49 replies to this topic

[KursedVixen]

pattonesque, on 01 May 2024 - 01:16 PM, said:

ok but what does this mean exactly. Because if it's "I don't like playing a certain type of build like laservom" then there are a bunch of other effective archetypes out there

I shouldn't have to explain 'meta' to a tier 1.

[pattonesque]

KursedVixen, on 01 May 2024 - 02:44 PM, said:

I shouldn't have to explain 'meta' to a tier 1.

Purposeful obtuseness is boring. So I’ll repeat, what do you mean by “meta”? Is it a playstyle or a build philosophy or what?

[BUD LIGHT]

MarcinT1981, on 01 May 2024 - 12:41 AM, said:

What kind of stupid advice is this, shoot at the light's, one clean shot and you will kill them. Because they will be standing and waiting so that they are so easy to hit, I understand? Does this mean that server lag has disappeared? Putting Streak's on QP, seriously ******* seriously?

most lights literally only take one alpha and have to run away, its not anyone elses fault that u suck and cant aim

[Void Angel]

MagS and APG are MG replacements, functionally. They even have the same dps/slot; the advantage is that they're FLPPD with ML range - the disadvantage is that they have heat and (now) lack the MG family's crit enhancements. The heat is minimal - per shot. But their damage per heat is 4.0, consistent with most standard autocannons and less than the LB-X family. That heat adds up.

When they were inflicting MG-style enhanced crits, as I understand they were? Yeah, that was too much. Without it, though, they balance pretty well. In Quickplay, it's a buff, because it gives ballistic-armed Lights an option that's not facetime. But I took them off of my Locust because my Javelin and other 'mechs did it better, so I obviously haven't found them to be a total upgrade. Right now they feel like a good option, depending on quirks, hardpoints and play style.

[Vonbach]

BUD LIGHT, on 01 May 2024 - 03:42 PM, said:

most lights literally only take one alpha and have to run away, its not anyone elses fault that u suck and cant aim

You mean lag armor?

[kalashnikity]

martian, on 01 May 2024 - 03:02 AM, said:

If you check the attached picture, you can see that I am actually playing MechWarrior Online,
thanks for asking.

https://i.imgur.com/4pYiNKx.jpg

You can not obtain the depicted OmniMech without playing MWO.

Are the numbers, that I posted in my previous post, correct or incorrect?

Other players can hit light 'Mechs. Interesting, is not it?

The server lag is not as horrible as some people make it.

If you can not aim and hit light 'Mechs with other weapons, then you really should try Streak SRMs that do aiming for you.

Looks photoshopped, I can tell by some of the pixels, and from seeing a lot of photoshops in my time.

[kalashnikity]

Gasboy, on 01 May 2024 - 05:27 AM, said:

According to Jarl's list, martian's in the top 2k, and got in almost 300 games in March. At ten games a day, I'd say that counts as 'playing' MWO.

You're in tier 1 using lag as a defense at not being able to shoot lights? Yeesh, I guess the tier bar doesn't mean anything after all.

Jarl's? 1358th place in April, Woot!

Yes, I have actually been trying hard, and I haven't been out of my Atlas K3 in so long it is starting to smell like Darth Vader's Tie fighter after Luke blew up the Death Star.

[kalashnikity]

An6ryMan69, on 01 May 2024 - 07:40 AM, said:

Advice from someone who is not in Tier 1 and so is probably more relevant to many players.

When you come across a dangerous light mech that you don't think you can handle, quickly put as many friendly mechs between you and the light as you can, call out to your team the location of the red light, and let the guys giving "Just shoot the light" advice, go ahead and deal with it themselves. Then move on to supporting your team by taking on bad guys you can kill.

Seriously.

I don't know how often it happens in Tier 1-2, but at lower tiers, besides being able to dance around slower single mechs highly effectively, a single light brawling it out with even a whole group of bigger mechs can create major problems for the bigger mechs, and we often see the last remaining red team mech, a flea or piranha or something, being set upon by 3-6 blue team mechs at the same time, and the little bugger can still be brutal to eventually kill, and may even get a kill or two itself, while being badly outnumbered.

For many Tier 3-5 players, the "Just shoot the light" advice is basically nonsense because if people were capable of doing that, they would not be posting here in the first place. Hence why there are sometimes strong responses to being told this.

