge time in the likes of a LRM20 / AC20 or even longer.
  
• The hatchet is aimed and targets with the crosshairs like any other weapon.
  
• The hatchet has a range of 30m with complete damage drop-off beyond.
  
• The hatchet creates pinpoint damage to the calculated impact point, following the same rules as for existing weaponry.
  
• The destruction of the hatchet would destroy the wielding arm as well, as its static stability would have to be deeply integrated into the arm in the first place.

An argument can be made for the amount of damage, such a weapon would inflict. Bare in mind that you carry a weapon with significant tonnage and requirement of slots (in the case of the HCT, the Hatchet weighs about 7% of the overall weight) and can only be used within a very thin margin of opportunity and only up close. So, high damage would be justifiable. Another area of argumentation regarding the damage is

• The speed of the Hatchetman at the time of the successful impact: Although it would be physically correct to include the objects own speed into the amount of kinetic energy transferred to the target (kinetic energy = mass x velocity squared), I would drop that for the sake of simplicity to make this better introducible into MWO.
  
• The weight of the Mech wielding the melee weapon. As stated before, the weight has even less influence on the kinetic energy transferred, than the speed has. On the other hand, bigger Mechs wield bigger weapons. While the Hatchetmans Hatchet weighs 3t, the Axemans Axe weighs 5t. If we assign a certain damage potential to the weight of the melee weapon, we have an indirect tie to the size of the Mech and could define 2t for Light Mechs and 7t-8t with Assault Mechs

Imagine the Hatchet being a extremely short ranged laser that weighs a lot, has a friggin charge-up and cooldown time and its use is shown by an awesome animation, beating the living crap out of an enemy Mech.

This would not create a massive change in the games basic and underlying mechanics (full kinematic engagements, kicking, punching etc.) as rather being melee light. It is clear, that such a change would require massive and probably foundation changing shifts and reprogramming, therefore I tried to create a way less invasive yet way more doable solution.

So, I close my argument for a relatively easy introduction of melee –ish weapons in general and the roll-out of the Hatchetman in particular.

Please let me know what you think about my thoughts on the matter.

[Major Major Catch 22]

At least knockdown again ! that will fix those pesky lights that run right up to the assaults legs !

[Damnedtroll]

Just make assault doing: 10x damage on light, 5x damage on medium and 2x bump damage on Heavy.

Heavy doing 0,75x damage on Assault, 2x damage on medium and 5x bump damage on light.

It would already help a bit about crouch hugger.

Edited by Damnedtroll, 20 December 2018 - 06:12 AM.

[Reno Blade]

Posted nearly the same in the old meleet thread:

Reno Blade, on 18 December 2018 - 07:25 AM, said:

I think we could even "start low" like this:

Currently we have 0.1-1 dmg to legs if you crash into someone (even the same team).

Changes suggested:

• Dmg dealt on crash of mechs to min=5 max = 50% of your tonnage to the target (both mechs)
  
• Dmg dealt when colliding with buildings (similar to fall damage) where we currently only have a sound on impact (maybe 1-5 dmg)
  
• Dmg increase by 25% for each hand/arm actuator
  
• Dmg increase by 50% for each "meelee weapon" equipped (e.g. future addition of Axe or a quirk).
  
• Dmg multiplier quirk (e.g. Awesome left hand club, or Centurion left arm claw)

This could just mean more collision, but without "active" attacks where the server hit detection would start having problems and mech animation would be a concern.

[Cichol Balor]

Major Major Catch 22, on 20 December 2018 - 04:14 AM, said:

At least knockdown again ! that will fix those pesky lights that run right up to the assaults legs !

yeah it will crash them and any poor sob unlucky enough to be to close right out of the game

[MechTech Dragoon]

Would need animations for every mech, multiple.
2 types of mellee attacks, your typical punch or arm swing, only viable towards hand/lower arm actuators
a "shove" type mellee attack, if hand actuator/lower arm actuator are either destroyed, non existant, or isnt viable for the mech.
2 types of shove, a "this is sparta" style front kick, and a "ram attack"

Ram attacks would be used by virtually all chicken leg walkers, as well as dog legged mechs, if arms are either unavailable or dont work well for mellee.
Front kick would be used by standard bipeds.

Mellee damage formula
"Ram" Deals damage =mech weight/3, attacker recieves 50% this value in self damage to CT, divided between structure/armor
"Front kick" Deals damage=mech weight/3, attacker recieves 30% this value in self damage to either right or left leg divided between structure/armor
"Lower arm actuator only arm swing' Deals damage=mech weight/3+5, attacker receives 25% this value in self damage to either left or right arm divided between structure/armor
"Hand actuator fist swing" Deals damage=mech weight/3+8, attacker receives 10% this value in self damage to hand actuator until hand actuator is destroyed. (Yes, hand actuators have health)
"Certain mechs get buffs to certain attacks, ex. awesome battlefist)

An atlas, for example, would need 4 different attack animations.

As a damage example, a centurion attacking with its shield/claw arm would deal 24.67 damage, and take 2.47 damage to its hand actuator (likely good for 2-3 swings)

[EldrenOfTheMist]

1) I would love for melee attacks to be back in game. As well as True use-able Melee weapons, and Hold out Solid shields like Tower shields. and other things they hold in their arms or are attached to the mech. that are not just cusmetic.

2) I would also like The "Death from above" Combat manuver to be in game as an option for combat. This would also make the jump jet Skill tree usefull for some thing. and used more often.

3) I don't want the ability for mechs to get knock down. I heared that was the main reason why Melee was taken out of the game.

4) Add a skill tree for melee Combat.

5) Please Devs Consider all this. I think it would be a good idea to have the ability to test these out in the PTS and Give Feed back. Before it goes live. Please Consider it.

Edited by EldrenOfTheMist, 31 December 2018 - 05:31 PM.

[Erik Ouzbel]

DFA doesn't do any damage? I wasn't aware they patched that out of the game.

Shields would be a good addition. Leave knockdowns for legged mechs only. "Charges" at the start knocking over teammates at spawn didn't help anything.

Impromptu melee weapons like trees or mech limbs would be nice. Firing a weapon by the arm carrying it instead destroys it. Only have the ability of TSM for 100's to pick up and use 20's as melee to give another reason for lights to stay behind or far enough away from hugging an assault.

[Earthbound Kuregi]

• Yeah there needs to be a melee button one for punches one for kicks a keybinding would actually make light mechs think twice on attacking an assault with flamers it needs to be added if so like a , and . as keybindings for melee plays animation of mech hits the mech hitbox yes pontentionally destroying weapons

Edited by Earthbound Kuregi, 27 December 2020 - 07:32 PM.

[Ch_R0me]

BlackDeathLegion, on 19 December 2018 - 07:50 PM, said:

It will NEVER happen, PGI lacks the ability to make this happen. Plain and simple!

Gather some friends and play some TT battletech for Melee glory!

Unfortunately, along with proper LBX/ATM mechanics...

[Necroconvict]

Hatchetman!

[JPeiper]

Yes, might give me a way to stop a 20t flea killing me in 10 seconds by hiding under my guns.....

[martian]

JPeiper, on 17 November 2022 - 11:07 AM, said:

Yes, might give me a way to stop a 20t flea killing me in 10 seconds by hiding under my guns.....

The right place for complaining that light 'Mechs are OP and should be nerfed is here: Light Mechs Are Screwed Up