23 replies to this topic

[ARMHOLD MUSCLEHOGGER]

Two lobbing volleys of lrm's when only my upper torso was visible and I was moving to cover and twisting,....nearly all hit my right leg and blew it off (no ammo there- only slight visible damage elsewhere) This happens most of the time or I would chalk it up to aim bot which is prevalent these days. Ive heard the "its the nature of lrms" and "lrms have been nerved too much" rah rah excuses for this but its time to call out the real problem: A flaw in their design that is either purposeful or neglectful. PGI fix this crap and dont tell me to take AMS I do but that doesnt change the fact that they unbalance the game and have for years. Run tests on the hit reg on a moving target and you will see they all heat seek or lock on the legs and usually one leg.
Brawlers depend on positioning and ams to counter this but when the lrms act like streaks with aim bot, cmon.

Edited by ARMHOLD MUSCLEHOGGER, 22 August 2025 - 10:19 AM.

[KursedVixen]

would you rather they hit your head?

Funny because it seems to me that thunderbolts go directly for the CT

[Saved By The Bell]

Its not true. This crap weapon hits random.

(from LRM user)

[epikt]

ARMHOLD MUSCLEHOGGER, on 22 August 2025 - 10:19 AM, said:

I was moving to cover

That's why.
If you're moving away from the missiles, they might not track you fast enough and will "miss" your torso, and hit the legs instead.
Same if you're using jumpjets.

[Tesunie]

epikt, on 22 August 2025 - 11:32 AM, said:

That's why.
If you're moving away from the missiles, they might not track you fast enough and will "miss" your torso, and hit the legs instead.
Same if you're using jumpjets.

I've recently seen a non-jumping Urbanmech dodge an entire volley of Artemis LRMs by walking along a slightly upward winding path, perpendicular to me... All LRMs kept eating the dirt behind him.

LRMs need better tracking I feel, but it's a delicate balance between too much and not enough with this weapon.

One of the best ways to avoid LRMs is to move horizontal to the launcher and move upwards (either via terrain or jumping), or by moving directly forwards (maybe to a slight side angle) and hoping the missile shoot over your head.

It was actually funny that we've had some mechs with missile velocity tuned so high before that the LRMs couldn't hit their target, as they sailed over the target's head due to lack of tracking strength vs the high velocity. (Recent Black Lanner comes to mind.)

[Tesunie]

Saved By The Bell, on 22 August 2025 - 11:05 AM, said:

Its not true. This crap weapon hits random.

(from LRM user)

LRMs have a spread mechanic, and attempt to home in on the units CT. The target's movement can throw this off, on top of spread making it so all the missiles will rarely/never hit only the CT.

You want truly random hit location? Try SSRMs. Those aim for the "bones" of a mech, which is a random part of the mech. Be it arms, legs, or a section of torso, SSRMs randomize which spot it's aiming for.

[Saved By The Bell]

I have the impression, that many players think, they are so cool, so they don't need armor on legs. In such cases LRM can hit badly.

[LordNothing]

they only hit legs if you run away from them inline with trajectory. maybe a little lateral motion is needed.

[ARMHOLD MUSCLEHOGGER]

KursedVixen, on 22 August 2025 - 10:25 AM, said:

would you rather they hit your head?

Funny because it seems to me that thunderbolts go directly for the CT

WHEN DUMB QUESTIONS FOLLOW GOOD QUESTIONS, YOUR JUST TROLLING.

[ARMHOLD MUSCLEHOGGER]

Saved By The Bell, on 23 August 2025 - 12:27 AM, said:

I have the impression, that many players think, they are so cool, so they don't need armor on legs. In such cases LRM can hit badly.