That's like telling someone who is asking you financial advice to "Just be rich."

You just hit on one of the key tenets of this game, don't run off by yourself unless you think you are the fasted person on the map, AND are built to brawl another light if you find out you are wrong about being the fastest on the map. Running around alone in an Arctic Cheetah with 2 ERLL is a good way to end up dead, no matter how mobile they are.

Anything slower than a fast light, if you are by yourself, lol, good luck.

[martian]

Gustav Kuriga, on 01 May 2024 - 11:46 AM, said:

martian probably also thought MGs were perfectly alright when they were first introduced.

You are invited to post such link where I am saying that.

Gustav Kuriga, on 01 May 2024 - 11:46 AM, said:

Most of the top players I've seen are the ******** who think that point and click adventure is the best kind of gameplay for the health of the game.

In my opinion, the point of playing MWO is to win the game and kill enemy 'Mechs. Pointing and clicking on enemy 'Mechs is a part of it. Any problem with it?

Gustav Kuriga, on 01 May 2024 - 11:46 AM, said:

They're [Most of the top players] the dipshits who put two points of armor on their back then complain about lights stripping their back and weapons.

You are invited to post links to forum posts where top players say that they "put two points of armor on their back then complain about lights stripping their back and weapons.".

Thank you.

[Gasboy]

Gustav Kuriga, on 01 May 2024 - 11:46 AM, said:

martian probably also thought MGs were perfectly alright when they were first introduced. Most of the top players I've seen are the ******** who think that point and click adventure is the best kind of gameplay for the health of the game. They're the dipshits who put two points of armor on their back then complain about lights stripping their back and weapons.

My point there was two-fold. They obviously play MWO, and they are doing quite well doing so. Who cares if they complain? I doubt they have issues with light mechs often.

[Gasboy]

KursedVixen, on 01 May 2024 - 12:57 PM, said:

some people don't like playing meta....

If you're a good player, you can make less efficient builds work.

But meta is always the most efficient build. People can dislike it, but the one inescapable fact is that there will always be meta. If you want to play less efficient builds, feel free. But if you like purposefully hampering yourself, you have less leg to stand on when you complain.

[Samziel]

KursedVixen, on 01 May 2024 - 02:44 PM, said:

I shouldn't have to explain 'meta' to a tier 1.

You really do need to explain meta to T1. Because your idea of it likely differs from ours.

Quicksilver Aberration, on 01 May 2024 - 02:10 PM, said:

The irony is that most people that are "anti-meta" don't even know what the meta is, because popular =/= powerful especially when the tiers you play against regularly are the same "anti-meta" vein of players.

It's even more apparent if they think good players are part of the "blue lightsaber brigade" when they fail to realize, there's a significant chunk of the population that doesn't even play QP anymore and only play comp but also that most of us prefer midrange over blue lightsabers for QP farming.

Agreed. Midrange feels much more consistent than snipers with how QP plays.

Gustav Kuriga, on 01 May 2024 - 11:46 AM, said:

martian probably also thought MGs were perfectly alright when they were first introduced. Most of the top players I've seen are the ******** who think that point and click adventure is the best kind of gameplay for the health of the game. They're the dipshits who put two points of armor on their back then complain about lights stripping their back and weapons.

Most weapons are point and click. Few are "point roughly towards the enemy". Feel like the former is more healthy mechanic wise.

If a light gets behind me thats on me. Positioning is the best back armor. Front towards enemy.

Edited by Samziel, 02 May 2024 - 12:53 PM.

[ScrapIron Prime]

MarcinT1981, on 01 May 2024 - 12:41 AM, said:

Maybe you should start playing MWO instead of just sitting on the forum and looking at the numbers in the lab.
Previously, before MAGSHOT/APGauss was introduced, micro lights did not have the ability to deal instant damage from 300m.

Far be it from me to stop a juicy rant in process, but you DO know that you can put things besides MG's and micro lasers on clan fish, right? A PIR-3 with 10 ERSL hits pretty hard from 300m. Twice, then it fades away to cool down.

[torsie]

I am sorry, this was not supposed to be this long.

I am not super good player, so that does not mean I am 100% correct, but I think that might be part of the problem.

