43 replies to this topic

[Meep Meep]

Tried 2 tb20 in an ecm archer and it was ok. About the same overall damage as with lrm but a ~lot~ more destroyed components due to the high pin point damage of each missile. But just like with lrm its heavily team and map dependent and no buffs to the system itself will help with that. Now what looks like its going to be fun is a 2 tb5 locust 1m with its super missile quirks. I was having an absolute blast with that but alas with no ammo quirks you only have around 400 potential to play with and I was getting almost all of it every match. With moar ammo? Giggity...

[caravann]

Osiris is faster than locust but there is a huge size difference

[Daktangle]

Having been on the recieving end of a Crael chain firing 4 Thunderbolt 5's at me in my Kodiak, Thunderbolts may not do much damage but my word is the recoil of their hits horrendous to deal with. Worse than getting RAC2/5'd.

[Gruyter]

Thunderbolts are kind of supposed to suck. I'm pretty sure the whole reason Thunderbolts were created in tabletop was to explain why BattleTech does missiles in swarms rather than large, single missiles.

[SolCrusher]

They need velocity and more ammo per ton maybe double the ammo per ton.

[Jugger Grimrod]

I'm able to pull decent K/D out of a LGB-12C running 4xTB/15, 2xERSL. Not stellar, but not shabby. Positioning and timing... rinse and repeat.

Edited by Jugger Grimrod, 10 October 2024 - 09:45 AM.

[Meep Meep]

SolCrusher, on 26 March 2024 - 06:15 PM, said:

They need velocity and more ammo per ton maybe double the ammo per ton.

From some balance discussions in a stream last night it looks like at least velocity is being considered as a buff. Nothing else so far but you can always go to the cauldron discord and chime in.

[Weeny Machine]

I just decided to give Thunders a swing and used a good ol' Trebuchet (7M?). I was firing at a Javelin and it ran away...and the missiles were so slow that they always hit the ground shortly behind its feet when they tried to home in. I mean, seriously...

[Meep Meep]

Currently they are not very good vs fleeing evading lights. But the tb5/10 will quickly core a charging light. These are going to be strong on heavily missile quirked mechs once they get some buffs.

edit; Been having some moderate success with this fit so far. Alpha any beat up mechs to take advantage of the ct seeking and high pinpoint damage or ripple fire vs fresher mechs to keep them bouncing around their cockpit and unable to aim. The impulse for thunderbolts is pretty strong.

arc-t

Kinda wish the tempest had generic missile quirks instead of targeted.

Edited by Meep Meep, 27 March 2024 - 12:31 PM.

[Cyborne Elemental]

I think as a midrange 650m, 5 damage missile, they're in an odd bracket.

Its like having super Streak's, or ATM's.
Not as much oophm, nor panic inducing saturation blinding and shake.

Better Velocity might help, but then anything with a lock-on is screwed up in this game.

By the time you get a lock and actually send your damage out, someone could puke out 22+30 or higher laser + Gauss in your face while your weapon has just left its tube.

Edited by Cyborne Elemental, 27 March 2024 - 01:06 PM.

[Krucilatoz]

Meep Meep, on 27 March 2024 - 11:50 AM, said:

Currently they are not very good vs fleeing evading lights. But the tb5/10 will quickly core a charging light. These are going to be strong on heavily missile quirked mechs once they get some buffs.

edit; Been having some moderate success with this fit so far. Alpha any beat up mechs to take advantage of the ct seeking and high pinpoint damage or ripple fire vs fresher mechs to keep them bouncing around their cockpit and unable to aim. The impulse for thunderbolts is pretty strong.

arc-t

Kinda wish the tempest had generic missile quirks instead of targeted.

Recently was using cyclops with 7xTB5, shooting at raven in 200ish range while he running zig-zag,
I fired my 7 TB5 in chainfire since he's in open and direct sight,
and saw nearly half of my TB-5 missed.
This rarely happened for clan ATM.
I think this because ATM fly straight, hit enemy mech sideways, while the TB5 missile are arcing down.

[Mister Smile]

When you go one on one. But i Have seen several Player sitting in the back in their TBM-Assault (mostly stalkers) pumping decent damage numbers.

And i can tell you first hand, that a constant stream of TBM5 can melt your armor pretty fast (because most of the hit you in the ct even from angles they can not hit it).

[Meep Meep]

Cyborne Elemental, on 27 March 2024 - 01:00 PM, said:

I think as a midrange 650m, 5 damage missile, they're in an odd bracket.

Its like having super Streak's, or ATM's.
Not as much oophm, nor panic inducing saturation blinding and shake.

