264 replies to this topic

[RockmachinE]

I play non meta mechs, play like an idiot and still can't drop to T2 for the life of me.

[Void Angel]

MrMadguy, on 20 December 2024 - 02:30 AM, said:

No, it doesn't work this way. I don't need Shadowhawks, Shadow Cats, Shadow anything. If I want to play Bullshark - I buy Bullshark and play it. If Assaults are gimped in this game - then, well, it's just about devs shotting at their own leg.

Are you trying to gain a reputation as an idiot? Because it is working. Nobody told you that you have to play any 'mech - and everything I said works exactly the way I said it. And that Bullshark that you're whining about? It's one of the most powerful chassis in the game! My Bullsharks are very powerful - and guess what? I don't play them "meta" either! Heck, my favorite Stone Rhino build is an SR-4 named Stumbles - I won't bother to link anything you're not going to actually look at, but you won't find his build on GrimMechs.

But if you really want to die on the "Assaults are 'gimped'" hill, well, feel free to keep on embarrassing yourself. That is the most disconnected thing from reality I may have ever heard on these forums, and that's saying a LOT. At this point, it's clear that you're just skimming posts for keywords and making things up to generate a retort - it's like arguing with a chat bot. You've made false claims about how the matchmaker works and been corrected - you have ignored the corrections. You've made complaints about game balance - and responded by stamping your foot and screaming, "no, no, NO!" when you even (mistakenly) think a build has been suggested to you. You're not doing yourself any favors by acting this way.

Edited by Void Angel, 20 December 2024 - 04:00 AM.

[Void Angel]

The TL;DR is that none of your complaints are valid. The matchmaker works fine, Assaults are not (heh) imbalanced (can't even say that with a straight face,) and all of your problems are wearing your underwear even as you read this post.

[martian]

MrMadguy, on 19 December 2024 - 10:42 PM, said:

Meta isn't "right" way to play game. Meta is actually wrong. It's imbalance, created by incompetent devs. There are just two kinds of people. Ones, who simply adapt to situation, they live in.

Meta is not "right" or "wrong". Meta simply is. Meta is a way of designing 'Mechs that are efficient. Meta is a way of playing that leads to the best results.

The old proverb says "You can't kill the meta, you can only change it". After you change various stats, quirks, maps, etc., some new Meta emerges inevitably.

MrMadguy, on 19 December 2024 - 10:42 PM, said:

And others, who have true free minds and therefore want to break through from that dead loop.

You think that running LRM assault 'Mechs around the map is a sign of a "true free mind". All right. As I wrote in my first reply, PSR is simply doing its job and moving you to a Tier filled with players who use such loadouts and use the same tactics. Everything works as designed.

By the way, why is running certain 'Mechs "dead loop" and running other 'Mechs "true free mind"?

MrMadguy, on 19 December 2024 - 10:42 PM, said:

Simple thing. How many 'Mechs do we have? How many 'Mech variants do we have? How many weapons do we have? What % is actually usable? I want to play, what I buy. And I buy, what I like. Without it game is pointless. Because I earn CBs and should spend them on something. There is nothing else to spend them on, than on buying new 'Mechs. And without proper balance - it's purchasing for collection purposes only.

By all means, play what you buy. PSR is moving you to a Tier filled with the players who buy and run such 'Mechs with the ultimate goal of giving you balanced games.

MrMadguy, on 19 December 2024 - 10:42 PM, said:

Devs don't even understand, that they actually have terrible business model. They say "Buy shiny new Bullshark/Bane". But they don't tell their players, that their current Meta - is shorty Lights/Mediums, that are way too small for firepower they have, like Shadow Cat, Piranha, etc. And what their players end up with - is disappointment.

Yes, you hate light 'Mechs. You have already told us that before. You keep telling us how OP light 'Mechs are, while you ignore everything that does not fit into your opinion.

The only problem is that the data, that I have seen, show that light 'Mechs have actually the worst stats in the game.

MrMadguy, on 19 December 2024 - 10:42 PM, said:

I don't ask to fix each and every build in this game. It's impossible due to historical reasons. Because game was tabletop, where things like armor worked properly. And now we have historical values, that don't work at all. For example armor should be doubled or tripled to work as intended.

Have you ever actually played the desktop BattleTech?

MrMadguy, on 19 December 2024 - 10:42 PM, said:

But at least if I play sub-par build, that isn't Meta

I also play non-meta Centurion

Have I not told you that you can be successful even in non-meta 'Mechs?

MrMadguy, on 19 December 2024 - 10:42 PM, said:

matchmaker should allow it via auto-balancing game according to "Noobs only play vs noobs and pros only play vs pros" principle.

Do you consider yourself - after 10 years of playing, while being in Tier 4 - "noob" or "pro"?