I do not think they are super strong, I can do more damage with my flea with machine guns, rockets and laser, than I do with gauss guns, but it is much harder to play well with that, while gauss guns allow me to do lot of damage whenever I click on something.

That might be problem for both, people who are using these tiny gauss guns and people who are getting shot at. If I use machine guns, I need to stay around my target, I need to aim whole time, so if I am moving, moving fast or mech I am looking at is moving, I do not do much damage.

But when I use gauss guns, I can only click and disappear, yes I am bad, I can not hit Atlas standing right in front of me, but people who can hit Flea with 150km/h speed almost do not exist.
Chance of getting someone like that in 23 people is very small and there is still chance they will be on your team.
And before someone turns around and finds nearest wall I am already away.

But when I play my flea with machine guns, I need to stay around target for much longer time to do same damage, there is much bigger chance I will get hit by something, maybe someone comes to help, but with gauss guns I do the same damage and disappear, moving backwards faster than many mechs move forwards.

I can easily carry 8 of them, giving myself AC15 at 4 tons, there is nothing coming even close to this, that is same as new "light" AC2 but 8 times more damage. And for clans it is only 1 slot.

I would not mind if they get some upgrades, maybe range or cooldown or more ammo quirks or something, but I think they need to be bigger or heavier, definitely bigger for clans. We have 0,25 ton weapon, maybe they can be 0,75 tons so you need more of them to make it worth it.
Or maybe ghost heat, so mechs can not shoot so many of them at once.

I like them, we need more tiny weapons for tiny mechs, it is boring using only lasers or machine guns, but I think light mechs running around with AC20 is definitely little scary and I use them even on big mechs too.

Now we need even more tiny guns, maybe machine guns could use some reworks, since Light Machine Gun is universally very good, make more differences between those 3 machine guns. And something like MRM1 with 0,2 seconds cooldown, so we have rocket machine gun!

Edited by torsie, 02 May 2024 - 01:42 PM.

[East Indy]

torsie, on 02 May 2024 - 01:28 PM, said:

I can easily carry 8 of them, giving myself AC15 at 4 tons, there is nothing coming even close to this, that is same as new "light" AC2 but 8 times more damage. And for clans it is only 1 slot.

As usual, it's not the weapon itself that's a problem -- it's boating, if for no other reason than chassis are divided into haves and have-nots.

[RockmachinE]

pattonesque, on 01 May 2024 - 02:48 PM, said:

Purposeful obtuseness is boring. So I’ll repeat, what do you mean by “meta”? Is it a playstyle or a build philosophy or what?

I'm not even part of this debate, but this struck me as particularly goofy.

Meta is whatever is most effective at the moment. Every game has a meta.

[pattonesque]

RockmachinE, on 03 May 2024 - 02:46 AM, said:

I'm not even part of this debate, but this struck me as particularly goofy.

Meta is whatever is most effective at the moment. Every game has a meta.

sure. I just want to know what this guy *believes* is the current meta

[BLXKNTRR]

Gasboy, on 02 May 2024 - 03:37 AM, said:

If you're a good player, you can make less efficient builds work.

But meta is always the most efficient build. People can dislike it, but the one inescapable fact is that there will always be meta. If you want to play less efficient builds, feel free. But if you like purposefully hampering yourself, you have less leg to stand on when you complain.

THE PROBLEM isnt the op skill, its the new weapons. He will need to "get good" I agree, but only so far as that means adjusting to the new reality of the situation; Finding a loadout for his mech, or another mech(s) that can better deal with light mechs packing the pin point new weapons.

I would suggest he try heavy or assault mechs with faster torso turn speeds.

[feeWAIVER]

AP gauss /magshot is fine.
Stacking 8 of them + ammo is comparable to a snub.

Has the OP never encountered a snub locust, snub flea, snub urbie?

[pattonesque]

feeWAIVER, on 03 May 2024 - 09:59 AM, said:

AP gauss /magshot is fine.
Stacking 8 of them + ammo is comparable to a snub.

Has the OP never encountered a snub locust, snub flea, snub urbie?

the OP was recently killed by an AP gauss/magshot build and he's one of those folks where the most recent thing that killed him while he flailed and panicked is overpowered and unfair