14 replies to this topic

[marakesh]

Can we get some non burst fire versions of ballistics for clan mechs. I hate the burst fire mechanic it spreads damage more than a single shot. It also seams to do less damage considering i have hit a Kitfox with IS ac20 and killed it in 2 shots where as i have shot the same mech with BF 6 times and not kill.

[KursedVixen]

marakesh, on 02 May 2024 - 04:16 PM, said:

Can we get some non burst fire versions of ballistics for clan mechs. I hate the burst fire mechanic it spreads damage more than a single shot. It also seams to do less damage considering i have hit a Kitfox with IS ac20 and killed it in 2 shots where as i have shot the same mech with BF 6 times and not kill.

the only thing we have currently is the slug shot LBX marked as C-ac2 C-ac-5 C ac-10 and c-ac20 they fire one less compared to their ultra versions and are bigger but never jam and have higher velocity. though i do wish the clan ultra 5 didn't fire in burst either.

technicall other than lasers and mgs all clan weapons fire in burst. though the beam laser is a new execption to that.

Edited by KursedVixen, 02 May 2024 - 06:52 PM.

[Wraith 1]

marakesh, on 02 May 2024 - 04:16 PM, said:

I hate the burst fire mechanic it spreads damage more than a single shot.

That's the entire point. It's a disadvantage to make up for the reduced weight and increased range compared to the IS version. If you want to get all the damage in the same spot, use the bulkier IS weapons or make a much more difficult shot. The C-AC/2 and C-AC/5 got this disadvantage removed and now they're a direct upgrade (on paper) in almost all circumstances.

Quote

It also seams to do less damage considering i have hit a Kitfox with IS ac20 and killed it in 2 shots where as i have shot the same mech with BF 6 times and not kill.

They do the same total damage, it just looks lower when you don't the land the hits in the same spot. And you did not kill a Kitfox from full health with 2 shots from any AC/20 unless you got a double headshot or got really lucky with critical hits, both of which don't count for durability comparison purposes for obvious reasons. A properly built KFX has more than 40 structure AND 40 armor on the CT.

[kalashnikity]

marakesh, on 02 May 2024 - 04:16 PM, said:

Can we get some non burst fire versions of ballistics for clan mechs. I hate the burst fire mechanic it spreads damage more than a single shot. It also seams to do less damage considering i have hit a Kitfox with IS ac20 and killed it in 2 shots where as i have shot the same mech with BF 6 times and not kill.

^^^ Agreed. Even the Clan AC10 fires two bullets, it's very annoying. ripping off 3 bullets in a Clan AC20 is reduculous, especially since the UAC20 only fired 4.

cAC10 needs to have a one bullet version and cAC20 needs (at minimum) a 2 bullet version so it fires like the current cAC10

Lore rates autocannons based on damage, not caliber of weapon or number of bullets. So you could have an AC20 that fires 20 bullets that each do one damage and with the same bullet spacing as the cAC10.

Talk about an easy weapon to add, this is a no-brainer. Won't even need balance passes.

Might as well toss in an inner sphere AC20 that fires 20 x one point damage projectiles as well as IS "burst fire" versions of ac10, ac5, and ac2.

Wraith 1, on 02 May 2024 - 06:58 PM, said:

That's the entire point. It's a disadvantage to make up for the reduced weight and increased range compared to the IS version. If you want to get all the damage in the same spot, use the bulkier IS weapons or make a much more difficult shot. The C-AC/2 and C-AC/5 got this disadvantage removed and now they're a direct upgrade (on paper) in almost all circumstances.



They do the same total damage, it just looks lower when you don't the land the hits in the same spot. And you did not kill a Kitfox from full health with 2 shots from any AC/20 unless you got a double headshot or got really lucky with critical hits, both of which don't count for durability comparison purposes for obvious reasons. A properly built KFX has more than 40 structure AND 40 armor on the CT.

if you are worried about balance, add a few tenths of a second to reload time, or nerf range slightly. Note that IS LBx cannons have a significant range advantage.

[CFC Conky]

marakesh, on 02 May 2024 - 04:16 PM, said:

Can we get some non burst fire versions of ballistics for clan mechs. I hate the burst fire mechanic it spreads damage more than a single shot. It also seams to do less damage considering i have hit a Kitfox with IS ac20 and killed it in 2 shots where as i have shot the same mech with BF 6 times and not kill.

I suppose it depends on whether or not one considers this an inconvenience or a game-breaking mechanic.

Good hunting,
CFC Conky

[torsie]

I am bad at aiming and that is why I do not like Clan ACs shooting more projectiles, I almost always use LBX.

I would not mind having access to both Clan AC and normal AC that is heaver/bigger/bigger cooldown/more heat/shorter range, but shoots 1 or less projectiles.

I think those new PAC guns were perfect opportunity to give clans single shot weapons. And it would be fun, because we do not have canons doing 4 or 8 damage.

[KursedVixen]

CFC Conky, on 05 May 2024 - 10:45 AM, said:

I suppose it depends on whether or not one considers this an inconvenience or a game-breaking mechanic.

Good hunting,
CFC Conky

with how bad hit registry is i can see it being a problem.
I think at the least the Clan UAc5 should fire one shell the uac 10 and 20 i think are fine...

torsie, on 05 May 2024 - 11:10 AM, said:

I am bad at aiming and that is why I do not like Clan ACs shooting more projectiles, I almost always use LBX.

I would not mind having access to both Clan AC and normal AC that is heaver/bigger/bigger cooldown/more heat/shorter range, but shoots 1 or less projectiles.

I think those new PAC guns were perfect opportunity to give clans single shot weapons. And it would be fun, because we do not have canons doing 4 or 8 damage.