Better Velocity might help, but then anything with a lock-on is screwed up in this game.

By the time you get a lock and actually send your damage out, someone could puke out 22+30 or higher laser + Gauss in your face while your weapon has just left its tube.

Its a support weapon system made for group play like all lock ons. Lrm work great in faction play but only for certain strats and only because the missile slingers are provided locks. Thunderbolts are the same. Get a narc/tag buddy to sacrifice some psr to provide you consistent locks and you can do some outright mech murder.

[Khale MacGregor]

Decided to try these out myself, with an ARC-T with 2 T-15's with TAG/BAP. And something I have noticed something...odd... to say the least. 90% of my shots went to the legs of my targets. even with Various ranges and targets, they all seem to be drawn toward the legs. Anyone else notice this? and yes the Damage is way too low, the Weight is way too heavy and PGI/Cauldron thinks we, as a whole, are far too dumb to know the difference.

[pattonesque]

Khale MacGregor, on 04 April 2024 - 07:04 AM, said:

Decided to try these out myself, with an ARC-T with 2 T-15's with TAG/BAP. And something I have noticed something...odd... to say the least. 90% of my shots went to the legs of my targets. even with Various ranges and targets, they all seem to be drawn toward the legs. Anyone else notice this? and yes the Damage is way too low, the Weight is way too heavy and PGI/Cauldron thinks we, as a whole, are far too dumb to know the difference.

1. I believe the spread is getting fixed
2. Is it possible the design of the weapons was an attempt to start low and buff as needed as opposed to a conspiracy directed at you personally

[Moadebe]

We can talk about buffing TBolt missiles and pulling levers every which way. The fact remains they are TOO heavy to be anything useful.

Until their tonnage is fixed overall. They will remain horrible.

[ScrapIron Prime]

Moadebe, on 04 April 2024 - 09:08 AM, said:

We can talk about buffing TBolt missiles and pulling levers every which way. The fact remains they are TOO heavy to be anything useful.

Until their tonnage is fixed overall. They will remain horrible.

Basically, yeah. The tonnage of the system was from Tabletop and reflected the tax you need to pay to do all the thunderbolt damage to a single hit location. But we don't do all their damage to one location, they're split into 5 point lots, so they hit 2-3 locations. They carried over the tonnage value but not the REASON for the tonnage value.

Still, the patch notes leak says they're getting a meaningful velocity boost. We'll see how that helps.

[Moadebe]

ScrapIron Prime, on 04 April 2024 - 09:25 AM, said:

Basically, yeah. The tonnage of the system was from Tabletop and reflected the tax you need to pay to do all the thunderbolt damage to a single hit location. But we don't do all their damage to one location, they're split into 5 point lots, so they hit 2-3 locations. They carried over the tonnage value but not the REASON for the tonnage value.

Still, the patch notes leak says they're getting a meaningful velocity boost. We'll see how that helps.

It wont help at all. Its going to be just as crap to take in comparison to other similar systems. You are sacrificing TOO much just to take them. Then they have the same issues as all the other lockon weapon systems. Until the tonnage is lowered. They will continue to be a very lackluster system. Especially in the current environment.

[ScrapIron Prime]

Moadebe, on 04 April 2024 - 10:55 AM, said:

It wont help at all. Its going to be just as crap to take in comparison to other similar systems. You are sacrificing TOO much just to take them. Then they have the same issues as all the other lockon weapon systems. Until the tonnage is lowered. They will continue to be a very lackluster system. Especially in the current environment.

Well now there's some differentiation. Thunderbolt missiles are faster than Artemis LRMs and they concentrate damage a BIT better. So after the upcoming patch:

Thunderbolt 1 - same weight as Artemis LRM 5, 1 less space.

Thunderbolt 2 - 1 more ton than Artemis LRM 10, 1 less space

Thunderbolt 3 - 3 more tons than Artemis LRM 15, 1 less space

Thunderbolt 4 - 4 more tons than Artemis LRM 20, 1 less space

So basically... The Thunderbolt 1 is a great deal. The 2 is okay. Forget the larger launchers, they're crap.

[martian]

Moadebe, on 04 April 2024 - 10:55 AM, said:

It wont help at all. Its going to be just as crap to take in comparison to other similar systems. You are sacrificing TOO much just to take them. Then they have the same issues as all the other lockon weapon systems. Until the tonnage is lowered. They will continue to be a very lackluster system. Especially in the current environment.

The upcoming ECM nerf will ensure faster locks for your TBMs; higher velocity means less time for enemy 'Mechs to hide or evade.