Thats an ignorant response. Had you asked I would tell you I was in a mad 4hp with fully armored everything and ams. Also, as another example, today I was charging the last mech on the enemy team who was way out in open water in a bane lrm boat. I seemed to have the most armor so I drew his fire while moving straight at him in the water. So by the bogus logic of "you were moving away" why did they all,...yes all hit only my legs? Is the new excuse, "dont be moving away or forwards or sideways to cover"?! PGI is lying to you saying that "its the dynamics of the missiles" Its just not. The only way this is happening so frequently is rampant aimbot use exploiting the flaw and making it more common,..or its just being magnified by the ridiculous lrm boats you can build today. Thunderbolts dont seem to do that and act as they should. Atms however do the same exact thing. So either PGI is incompetent in thier balance/weapon management, or incompetent in curving rapidly increasing aimbot use taking advantage of this flaw in the system.

[ARMHOLD MUSCLEHOGGER]

LordNothing, on 23 August 2025 - 07:40 AM, said:

they only hit legs if you run away from them inline with trajectory. maybe a little lateral motion is needed.

Ive heard it all...dont run backwards, run sideways, run forward, run backwards, run up little hills, jump over them, next someone will say just stand still. The OP calls out that the percentage of missile hits on legs is 90% no matter what you do other than not moving and hiding behind terrain. As far as, " I saw an urbie run up a hill,.." comment.... Im not saying no mech has ever outrun or dodged them, Im saying when they hit, they hit the legs 90% of the time. Today's incident was 100% all leg registration on a flat surface running straight at the enemy in an assault (mad4hp). same height at the bane, no cover to use or in the way.

Saved By The Bell, on 22 August 2025 - 11:05 AM, said:

Its not true. This crap weapon hits random.

(from LRM user)

no basis for your argument or explanation of your point is its own clear reason for it, your an lrm pilot taking advantage of it. so what value does the adult version of "na ahhh" do to help?

[ARMHOLD MUSCLEHOGGER]

Tesunie, on 22 August 2025 - 11:47 AM, said:

I've recently seen a non-jumping Urbanmech dodge an entire volley of Artemis LRMs by walking along a slightly upward winding path, perpendicular to me... All LRMs kept eating the dirt behind him.

LRMs need better tracking I feel, but it's a delicate balance between too much and not enough with this weapon.

One of the best ways to avoid LRMs is to move horizontal to the launcher and move upwards (either via terrain or jumping), or by moving directly forwards (maybe to a slight side angle) and hoping the missile shoot over your head.

It was actually funny that we've had some mechs with missile velocity tuned so high before that the LRMs couldn't hit their target, as they sailed over the target's head due to lack of tracking strength vs the high velocity. (Recent Black Lanner comes to mind.)

None of that addresses the flaw in a flat face to face strike when no cover is present. "Just run lateral up a hill" to counter a broken mechanic ignors and empowers the flaw to not be fixed. Sure when the kids act up set them in front of a tv or tablet with a bowl of crappy cereal,..it works but does it help resolve whats going on with the kids? yeah, no.

[Saved By The Bell]

Still LRM is only team support weapon. LRM pilot cant do anything alone so LRMs attacks shouldn't be your most problem.

[Ilfi]

Saved By The Bell, on 23 August 2025 - 12:27 AM, said:

I have the impression, that many players think, they are so cool, so they don't need armor on legs. In such cases LRM can hit badly.

...but what if we ARE that cool? Lord knows I've been getting away with half leg armor on all my Heavy/Assault setups for years now.

[Tesunie]

ARMHOLD MUSCLEHOGGER, on 10 September 2025 - 12:04 AM, said:

So either PGI is incompetent in thier balance/weapon management, or incompetent in curving rapidly increasing aimbot use taking advantage of this flaw in the system.

I removed the rest, as I am not addressing those points (or at least not right now).

LRMs, SSRMs and ATMs (all homing weapons that require locks) would not benefit from Aimbot usage, unless you are claiming a homing weapon is an aimbot which would be... grossly inaccurate to the typical implications of what the term "aimbot" normally holds...