MrMadguy, on 19 December 2024 - 10:42 PM, said:

Devs usually scared by good matchmaker and sometimes even intentionally refuse to make due to one simple reason. They don't want to reward players for being "bad". But they don't understand, that it kills their game. Because only 1% of top players can be truly "good". And it's exact playerbase, they end up with.

You get rewards that you deserve. You know how many C-Bills you get for every kill, every assist, capture, etc. If your contribution is low, you get low rewards. If you contribute significantly, you are going to be highly rewarded. Working as designed.

[pbiggz]

MrMadguy, on 19 December 2024 - 10:42 PM, said:

Meta isn't "right" way to play game. Meta is actually wrong. It's imbalance, created by incompetent devs. There are just two kinds of people. Ones, who simply adapt to situation, they live in. And others, who have true free minds and therefore want to break through from that dead loop.

So in other words, you think that if you can't play whatever jank you want you're actively being sabotaged.

Not to be overly blunt, but that's made up. Every game has a meta. Even the PVE games had a meta, you could just ignore it there. Here, where you have to actually test your skills against other humans, some of which may actually be sapient and self aware, you have no such luxury.

That's not an attack on you personally. That's not evil devs and conniving balance committees rubbing their hands together in smoke filled backrooms because they want to specifically screw you over personally. That's just the nature of a PVP video game. If you can't accept that then I think you should probably play something else. You'll be happier for it.

MrMadguy, on 19 December 2024 - 10:42 PM, said:

Simple thing. How many 'Mechs do we have? How many 'Mech variants do we have? How many weapons do we have? What % is actually usable? I want to play, what I buy. And I buy, what I like. Without it game is pointless. Because I earn CBs and should spend them on something. There is nothing else to spend them on, than on buying new 'Mechs. And without proper balance - it's purchasing for collection purposes only.

The cauldron, which you seem to spend a lot of time and energy hating, devotes a lot of time to shoring up and fixing old, underplayed mechs. There's a lot of jank in this game that is playable only by the grace of the cauldron. The meta was FAR more exclusive and unforgiving under Paul Inouye and Chris Lowrey's watch. Its kind of funny that your memory is short enough to not remember that.

MrMadguy, on 19 December 2024 - 10:42 PM, said:

Devs don't even understand, that they actually have terrible business model. They say "Buy shiny new Bullshark/Bane". But they don't tell their players, that their current Meta - is shorty Lights/Mediums, that are way too small for firepower they have, like Shadow Cat, Piranha, etc. And what their players end up with - is disappointment.

I don't think you have the background necessary to comment on the developers competency. PGI has had a checkered past but frankly the work they do today vastly outshines the work they did a decade ago.

MrMadguy, on 19 December 2024 - 10:42 PM, said:

I don't ask to fix each and every build in this game. It's impossible due to historical reasons. Because game was tabletop, where things like armor worked properly. And now we have historical values, that don't work at all. For example armor should be doubled or tripled to work as intended. But at least if I play sub-par build, that isn't Meta, matchmaker should allow it via auto-balancing game according to "Noobs only play vs noobs and pros only play vs pros" principle.

There is virtually no useful balancing decisions you can make that come from table top. The only people who think tabletop is a real guideline for balance are tabletop adherents from days of yore who hate anyone below the age of 45.

MrMadguy, on 19 December 2024 - 10:42 PM, said:

Devs usually scared by good matchmaker and sometimes even intentionally refuse to make due to one simple reason. They don't want to reward players for being "bad". But they don't understand, that it kills their game. Because only 1% of top players can be truly "good". And it's exact playerbase, they end up with.

You are not being punished. You need to get a grip. You have made this same post every couple of months for years.

[Samziel]

MrMadguy, on 19 December 2024 - 10:42 PM, said:

I don't ask to fix each and every build in this game. It's impossible due to historical reasons. Because game was tabletop, where things like armor worked properly. And now we have historical values, that don't work at all. For example armor should be doubled or tripled to work as intended. But at least if I play sub-par build, that isn't Meta, matchmaker should allow it via auto-balancing game according to "Noobs only play vs noobs and pros only play vs pros" principle.

Armor is already doubled from TT. One ton gives 32 points of armor, not 16. In addition, a ton of mechs have extra armor or structure in quirks.

Like others have said no matter what you do to balance, a meta always forms. But, in this game it is very diverse. And as long as you build your mech well, you can bring fairly much any gun and excel.

Edited by Samziel, 20 December 2024 - 07:26 AM.

[Bassault]

It's settled then. Continue to refuse to adapt and learn. When you change your mind you'll seek out the real answers.

[Saved By The Bell]

He is not entirely wrong.

When I go high, I am with weak teammates, mm waits me to whipe their asses, which I unable to do. And opposite side is 4 man-group, communication in real time. Just watch Sean Lang. How they communicating and farming.