THe PAc 8 fires 2 shells that do 4 damage each, so pac 8 is DOA if you don't like burst fire just use a couple 4's or a 5.

kalashnikity, on 05 May 2024 - 09:38 AM, said:

if you are worried about balance, add a few tenths of a second to reload time, or nerf range slightly. Note that IS LBx cannons have a significant range advantage.

The IS LBX Do not have a range advantage they have a velocity advantage on the lbx 20 also all Inner sphere ERPPC has a velocity advantage over it's clan counterpart.

torsie, on 05 May 2024 - 11:10 AM, said:

I am bad at aiming and that is why I do not like Clan ACs shooting more projectiles, I almost always use LBX.

I would not mind having access to both Clan AC and normal AC that is heaver/bigger/bigger cooldown/more heat/shorter range, but shoots 1 or less projectiles.

I think those new PAC guns were perfect opportunity to give clans single shot weapons. And it would be fun, because we do not have canons doing 4 or 8 damage.

C-ac2 c-ac5

C-ac10 fires one less bullet same with the c-ac20

also Is has Mrms that can do damage at point blank range up to i think 40 damage total if all missiles hit but they are spread fire lbx like weapons.

also IS has a heavy ppc that does 15 damage while the clan one only does 10 +5 splash at much longer range.

If you don't like burst I suppose you can just drop clan mechs entirely and only use IS mechs..

Edited by KursedVixen, 05 May 2024 - 11:49 AM.

[CFC Conky]

KursedVixen, on 05 May 2024 - 11:37 AM, said:

with how bad hit registry is i can see it being a problem.
I think at the least the Clan UAc5 should fire one shell the uac 10 and 20 i think are fine...

…

Ok, fair enough.

Good hunting,
CFC Conky

[LordNothing]

damn it stop killing my staccato. burst fire autos sound better.

also bad hit detection, is a 1 in 1000 thing, its hardly game breaking. and removing burst fire only reduces the granularity of missed damage. if you miss be it lag, bad hit detection, or lack of skill, your ac20 becomes an ac0. with a four round burst, missing only the first (as your aim settles), you get an ac15. this is actually preferable in shoot'n'scoot situations (aim is more messy due to maneuvers and terrain), and in slow close quarters situations (eg assaults brawling) it doesnt matter unless your aim is extremely bad. it might start mattering around the 5 class guns where ranges get longer, still pretty hard to miss with 10s burst fire or otherwise.

id have liked more burstiness out of lacs/pacs, because the platforms they are best on are lights and mediums where shoot'n'scoot is preferable. if you put 8 lac5s or pac4s on a 100 tonner, and you can, its probibly better that its not a ppfld. even on ultraviolet/juggernaut builds i still split my guns in 2 groups and fire in an alternating pattern because im usually leading targets at a distance and it helps reduce the error.

Edited by LordNothing, 05 May 2024 - 12:29 PM.

[KursedVixen]

LordNothing, on 05 May 2024 - 11:58 AM, said:

damn it stop killing my staccato. burst fire autos sound better.

If only it were just a visual effect and actually it was only one shot. at least on the c-uac5

Edited by KursedVixen, 05 May 2024 - 12:18 PM.

[Gasboy]

marakesh, on 02 May 2024 - 04:16 PM, said:

Can we get some non burst fire versions of ballistics for clan mechs. I hate the burst fire mechanic it spreads damage more than a single shot. It also seams to do less damage considering i have hit a Kitfox with IS ac20 and killed it in 2 shots where as i have shot the same mech with BF 6 times and not kill.

Nah, it should remain as is. Each tech base should have some advantages and disadvantages over the other. I enjoy IS ACs, where as I prefer Clan laser tech over IS. Clan LBX is pretty good, though.

[kalashnikity]

KursedVixen, on 05 May 2024 - 11:37 AM, said:

with how bad hit registry is i can see it being a problem.
I think at the least the Clan UAc5 should fire one shell the uac 10 and 20 i think are fine...

THe PAc 8 fires 2 shells that do 4 damage each, so pac 8 is DOA if you don't like burst fire just use a couple 4's or a 5.

The IS LBX Do not have a range advantage they have a velocity advantage on the lbx 20 also all Inner sphere ERPPC has a velocity advantage over it's clan counterpart.

C-ac2 c-ac5

C-ac10 fires one less bullet same with the c-ac20

also Is has Mrms that can do damage at point blank range up to i think 40 damage total if all missiles hit but they are spread fire lbx like weapons.

also IS has a heavy ppc that does 15 damage while the clan one only does 10 +5 splash at much longer range.

If you don't like burst I suppose you can just drop clan mechs entirely and only use IS mechs..

lol, LBX has far more range, LBX-2 reaches 2400m without buffs. Meaning it can reach almost ~3000m on certain mechs

Edited by kalashnikity, 08 May 2024 - 08:38 PM.

[DarkBazerker]

I'm sorry why is this an issue?

[Bassault]

It's never going to happen. Assault mechs can best use ballistics due to their tonnage so ballistics (except magshots and ap gauss ofc) need to remain very bad according to the cauldron's diktat. Don't bother, just pick something faster and use lasers.

Don't believe me? Go to the cauldron feedback server, go ask them to buff the projectile delay and/or volley fire.

kalashnikity, on 05 May 2024 - 09:38 AM, said:

if you are worried about balance, add a few tenths of a second to reload time, or nerf range slightly. Note that IS LBx cannons have a significant range advantage.

The range does not matter in the slightest if it spreads everywhere due to the buckshot.

Edited by Bassault, 10 May 2024 - 02:32 PM.

[KursedVixen]

reguardless i still think the clan uac 5 should fire one shot like the is one, the uac 10 and 20 are fine though.