To understand what is happening, you would need to go into a deep dive of how the system currently works. I've so far only glossed over the basics of the system here. The short summary is that LRMs/ATMs home in on the CT of a mech, but has spread applied to the missiles so it's not all LRMs hitting only the CT. The larger the launcher, the more they spread. At one point, the more missiles being fired, the more they spread (not sure if that is still in, considering GH shuts down mega large volleys most times).

The more complex part is homing strength, which is how agile the missiles are. The game gives each missile group the ability to turn so much at given points along their flight path to seek a target. If you can move faster than that ability to turn enough, the missiles can't hit you. The specific points to home in was implemented to stop "orbiting" missiles, which at one point we had missiles which, if they missed, would orbit the mech they are tracking, but unable to turn enough to actually hit, so they would orbit until either the mech moved enough to bring the orbit into collision, or the missile traveled to it's max distance and detonated harmlessly. (We also at one point had it where Artemis hit only the head component of mechs... which was very short lived.)

Then we also have angle of flight path and velocity, which also can impact how well the missiles hit...

AKA: There is a lot going on behind homing missiles, and none of it has to do with aimbots. If LRMs feel like they are all impacting one component, first I highly doubt it is as LRMs typically feel like wet noodle throwers now than how they use to work in the past, and second their own internal mechanics don't permit it. Keep in mind, I'm also still going very light on the true mechanics of how LRMs function. There is a lot going on with them...

ARMHOLD MUSCLEHOGGER, on 10 September 2025 - 12:21 AM, said:

None of that addresses the flaw in a flat face to face strike when no cover is present. "Just run lateral up a hill" to counter a broken mechanic ignors and empowers the flaw to not be fixed. Sure when the kids act up set them in front of a tv or tablet with a bowl of crappy cereal,..it works but does it help resolve whats going on with the kids? yeah, no.

Your... child raising advice aside... Many of us here are trying to relay what could be happening within your OP (Original Post). I am going to quote it here for relevance:

ARMHOLD MUSCLEHOGGER, on 22 August 2025 - 10:19 AM, said:

Two lobbing volleys of lrm's when only my upper torso was visible and I was moving to cover and twisting,....nearly all hit my right leg and blew it off (no ammo there- only slight visible damage elsewhere) This happens most of the time or I would chalk it up to aim bot which is prevalent these days. Ive heard the "its the nature of lrms" and "lrms have been nerved too much" rah rah excuses for this but its time to call out the real problem: A flaw in their design that is either purposeful or neglectful. PGI fix this crap and dont tell me to take AMS I do but that doesnt change the fact that they unbalance the game and have for years. Run tests on the hit reg on a moving target and you will see they all heat seek or lock on the legs and usually one leg.
Brawlers depend on positioning and ams to counter this but when the lrms act like streaks with aim bot, cmon.

Here you mention cover being used. LRMs arch higher when fired with no LoS. If you have a leg facing them, that leg is more likely to take damage than the other leg, due to how it is facing. If you are moving to one side (perpendicular to the shooter), then the missiles are more likely to trail behind you, hitting legs more than torso.

However, you also mentioned that you were "standing out in the open, charging straight at the LRM user"... which is not the information you posted in your OP. In this case, unless your opponent is blind firing their LRMs (shooting without a lock, predicting where you will be when they get there), a homing missile is more likely to hit your torso in this case, with of course some splash damage to other components happening due to how missile spread works.

So, with your shifting tales, either your not being completely truthful about what happened, you are recalling different situations without separating them out for us to respond to, or... I don't know what. However, we were not there in the match with you. Unless you have a video of the match in question, we can not assist you much with analysis of why something might have happened. We can only speculate at this time.

And for the record, no. I'm not saying you are making things up. I've seen enough strange things happen over the years I've played this game to not refute that something strange could have happened. But without more evidence, I can not not respond with much more than I already have. (Unless you want a complete break down on how LRMs function, their relationship with locks, Tag, NARC, (L)AMS, ECM, etc...)