Yeah you can say, Save is s*ck, as our great super star toxic ASH telling. But even TTB is in bad mood and you hear his "rotato potato" song. And DATA speaks in barbaric hot language.

So, sometimes you cant do anything, just shut down and go rest. ITS NOT YOUR FAULT!

The true is, to go up and stay there you need very good mech+some skills or full support of your own premade team. Its cold an no fun there.

I understand your feelings. I like play strange builds, train and check them in fight. So, game usually doesnt allow such sweet thing, you ll be punished. Like I played 4 ppc Orion, because I found ac20+ snubs Orion boring. So game punished me. 4 PPC Orion not for tier 1.

Edited by Saved By The Bell, 20 December 2024 - 09:11 AM.

[nanashi0110]

I have a lot of frustrations with MMS, but I don't think we should take it too seriously because there is no such thing as a so-called ranked match in this game.
Of course, there are times when I get sick of being placed on a ****** team and having to play nauseating matches over and over again...

[crazytimes]

nanashi0110, on 20 December 2024 - 12:06 PM, said:

I have a lot of frustrations with MMS, but I don't think we should take it too seriously because there is no such thing as a so-called ranked match in this game.
Of course, there are times when I get sick of being placed on a ****** team and having to play nauseating matches over and over again...

If I get locked in synch with a group I'm not enjoying, I just stop playing for a bit. Ultimately it's a game for fun. If you're not having fun then move on.

For me it's more about the personalities than skill. Throw groups in trash builds are a personality problem, not a skill issue. People playing alts that crap on team mates for not meat shielding their play styles... Personality issue.

If it's a case of an actual elite group, even if they're in the other side, well that's a learning opportunity and happy to keep playing. Learning is fun.

[Void Angel]

Saved By The Bell, on 20 December 2024 - 08:04 AM, said:

He is not entirely wrong.

When I go high, I am with weak teammates, mm waits me to whipe their asses, which I unable to do. And opposite side is 4 man-group, communication in real time. Just watch Sean Lang. How they communicating and farming.

The matchmaker doesn't want anything, though. That's just the luck of the draw, as they say in poker. Madguy takes the fact that uneven matchups occur, and uses it to conclude that everything is broken - and that it's not his fault that he plays badly. That claim really is entirely wrong.

PS: MrMadguy's Jarl's data lists him at a 0.95 win/loss ratio. He's currently Tier 4, and moving toward Tier 5.

The matchmaker is working perfectly.

[MrMadguy]

It's just warning. You can keep pretending, that everything is ok and that it's my fault. That I'm idiot, yeah. But I'm 100% serious. There are many players like me. They just aren't vocal enough to tell real truth. This game is almost dead. Because what happens with matchmaking in Tier 4 is beyond ridiculous. It's Tier 1 affiliate now. You should clearly understand one thing. Situation isn't static. Situation becomes worse and worse. Matchmaking was ok before release of Clans. So, what? I wasn't that bad back in old times, but all of a sudden I'm too bad now? May be problem isn't with me then? Then MM quality was fluctuating. Sometimes it was good, but sometimes bad. First it was Tier 3, that turned into affiliate of hell on earth. So I dropped to purgatory between Tier 3 and 4, where I was floating for months, because Tier 3 was too good for me, while Tier 4 too bad. And now it's Tier 4. Not only quality of matches is bad here. If it's real truth, that all those losses happen due to me, then what? I'm the only Tier 3 player there? All other players in Tier 4 are already Tier 1-2s? What's next? Tier 5? Yeah? I really doubt, that game will survive it.

Edited by MrMadguy, 21 December 2024 - 10:33 AM.

[RockmachinE]

This guy is just f*king with ya'll at this point.

[pbiggz]

You can lead a horse to water but you cant make him stop using his battletech special mixed range centurion on single fire mode

[crazytimes]

MrMadguy, on 21 December 2024 - 10:32 AM, said:

it's my fault. That I'm idiot, yeah. But I'm 100% serious.

K.

Quote

There are many players like me. They just aren't vocal enough to tell real truth. This game is almost dead. Because what happens with matchmaking in Tier 4 is beyond ridiculous. It's Tier 1 affiliate now. You should clearly understand one thing. Situation isn't static. Situation becomes worse and worse. Matchmaking was ok before release of Clans. So, what? I wasn't that bad back in old times, but all of a sudden I'm too bad now? May be problem isn't with me then? Then MM quality was fluctuating. Sometimes it was good, but sometimes bad. First it was Tier 3, that turned into affiliate of hell on earth. So I dropped to purgatory between Tier 3 and 4, where I was floating for months, because Tier 3 was in too good for me, while Tier 4 too bad. And now it's Tier 4. Not only quality of matches is bad here. If it's real truth, that all those losses happen due to me, then what? I'm the only Tier 3 player there? All other players in Tier 4 are already Tier 1-2s? What's next? Tier 5? Yeah? I really doubt, that game will survive it.