Edited by Tesunie, 10 September 2025 - 01:27 PM.

[Khosumi]

Tesunie, on 22 August 2025 - 11:47 AM, said:

I've recently seen a non-jumping Urbanmech dodge an entire volley of Artemis LRMs by walking along a slightly upward winding path, perpendicular to me... All LRMs kept eating the dirt behind him.

LRMs need better tracking I feel, but it's a delicate balance between too much and not enough with this weapon.

One of the best ways to avoid LRMs is to move horizontal to the launcher and move upwards (either via terrain or jumping), or by moving directly forwards (maybe to a slight side angle) and hoping the missile shoot over your head.

It was actually funny that we've had some mechs with missile velocity tuned so high before that the LRMs couldn't hit their target, as they sailed over the target's head due to lack of tracking strength vs the high velocity. (Recent Black Lanner comes to mind.)

Just use artemis?

[Tesunie]

Khosumi, on 14 September 2025 - 05:39 AM, said:

Just use artemis?

In my example, I was. I had Artemis CLRM15s, shooting at that Urbanmech, and none of the missiles hit for several volleys. Thankfully, I also pack lasers and other direct fire weapons and don't boat LRMs... but the point still stands that LRMs can be evaded, and they with LoS and Artemis, they really shouldn't be that easy to evade. But moving horizontally and at a slight upward angle drove all the missles into the dirt just behind the Urbanmech's feet. (I'm sure a couple here or there likely did hit, but not really all that much.)

[ARMHOLD MUSCLEHOGGER]

Tesunie, on 10 September 2025 - 01:15 PM, said:

I removed the rest, as I am not addressing those points (or at least not right now).

LRMs, SSRMs and ATMs (all homing weapons that require locks) would not benefit from Aimbot usage, unless you are claiming a homing weapon is an aimbot which would be... grossly inaccurate to the typical implications of what the term "aimbot" normally holds...

To understand what is happening, you would need to go into a deep dive of how the system currently works. I've so far only glossed over the basics of the system here. The short summary is that LRMs/ATMs home in on the CT of a mech, but has spread applied to the missiles so it's not all LRMs hitting only the CT. The larger the launcher, the more they spread. At one point, the more missiles being fired, the more they spread (not sure if that is still in, considering GH shuts down mega large volleys most times).

The more complex part is homing strength, which is how agile the missiles are. The game gives each missile group the ability to turn so much at given points along their flight path to seek a target. If you can move faster than that ability to turn enough, the missiles can't hit you. The specific points to home in was implemented to stop "orbiting" missiles, which at one point we had missiles which, if they missed, would orbit the mech they are tracking, but unable to turn enough to actually hit, so they would orbit until either the mech moved enough to bring the orbit into collision, or the missile traveled to it's max distance and detonated harmlessly. (We also at one point had it where Artemis hit only the head component of mechs... which was very short lived.)

Then we also have angle of flight path and velocity, which also can impact how well the missiles hit...

AKA: There is a lot going on behind homing missiles, and none of it has to do with aimbots. If LRMs feel like they are all impacting one component, first I highly doubt it is as LRMs typically feel like wet noodle throwers now than how they use to work in the past, and second their own internal mechanics don't permit it. Keep in mind, I'm also still going very light on the true mechanics of how LRMs function. There is a lot going on with them...



Your... child raising advice aside... Many of us here are trying to relay what could be happening within your OP (Original Post). I am going to quote it here for relevance:


Here you mention cover being used. LRMs arch higher when fired with no LoS. If you have a leg facing them, that leg is more likely to take damage than the other leg, due to how it is facing. If you are moving to one side (perpendicular to the shooter), then the missiles are more likely to trail behind you, hitting legs more than torso.

However, you also mentioned that you were "standing out in the open, charging straight at the LRM user"... which is not the information you posted in your OP. In this case, unless your opponent is blind firing their LRMs (shooting without a lock, predicting where you will be when they get there), a homing missile is more likely to hit your torso in this case, with of course some splash damage to other components happening due to how missile spread works.