It's not so much that you're bad, it's the refusal to accept responsibility that is why people are making fun of you.

I am absolutely confident I could make a new account and using just c-bills mechs solo run it up to tier 1 in a couple of days. I'm not even particularly good. I've just learnt how to not be a potato and if I'm doing poorly, self reflect on what I did wrong and improve . If the rest of the team play poorly, that just means you should find it easier to stand out as not poor.

In your case, the team isn't the problem though.

[Quicksilver Aberration]

If there's one constant in any PvP game, it's that people will use balance and the matchmaker as scapegoats for them being horrible at the game.

[martian]

MrMadguy, on 21 December 2024 - 10:32 AM, said:

It's just warning. You can keep pretending, that everything is ok and that it's my fault. That I'm idiot, yeah. But I'm 100% serious. There are many players like me. They just aren't vocal enough to tell real truth. This game is almost dead. Because what happens with matchmaking in Tier 4 is beyond ridiculous. It's Tier 1 affiliate now. You should clearly understand one thing. Situation isn't static. Situation becomes worse and worse.

You mean, because you are being moved to a lower Tier?

PSR is simply doing its work: It sees that usually you fare worse than other players, so it tries to move you to Tier 5, i.e. to the Tier with the players of your skill level who run loadouts similar to your and play similarly.

MrMadguy, on 21 December 2024 - 10:32 AM, said:

Matchmaking was ok before release of Clans.

Seriously?

When players like Proton massacred low-skilled players as if they were on the fairground shooting gallery?

You really call such matchmaking "ok"?

MrMadguy, on 21 December 2024 - 10:32 AM, said:

So, what? I wasn't that bad back in old times, but all of a sudden I'm too bad now?

Your performance "back in old times" is irrelevant in the current discussion.

Your performance here and now is what matters.

MrMadguy, on 21 December 2024 - 10:32 AM, said:

May be problem isn't with me then? Then MM quality was fluctuating. Sometimes it was good, but sometimes bad. First it was Tier 3, that turned into affiliate of hell on earth. So I dropped to purgatory between Tier 3 and 4, where I was floating for months, because Tier 3 was too good for me, while Tier 4 too bad. And now it's Tier 4. Not only quality of matches is bad here. If it's real truth, that all those losses happen due to me, then what? I'm the only Tier 3 player there? All other players in Tier 4 are already Tier 1-2s? What's next? Tier 5? Yeah? I really doubt, that game will survive it.

PSR is simply doing its job. Whenever PSR sees that a player does not fit in some particular Tier, it attempts to move him to some other more fitting Tier.

And this is exactly your case.

If you want to stop it, you should change something. If you do not care, it is possible that you will end up in Tier 5, where you will probably face other players of your skill level.

[MrMadguy]

martian, on 21 December 2024 - 12:28 PM, said:

PSR is simply doing its job. Whenever PSR sees that a player does not fit in some particular Tier, it attempts to move him to some other more fitting Tier.

And this is exactly your case.

If you want to stop it, you should change something. If you do not care, it is possible that you will end up in Tier 5, where you will probably face other players of your skill level.

Why it happens so slowly? If I'm obviously the worst player in this game, then may be it would be reasonable to just move me to Tier 7 already?

[martian]

MrMadguy, on 21 December 2024 - 12:46 PM, said:

Why it happens so slowly?

Slowly, but steadily.

MrMadguy, on 21 December 2024 - 12:46 PM, said:

If I'm obviously the worst player in this game

I do not remember anybody saying such thing in this thread.

MrMadguy, on 21 December 2024 - 12:46 PM, said:

then may be it would be reasonable to just move me to Tier 7 already?

There is no Tier 7, but if you do not do something, you could end up in Tier 5. Your choice.

[MrMadguy]

martian, on 21 December 2024 - 01:26 PM, said:

There is no Tier 7, but if you do not do something, you could end up in Tier 5. Your choice.

Will it help? This is the biggest question for me now. Because if it won't - then there is no reason for me to keep playing. Tier 4 - is noob tier. Players with 0 skill should play here. If matches are so hard here, then why do you think Tier 5 would be better?

It's hard to show my old stats. Because we don't have any info about pre-Jarls era, except may be archived stats. My old W/L = 1190 / 1181, that make me think, that MM just always tries to keep W/L ~ 1. My old K/D = 1701 / 1549. See the difference? 1.1 vs 0.81.

May be screenshots from my old glory days could help?

Edited by MrMadguy, 21 December 2024 - 01:44 PM.