So, with your shifting tales, either your not being completely truthful about what happened, you are recalling different situations without separating them out for us to respond to, or... I don't know what. However, we were not there in the match with you. Unless you have a video of the match in question, we can not assist you much with analysis of why something might have happened. We can only speculate at this time.

And for the record, no. I'm not saying you are making things up. I've seen enough strange things happen over the years I've played this game to not refute that something strange could have happened. But without more evidence, I can not not respond with much more than I already have. (Unless you want a complete break down on how LRMs function, their relationship with locks, Tag, NARC, (L)AMS, ECM, etc...)

Im sorry you got a little confused there. In the second example I clearly had the line "as another example".
As you were speed reading my post (likely because you disagreed with it and wanted to give a snappy retort) you seemed to have missed the point and instead threw out a bunch of wonderful LRM word salad that fits very closely with what PGI says. Thanks, Ive read their explanations and responses to similar complaints already.

Selective bias. You believe the LRMS are acting as they should. Slow hand clap for being able to know all the lrm mechanics (OR copying and pasting lrm data). Again thats just how the are SUPPOSED to work.

In response to your "your either not being completely truthful or not separating different situations..." comment. That as you say involves "shifting tales" I again refer to my clear statement of "as another example" which leaves you calling me essentially a liar.
This is against the rules of this forum. Im going to have to assume that your snarky insulting response that you took such lengthy effort to find fault with seems to have fallen a bit flat. Are you PGI? Did you write code for this game? Are you a Big fan of PGI and got mad for some reason? I can list all the many elements to LRM that has been posted by PGI over the years so I really dont think you need to but thanks.

So, my suggestion is, slow down, make sure you read what is written, ask questions if you think Im being "shifty" or "not being completely truthful" try staying away from vomiting bias before asking questions. I will be recording a series of videos to show exactly what I was referring to in my multiple and separate examples you couldn't separate for some reason.

I dont think your being shifty or lying. Lets stay away from not being friends eh? Lets all come home for the big win and see if what is going on with LRMS is an honestly unsolvable problem with the programming that has been swept under the rug, or maybe, god forbid, an overlooked issue that can be fixed on a reduced budget.

[Saved By The Bell]

Bro, game about position and concentrated firepower. In best cases you can kill enemy in 1 shot. Lrms cant do it.
Just look for some rock and you ll be safe.

Edited by Saved By The Bell, 10 October 2025 - 08:52 AM.

[Duke Falcon]

Oh-kaaay...

I accomplished the latest loot bags event entirely with LURMboats. Why? Just for fun and because lrms are so damn bad that running lurmers in T3 and upward is usually self shot in the crotch... Or so said...

Never saw ankle-biting rains of lurms, sorry. My ones usually rained all over the target, cover them like a good... 'Kay, CoC non-violating mode activated...
So, yeah, they cover the target IF locked and IF you maintain the lock. You or someone else (either actively target it or just kept them in their LoS). If the lock brakes the lurms go dumb. Even if the target not moves they tend to act stupid. Exception? If they were shot by direct LoS. Sometimes even LoS dumbfire works (it's a "Hey there, sniper!").
But I never ever experienced that lurms specifically went for legs. Maybe SRMs when they need to get some light?
And as many mentioned above: LRMs are frickin' easy to evade. Sometimes even if you got NARC'd. LRMs are bad weapons if U solo, better in a team with dedicated supporters. But any other weapons are just outperform them vastly (even ATMs what is a strange thing).
Personally I think the best weapons are ACs (LBX for close brawl, Ultras for any other situations) and PPCs. U use LRMs only for fun or to correct your PSR\tier (this were sarcasm, PSR will correct itself after your performance no matter what).
So, yeah, LRM+SRM boat Bane for everyone! <= Harder to use than you may think, most targets outrun you and your SRMs... I know, I tried...